are you sure that cardboard is porous enough to let the roses get water when it rains?

Honestly, I just use snapshot ( or any pre emergent) and cover with Lowe's brown mulch. That's it. Stays 90% weed free. I still have to pull a few here and there, but I think it's weed seed blown in from the neighbors yard. I like the idea of the cardboard though! Never thought of that. Sounds like a great idea! I tried using those coconut mat rings, they did OK, but I didn't like how they looked. Then again, I did just flop them over the base of things w/o much care lol.

I've done the cardboard year after year in my front beds a d it is awesome ! Not to mention worms love it so it's just good all around . I'll be doing it in my new bed going in as well . Anything to get ahead of the weeds, and it's free !

Seil , you want to use plain cardboard and it'll be just fine , it breaks down pretty well and will let rain through

I do what you describe, rake it out ever 6mo, and re-do it. Lawnmower shreds the mulch/distributes it. Cardboard is either disinegrated, -ing, or I leave it in place if it is solid in the least.

I am reworking a big bed that I neglected for a few years. I had started out with good soil, kept adding horse compost - I raise horses so have lots - then put a great mix I get from a company who specializes in soil mixes near here. Still........a few years neglect and it is weed heaven. I am working on this bed now - it is mostly empty except for a few roses that are growing really well [so the early attention to soil must have helped]. What I have found that works for me is to surround the roses with a circle of those plastic "put together" edgers, you can get them in a box at Walmart. It surrounds the plant - allowing the water to go down to the roots rather than run off, and keeps mulch, fertilizer within the circle. I have 2 roses growing in that bed in these circles and they are doing great. What I am doing is, raking all the dead debirs [that I previously killed with roundup] out of the bed, weed eating the bed until it looks clean and neat, and putting round up on it again. Then, will plant my roses, put my circle around them, mulching first with horse compost then with mulch [putting on Mills Magic Rose Mix on top] then topping off with the pine bark mulch. Before I do this, yesterday I put down a layer of my horse compost over the whole bed and got a bunch of bags of Landscapers Mix from Lowes. This afternoon, going to spread those bags of mix on the bed. THEN I will plant my roses. When they are planted, I will come back with some of the heavier pine bark mulch and put in between the circles. If any weeds pop up, will carefully hand spray them, but will hand weed within the rose circles. This isn't as complicated as it may sound, and frankly - I don't think anything works if it is not tended to.......have to stay after it all the time. This bed used to be gorgeous - but I didn't stay with it and mulch, spray, weed as I should have. This time - am taking my time and doing it right. I might try the cardboard in between the rose circles, but not sure if I am up for cutting these up in little pieces. I will have plenty of cardboard from all the boxes of roses I have coming, ha ha! I am interested in this subject also and will enjoy hearing what has [or has not!] worked for others. Oh, and here is a tip I read in Paul Zimmerman's rose book. Put compost down before putting on mulch - something about putting nitrogen back in the soil.

Judith

Thanks for sharing your thoughts everyone.

Mulch is my best friend! I've made all of my new garden beds using the cardboard & mulch method. Means not having to remove any sod other than making a nice edge between the grass and the bed. Mind you it takes a year before you have a working garden, but it saves so much sod removal. I also top up mulch periodically. But now that my gardens are filling in, I don't really need any wood mulch. Now I top up around my plants with compost instead. The mulch kept the weeds at bay & helped retain moisture in the soil.

I am collecting newspapers these days so I will use them on the rose beds then top with mulch . Around the roses themselves I usually put a circle of manure/compost then top with pine needles . My lawn guy gets me the pine from a local place for $5 a roll . I do this every 2 or 3 months .Every time I am working with roses like watering/fertilizing/deadheading ,I pull any visible weeds with my hands or a weeding stick .

Thanks for the feedback everyone. It's no surprise that so many people use the cardboard method as it's one that has been discussed here several times. I find it to be very effective, hence why I've been saving up cardboard to use it for so long. Seil, from what I've seen, the cardboard actually helps with water retention. Unlike the plastic weed barrier, the cardboard lets water seep through. Also, by cutting the cardboard to fit around the roses, I create spaces where water runs down. I will, however, watch for dehydration from this point forward to see if there is an effect. Sarah, I wish my weeds were easy to control. I know that in my parents small flower bed in North Carolina that weeds aren't nearly as aggressive up there as they are here. I tried Preen and it was only effective for about a month before the weeks laughed at me every time I stepped out into the yard. Funny you mention "living mulch" felicity. I tried that out last year with lantanas, but the practically took over. It's a pity I had to tear them out because they did grow well. This year I'm going to try Geraniums and Vincas to see if they can buy my roses some time to mature and naturally drown out the weeds.

Has anyone ever had success with the recycled tire mulch?

Thanks for bringing up this topic. I had no idea that using cardboard as a weed suppressor was common. I never did it because I was afraid the roots would not get enough water or oxygen underneath the cardboard. Plus I worry that some of my shallow-rooting plants may not like it.

But I am curious: how much mulch do you actually put on top of the cardboard? I find that my mulch and compost tends to get strewn by wind and rain and even with a couple of inches of mulch the cardboard is bound to be very visible underneath. Also, what about compost? Just stack it on top of the cardboard or put it underneath and then put the cardboard on top? My mulch layer is usually a mix of a couple of inches of shredded wood and compost (wood every 2 years, compost twice a year on top and it slowly washes through the wood, leaving the layer mixed), and so if the compost goes underneath the cardboard it may look...funny.

I also worry about the cardboard shifting or popping up when you walk on it (my beds are pretty deep so I need to walk through them).

But hey--if it manages to help suppress that danged Oxalis I'll do almost anything! You complain about 5 months weed-free...well, that's most of the growing season around here!

I just saw "water savers" being offered by JP this morning - $14.95 for 1. The plastic edgers do the same thing for much less. Noticed that Ludwig's were using them too, they cut the bottom out of a bowl and put over new roses. But would have to cut bowl to get it off. Edgers snap apart. I am going to put the cardboard then horse compost on a bed I don't plan to plant for awhile. I have a book on the lasagna method and it is quite interesting and am sure it works. The only problem is the time factor. I am getting ready to dig out 3 long raised beds of daylilies, transplant them to another "made" bed, roundup the weeds, several times if needed, then build the soil back up.

The trouble with the cheap colored mulches which are heavily marketed by the big box places is that they are derived from hardwoods, and are primarily wood chips and chunks, not bark. As such, there is always the chance that some toxic hardwoods, like black walnuts, are used as the source of the mulch. The chemical, juglone, which is present in all parts of black walnut trees, will kill most plants with which it comes in contact. Black walnut trees are not the only toxic hardwood.

In addition, wood, not bark, decomposes extremely quickly. Now if your goal is to have your mulch turn quickly into compost, thereby enriching the soil, that is good. It no longer functions as a mulch though, but has now become part of the soil itself as a compost layer at the soil's surface. A layer of mulch is now needed above it.

Anything that decomposes slowly, or not at all is the ideal mulch.

I have found that softwood tree (evergreens), bark is the best mulch. The larger the chunk, the slower it decomposes. Pine bark, cypress bark, cedar bark, and if you can get/afford fir bark, are ideal mulch candidates. The resins they contain not only resist decay, but leach off chemicals that are both antibiotic and insecticidal in nature.

Hardwood mulch disappears by next year or even by fall of the same year it was applied in spring. Pine bark type mulches live on, only needing to be added to, topped off each year, to an optimal depth, usually about 2-2.5"

Finally, any mulch is better than none.

From what I have observed of the rubber mulches, they get really hot with sun and higher temps, cooking the soil beneath them and the plants they surround. I guess if you're looking to eliminate any growth in the area, they may be useful, but they ARE petroleum products. Personally, I wouldn't want it in my yard. Eventually it will begin to deteriorate, leaving its residue in the soil. If that isn't undesirable to you, go for it.

I get the Florimulch from Lowes. It's reasonable but not $1 a bag. That's a great price. I still buy the Florimulch because it's shredded melaleuca tree.

Again, great advice here!

I think I'll pass on the rubber mulch then. It's hard enough growing roses in my climate without adding insult to injury by cooking the roots.

I agree with your points Moses. I think I'll aim to covert my entire yard to Pine Bark Nuggets for the future. Right now I've applied it to my paths, but I think I'll slowly add it to my rose beds all around my yard.

PTW, The cardboard settles once you apply the mulch on top. It will shift if you walk on it, so I wouldn't recommend it for paths.

To the person who asked whether you put wood chip mulch and compost above or below the cardboard, I would say you should put the compost under the cardboard, and the wood chips over it just for aesthetics.

There's no need to rip up the cardboard every year, since it eventually decomposes and is good for the soil. The less you do to disturb the surface of the soil, the fewer annual weed seeds will come up into the sprouting zone. So every year or three as you desire, either add some more of the wood chip or bark mulch on top, or rake away the intact chips, add another layer or two of cardboard, and cover back over with chips.

If your garden gets enough rain or water, then the cardboard won't block water from your plants (don't use cardboard coated with something water resistant, of course!) If your rain is minimal and you want to minimize sprinkling, you can shape the soil and compost before covering with cardboard, so that the cardboard will slope down slightly towards each plant. But then you might get ridges of cardboard poking through the mulch so don't don't do too much.

Don't worry about the cardboard blocking oxygen -- it doesn't seem to be a problem, as everyone's experience is mostly that the earthworms and other oxygen-loving life thrive under the cardboard. Some people even use a plastic layer and it doesn't seem to cause a problem under it.

One thing to avoid for sure is non-decomposable landscape fabrics covered with mulch. After a few years, there will be weeds or shoots from your desired plants growing through the fabric and it becomes impossible to pull. Some of them break down into unattractive shreds of yucky dirty plastic fibrous stuff. Just don't do it Cardboard is better, and is free behind any big store.

In my experience cardboard decomposes very quickly in the rainy months. And I totally agree that non-biodegradable landscape fabric is to be AVOIDED!

I use free mulch from the tree companies. While I suppose there is a possibility that they might bring black walnut mulch with disastrous consequences, it is a chance I've taken and I've never had any adverse consequences. They bring several truckloads a year, whenever I ask. Tree companies appreciate doing this as many times they have to pay to dump their wood chips.

I sprinkle a little nitrogen fertilizer on top of the mulch when I finish distributing the mulch in my gardens.

I have had great success with newspaper with mulch on it in the past. Currently trying using live oak leaves, as I don't have the budget to mulch the big 50 x 25 bed at the new house but have all the oak leaves I could want.

Someone commented on a Toro blower/shredder - never heard of one of those - I too have a lot of oak leaves, going to check this device out.

Google oak leaf mulch grumpy gardener and he suggests a shredder designed for mulching leaves that runs about 150.

You can relax about the black walnut tree mulch as roses are not sensitive to juglone. I garden in black walnut land. Every bed I have is either in the root zone or under the canopy of one. Fall can be dangerous around here when winds are high. Baseball sized walnut flying thru the air. Even the plants that I have that may be far enough away from the tree are not safe. My squirrels will bury at least one walnut for each plant out there. They never plant in between the plants but always in it's roots by the base.

Anyway if ones wishes to they can look up what plants are sensitive to the juglone. I used to refer to the list yearly before planting. Haven't done so in a while now. Darn, I can see what the problem is with the hydrangea's.

My experience has been that roses are TOLERANT, not immune to the toxic effects of the chemical juglone, produced by all parts of our native black walnut trees.

Therefore, I steer clear of hardwood mulch, and advise others to do so too, unless the tree species from which the mulch is derived can be confirmed to not be from black walnut trees, in part or in whole. There are additional reasons why I do not recommend using the readily available dyed hardwood mulches, as I stated a few responses earlier.

I made a very big mistake last spring when I decided to break with my annual tradition of brown mulch over newspaper. I started collecting cardboard boxes which wasn't hard because my house is always getting packages in the mail. I also noticed that Home Depot was selling bags of pine nuggets that looked great and where much easier to lug around than the mulch I had regularly used.

I'm not sure if it was the cardboard being too thin, or the fact that the pine nuggets were less dense but the weeds were horrible within 2 months. Mulch has a real hefty weight to it that smothers weeds beautifully and that's the only thing I will ever use again. This year I started hoarding newspapers in February and I'll be buying my mulch pretty soon. I hate weeds!!!!!

Much of what will work depends upon your amount of rain. In Newhall and Encino, cardboard and newspaper under anything, didn't break down except where I watered heavily. Neither area received a lot of rain in those years. Another thing I've noticed when the rainfall has been lighter, weed cloth, newspaper and cardboard have all provided EXCELLENT habitat for enormous ant colonies. All three materials seemed to afford the colonies perfect "ceilings", under which to form their habitats. There is weed cloth in this yard (inherited in the hour purchase) and everywhere it's being exposed and I begin trying to remove it, I find massive ant colonies. Fortunately, there are several sources of rather inexpensive ammonia and I have been mixing it by the bucketful to pour into areas to kill the ants. The dogs aren't attracted to the ammonia; it kills the ants and should, eventually, hopefully, break down into some form of ammonia. It only requires about a tablespoon of it per gallon to do the job.

Do it without the cardboard. I suppose you could use newspaper as an alternative, it works to keep weeds out but I have never used it around my plants. Also, I tend to stay away from red mulch because it is died. I know that dies (such as food coloring) can effect the coloring of some flowers (or change the color completely), but I am not sure if this is true for roses. I also don't like the way that it turns light orange after several months. I prefer cedar mulch, which is the same thing as the "red mulch" but without the red die. I have also used pine bark nuggets, and they seem to do a good job as well.

I'm sorry Moses I meant no offense. Perhaps I typed that to quickly before heading out the door. I wasn't sure if anyone other than myself had black walnut trees in their back yard. Hate those trees and they are in a spot where the tree service can't get to them.

No offense taken, Patty. I am very fond of black walnut trees and their nuts, actually.