LOL, re: double entendre. I guess the fact that I didn't even notice it in Carol's post until I read Ingrid's comment probably means that I am actually becoming a rose gardener!

It's looking GREAT! Me, I just like to let them grow big and do whatever they want to, so I am not probably a good advisor. I probably need this.

Love the creamy with a hint of coffee tones. Will be interesting to see how dark it gets when the weather cools down. The colouring sorta reminds me of the Cafe au lait dahlia.

I see that there are no photos of "Hubner Plot" at HMF. I wonder if some could be added?

I somehow ended up looking at a very similar-looking (to my tired eyes, at any rate) Aussie foundling called "Blanche Roberts". Have a look if you're curious.

Cheers.

Virginia

To me, that looks a bit more like Anna Olivier . . .

Hi Virginia. When I bought Hubner Plot at the Sacramento Cemetary last spring (at your wonderful recommendation Jeri), there wasn’t an HMF listing for it, so I posted photos of it under Rubens since that was the consensus of what it probably was. I would be happy to post some photos under the new Hubner Plot HMF listing in spring since it’s probably going to sleep for the months of December and January. :-)

Jeri, yes, I think the Aussie rose is supposed to be 'Anna Olivier' or a sport thereof. I think they look alike, but what do I know?

Cori Ann, I added the "Hubner Plot" record to HMF last May; I can't reassign the photo you posted to the 'Rubens' record. Probably a glitch, but maybe because it isn't my photo?

If anyone has photos of la belle "Hubner Plot" that they can post to HMF, that would be swell.

Cheers.

Virginia

Cori Ann -- I wish you would. That Rubens ID may be correct (what do I know?) but I really like to preserve study name information.

Virginia -- Hang on. I can post some photos from the day we collected it in Stockton.

The little plant here that I got in the spring has been out-growing everything else acquired at the same time. In our killer winds, it kept blowing over -- thus -- DUH -- telling me it needed potting up. It looks very perky, now, in a 7-G pot.

OK. Y'all got HMF photos:
http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=2.78581

I didn’t save these pics from a few months ago, but was able to save some from his thread and upload them to HMF too. :-)

Y'all are amazing!

:>)

Hey Virginia, that is my line. Lol Ahem....all you guys are amazing !

That includes you too Virginia... lol

Thank you for being outstanding, rosarians.

Jin

Thanks for doing that, Cori Ann. Your photos really show what the fully open bloom looks like!

Thanks again for recommending it Jeri.

Regardless of what it actually is (Hubner Plot, Rubens or another), after almost a year, my “Hubner Plot / Rubens” band, bought from the Sacramento Cemetery, got to be about 8 feet tall with several thick canes. Lots of new, thick basals. Also... it definitely seems like it has the habit of a climber to me. Meaning there’s obvious main canes and laterals, it drapes well, reaches for the sky, is a vigorous grower, and seems to be trainable.

I have noticed how fast it’s growing compared to other new bands all year, but after really inspecting it while pruning, I decided I’m definitely going to grow it as a climber. I’m going to pull it to the side and start training it laterally.

Curious if anyone else is trying that... and if it is a climber, does that change the ideas about ID?

I hope this one can make its way to the nurseries soon. Its such a subtle beauty. I need this rose.

Sultry you can get Rubens from A Reverence for Roses... https://www.areverenceforroses.com/Rubens-roses-p/rubens.htm

they have 1 in stock. ;-)

From Tea Roses; Old Roses for Warm Climates. Just in case this is helpful for anyone. Fantastic book by the way! Everyone in warm climates should have it! I will also post to HMF under Hubner Plot and Rubens.

Seems as though it could also be Laurette, Archimedes, or several others? Who knows. Whatever I have... I REALLY love it! I will take some good photos of canes, thorns, buds, hips, blooms, foliage, etc as it matures to help others solve the ID mystery. :-)

Cori Ann thank you so much for suggestion. I have no books on roses. So, this is a start for me. Thanks again. Any more suggestions or recommendations will help also.

Jin

If you're going to look for Rubens from Reverence, check to see what their source was. Be sure it wasn't "Hubner Plot." That sort of thing happens a lot.

Great advice. Or maybe make sure it was Hubner Plot if you want one like mine. :-)

That's why I think study names should always accompany the plant. I know of one Found Rose that has been in commerce under two different names. Me, I'd stick with "Samuel Briggs #1" and put the suggested IDs in parentheses.

Thanks Jeri and Cori Ann. I will check it out. I just noticed that Rose Petals Nursery also lists Rubens.

~Sjn

Cori Ann, it's probably a little before "your time", but there was a time when Bob Edberg of Limberlost Roses felt Grandmother's Hat WAS Mrs. R.G. Sharman-Crawford, based upon an old illustration from one of his old rose books. (He not only sold many old rose books, started Limberlost Roses but also created a series of rose books). He sold GH under the Mrs. R.G. Sharman-Crawford name and it got picked up by a number of nurseries and distributed as Mrs. S-C. It became a self fulfilling issue with folks being certain they MUST be the same rose as they had received the same rose from different sources under both names.

Yup. We got our first GH directly from Bob, as 'Mrs. R.G. Sharman-Crawford'. We showed it under that name, and won several Victorian Awards.

Then, someone said, no -- that it was 'Cornet' -- a much earlier introduction. So we showed it as 'Cornet' for a while, and won several Dowager Queen trophies.

Then, several people said it couldn't be that.

So, then we showed it under the original Study Name: "Grandmother's Hat" -- and won a few more Victorian Awards.

By that time, we were trying to point out to judges that there was a problem, in that the same rose was being shown in the same rose shows under all three names. NO ONE wanted to know that. <SIGH>

Therein lies my insistence that all of the names a rose has traveled under should remain "attached" to it, barring (and even after) definitive identification.

Wouldn't it be delightful if some enterprising, tech-savvy person would develop an iPhone and Android app which would accomplish a DNA analysis of plant tissue from a scan?

Well, I will take lots of helpful photos for ID-ing, but leave the identifying to you ID-savvy people. :-) I will just grow it, train it, cut it, make arrangements with it and photograph it incessantly.

Hubner Plot, cut and in a prepping bucket with Elsie Watson rhododendrons, old fashioned red fragrant carnations, sweet peas and sea lavender. :-) Not arranged yet, but it all looks quite nice as it is!

Indeed it does look nice as it is.

Cath

Cori Ann, how tall is your HubnerPlot/Rubens now? Mine is trying to get big. I just repotted it yesterday. I am debating on if it will be growing as a climber and if I should just stick it in the ground lol. Hmf doesn't seem to say how tall or wide it will grow.

Yeah I’m growing it as a short climber, but it has a really pretty natural growth habit so it doesn’t necessarily need to be trained if you allow it room. I cut it back when I pruned all my others in January even though the general consensus is not to prune teas, especially not when they’re new. It just seemed like it needed it, so I pruned it back fairly hard. It’s back up to about 5 feet already. I also trimmed it back again early spring as I was training and tying it to a trellis. I’m keeping it at about 5-6 feet by trimming, cutting for indoors, etc.

The old mother plant was easily 7-8 ft. tall (but pruned as a standard) so I can see it being either a very tall bush or possibly a climber.

Wow Cori Ann, yours does seem vigorous. Mine is very erect and sturdy on the older wood base. The new growth is of course, softer. For a young plant it holds itself up very well.

Jeri, thank you for the size information on Hubner Plot. I wish they could let it grow how it wants to instead of trimming up the bottom. I suppose they need to mow under them?

I have some info from A Reverence for Roses about their Rubens sources. Don wrote that they have two Rubens mother plants. One was purchased from The Tallahassee Rose Society sale held at The Goodwin Rose Museum in Tallahassee, Florida. The other mother plant they have is from Rose Petals Nursery. They got them about 6 to 8 yrs ago. He wasn't sure which mother plant my cutting came from. If anyone ever has anything they want to ask A Reverence for Roses about don't hesitate because they are so nice!

Does anyone happen to know where Rose Petals Nursery got their Rubens mother plant?

~Sjn

It's possible that she might have gotten it from the Sacramento City Cemetery. And the source of their plant is listed as "Carl Luhn/Malcolm Manners" -- which I take to mean that Carl got it from Malcolm, and subsequently donated it.

Sjn -- I agree with you. And it's funny. They haven't done that to every plant. In fact, most are growing naturally (and beautifully):

Here's 'Archduke Charles' -- growing fairly close to where Hubner is.

And a lovely 'Safrano'

And 'Duchesse de Brabant'

So who knows why they do such things?

I was disappointed the first time I tried to find this rose on HMF, so thank you Jeri and Cori Ann for adding all the pictures and info on Hubner Plot now.

Thank you, Jeri, for the info on Rose Petals. It will be interesting to see how mine looks once it starts blooming. It has had a few blooms but we were having crazy whacky wild weather. Lots of wind and even hail. So they got too beat up to evaluate. I will post photos here once it really gets going.

How odd that all those other beautiful roses get to grow freely at the cemetary and poor Hubner Plot doesn't. I feel kinda sad for the mommy plant now.

I always love your puppy photos :)

Wonderful! Jessie Hildreth?

Yes. This is "Jesse Hildreth".

A few comments. First of all, we have a couple of Hubner Plot plants left over from the sale. If you can get to Sacramento, let me know - or I could bring one down for the Celebration of Old Roses in Albany.

Secondly, about pruning up. Some of it is maintenance - including a fear that SOMETHING or SOMEONE could be hiding underneath a plant - but some of it is aesthetics. They think that roses should have bare legs because all they know are Hybrid Teas. They think that rosemary and salvia and other plants should be pruned into lollipops because they are cuter that way. It's hard to change such notions.

I hope local rose lovers see this and snatch up the remaining Hubner Plot roses! It is SUCH a fantastic rose. Vigorous, fragrant, beautiful, graceful, and handles the heat SO WELL! For comparison, I got Jesse Hildreth about the same time and here are the two currently (about a year or so in my yard)

Hubner Plot. Please forgive the trellis, I made it level instead of level to the fence (which is slanted down to the grade of the yard). I will probably fix it in time. Or I will just let Hubner Plot fill it in and hide it.

Jesse Hildreth (not saying anything bad about it, just showing how much of a difference compared to Hubner Plot)! So tiny.

Yeah. Hubner does take off faster.

Hubner Plot has freckles and green eyes... and I love freckles and green eyes. :-)

Please ignore any mildew, pests or other detractors. I do.

I took a display of cemetery roses to last Saturday's rose show, and several roses held up really well in the vase. I just tossed them today, five days after the show. Hubner Plot and Mons Tillier were the only two that still looked good. Another bonus!

And they’re beautifully fragrant. :-)

I've been reading your comments for about a year now and finally decided to try my hand with the old roses. I bought my first old roses at the Sacramento City Cemetery a few weeks ago and I purchased a Hubner Plot. I'm glad to see the color but also the size! I now know where I'll be planting it. Thank you, Cori Ann. I also purchased a Pink Gruss an Aachen which had its first bloom and smelled lovely! I couldn't stop with just that and got a Miriam Wilkins, Belinda's Dream and Apricot Nectar. They're my new babies so we'll see how they do. Thanks everyone for such wonderful pictures and information! Patti

Patti I hope these work out well for you!

Hubner Plot (possibly Rubens) has been blooming like this non stop since early April, maybe even late March? As the heat intensifies, it just blooms more and the blooms seem to get even better! The petals are substantial and feel almost like gardenia petals they’re so thick and a bit waxy, but also somehow look delicate. Absolutely gorgeous!

Green eyes. Love them!

A little mildew here, but not bad at all. Very graceful and beautiful. I love it!

Yours looks so happy with all those blooms! I love the blushed center around the green eye. So pretty!

I can't pot mine up fast enough. A few weeks after I repot, it grows roots right out the bottom of the pot lol. Delicate blossoms on a beast of a plant lol.

I’m excited to see some photos of this one from others! It’s such a wonderful rose.