It’s hard to get a clear picture with everything I have up there. Evelyn’s long canes are about 6F long, and he cut the front canes to about 2-3F long. Lisa

Lisa, I think I would go ahead and start training what you have. You'll be that much ahead when Evelyn throws out her next canes. Also, if the support is already there, the new canes will tend to be easier to train into place. It's possible that Evelyn will react to her partial pruning by sending up more canes, and if they are immediately given the opportunity to climb, they will tend to lean on the support and grow longer than if they were whipping about in the wind.

John

I too would keep what she has left. Feeling for you.

I agree, wrap what you have and the rest will catch up

Someone has to raise the question. Is Javier quite right in the head? You've been telling and showing us awfully incompetent stuff he's been doing in your garden. This last with short and long canes seems surpassingly strange. If he hires out to others, are they satisfied with his work?

I had a guy do this to my roses in Alaska without permission. He was my babysitter's husband. It can be a guy thing I think to go kamikaze. I hope I'm not a sexist pig. I would ask him to stay away from my roses for sure. I could not handle too much of this.

Thanks all. That’s the answer I was hoping to hear! I dreaded the thought of cutting away more growth. Hopefully the weather forecast is correct, and we’ll get rain tomorrow. That should make it easier to remove those too short T posts, and sink something else in firmly.

Dara, I do know what you mean, but he IS “all there”. I’m finding that there’s a HUGE difference between a landscaper and a gardener. I’ve seen his work before in others yards, and it’s impressive. He’s more of a “mow and blow” kind of guy in the garden, who is excellent at building things, laying brick, tree trimming, irrigation installation, and cleanup jobs. He works fast and furious and doesn’t pay attention to “little stuff”, that’s in his way. He did a bunch of weeding while I was at Home Depot. He apparently cut back what was in his way. Jin gave me a great suggestion, yesterday. She suggested I use a translator app on my iPhone, to tell him not to remove any plants or cut anything back, under any circumstances. I’m definitely going to do that!

I know he’s not exactly ideal for everything, but his heart is in the right place, and frankly I can’t afford someone else. I’m just going to have to make it crystal clear through the translator what he may NOT do. I think that’s probably the best way to go about it. What do think? Lisa

I think that's a great idea lisa!

I know I am going to make tons of mistakes but Javier is super duper new. I don't think he understands the language of roses besides there is a language barrier.

Thank you for the compliment Lisa.. I am sure your sons might have a few friends who speaks Spanish or even talking on phone will be help. Meanwhile, I won't let him cut anything without you knowing. I usually use translator on phone. I deal with so many guests here from China, Brazil...all using translator to communicate with us. Isn't technology amazing :)

If he still do it then I think that falls totally different category. Wish you luck, my friend :)

Jin

I wonder if he was trimming the front ones thinking they would bloom at the tip and let the ones in the back to bloom? He may have thought that would make roses from the bottom to the top of the plant?

My stepdad cuts everything all the way back like a knockout, even the own root Ebb Tide I gave my mom.

Just wave your finger and shout ''No, no necessita !''... [No, not necessary]...

This is quite funny to me, as I have 2 Bolivian helpers who come visit occasionally, when I need fencing fixed, they only do fencing not gardening, but they trample over everything, pushing it all out of the way.. they do not speak a word of English [probably illegals if truth be told]...

...they understand me perfectly by my gestures and my un poquito bit of Spanish...

Oh no, Lisa! :-(

I know what you mean about certain types being more landscapers than gardeners... I have someone who comes to help me with the really heavy stuff and although he's very knowlegeable in general (esp about fruits & vegetables), he is much more "rough" and I find that every time he comes (esp with his 2 younger teenage helpers) - they stomp around in their big heavy boots and always manage to snap off things or step on things. They just never seem to look or give the same attention/care...

Last time, I was gutted as I was just waiting for my PAOK's first proper flush since I brought her home and she had all these beautiful fat buds on young, tender stems, JUST about to open... and these guys had to come and check the irrigation and in the process of climbing in & out of the beds, managed to snap off half of the buds. When I got upset, he just brushed it off and said "Don't worry - it'll grow back. The plant is fine." - and he's right, of course, but he doesn't understand the agony of waiting ages for the blooms to finally come... just to lose them at the last moment!!!

With regards to your Evelyn, I agree also to keep & train what you've got. I don't know if your climate is like mine but I've found that here in Perth, the new basal octopus canes grow SO quickly - most of mine have shot up from nothing to 4 - 5 feet in a couple of weeks, not kidding - so there really isn't any "catching up" to do at all. All the tall, long canes I'm currently having to train are not the ones I came home with 4 months ago but the new ones that have grown in the last month alone and which have already outgrown the "old" longest canes. So if your weather is like mine, you might find your other side catching up faster than you think!

Besides, I think it's nice to get an idea for the partial shape that it's going to become eventually, even with half the plant! :-)

~ HY

ps. speaking of Evelyn - I just had to share this! :-) My Evelyn is FINALLY having her first flush since I brought her home in Nov (she's been the slowest Austin - she's just been growing new basals while the others have been blooming) - the first bloom opened earlier this week and it's HUGE! :-) And really, really gorgeously fragrant - like, genuine "old rose" perfume. I had been bit disappointed with her and slightly regretting buying her... but now I'm impressed! :-) She's got several more coming - big candelabras on the ends of her new basals. Can't wait! :-)

Wow, isn't she beautiful! Well worth the wait.

Gorgeous Evelyn! Those are the kinds of blooms I got last summer, HY. I just love her, and was so sad to see those canes cut back. She has such giant blooms, light peach in the heat and pinker in the cooler weather.

I think part of the problem might have stemmed from him seeing that I had pruned my grafted Alnwick Castle Rose very far back to just a foot high or so. I’m sure he saw no harm in trimming back Evelyn a few feet to get her out of the way. My Alnwick has been there for years and has been a bit thin. It’s also grafted, and Evelyn is ownroot. For all I know he thought Evelyn was next for the same treatment.

Gotta run, more later. Lisa

Lisa, I think that's an inspired idea of Jin's. Javier, seems like a smart and capable person who's just used to a different kind of gardening, but thoroughly "trainable". The main factors, in addition to those, is that he is honest, reliable and kind and caring enough to recognize your needs. Those are much more important factors that don't seem to be easily taught. Not many people, especially not family or close friends would dream of doing what he has done gratis! He's a keeper in my book.

I completely, 100% agree with what vaporvac said.

I think it will help if you can show him- in pictures- what you want, so that he can help you as much as he- very clearly- wants to. I would advocate for this approach even if there weren't a language barrier, given how few modern landscapers have any notion of gardening beyond lawncare. You could do this quite cheaply by giving him some good seed, bulb and plant catalogs and asking him which plants he likes; Select Seeds, Annie's Annuals, and Botanical Interests have beautifully illustrated catlogs; I'm sure others can suggest some more catalogs that are drool-worthy.

I'm sure he cut back the bits of your roses that were in his way. He needed access to do what was needed, and it looks like he did a fabulous job. I understand that you aren't complaining about what he did; just asking for advice about what to do with a lop-sided rose. IMO, a very small price to pay for what he did.

Virginia

I agree with Vap and Virginia. I think he cares, passionate,hard working, honest, reliable and kind but no knowledge. And I think he is fast learner too

Remember when you said he wanted to cut the post and level up the fence but you said No. He did not touch it and knowing that is wrong..not completed job in his eyes. Maybe you should tell him what you are planning to do.... climbing roses. He might get the picture.

Marlorena is right sometimes it is action speaks louder than words..lol. It works :)

You should see me giving directions a few times ( hand directions ) but you will know if they look lost sometimes I take them there...

I think Javier is a keeper. He will help you. He is awesome to bring extra wood to you that you need . He has a great heart and passion. After, you train him, he will know more about roses than any Mexican. He will grow them call it a feeling. Wait till he sees a full bloom. His mouth will drop..take pics...hehe. I can't wait to see that.:)

Jin

Yes, that’s it exactly, Virginia and Vap. I know he meant well. The only roses he’s probably seen around here are the Hybrid Teas that get pruned down to nothing every January in So CA. There were weeds, although they were almost exclusively Oxalis and some crab grass. I could see that he recognized those as weeds, so I didn’t realize that he would consider everything else that wasn’t blooming a weed, as well. He definitely thought he was giving the beds a good “cleaning out”, and that’s what he did:) I’ll be making SURE he doesn’t remove any more plants or touch my roses, again. That’s for sure! Overall though, your right. It’s a small price to pay for all that help. I’ve got the catalogs ready, Virginia! Lisa

Lol.. Lisa. I thought my husband the one and only thinks everything is weeds..we just was talking about Sherry's comment. Jeff said Sherry ' s husband sounds just like me minus the weeds

Then, he turn around and asked" So, when are your weeds coming?"

March 9th and they are not weeds. They are called ROSES.

He just laughed at me and I know he is messing with me...Men...lol

Jin

I had my shed painted, and the painters cut back Peggy Martin all the way. Waiting to see what happens as it was a new rose. I figure it's a climber and wants to live.

I am going to be having a bunch of work done on the front of my house this Spring painting and new siding I'm gonna be walking these guys through my rose garden and explaining exactly where they don't get to put their big clumpy boots.

Even though I think I can get my message across about not removing any plants, or cutting back any roses, I’m beginning to worry about him putting in my drip system. I know I’ll be thrilled once it’s installed and it’s absolutely needed. I cannot go through another Sum­mer of handwatering. Those clumsy boots and shovels full of soil get piled up without him looking where they’re landing. I have small plants that I need to get into the ground now, yet I’m afraid to do so. As I’ve said, he works “fast and furious” and I can’t imagine him tiptoeing between tiny annuals and perennials. I think I’m just going to have to collect as many containers as possible and cover what’s most dear to me, so they’re protected.

I’m truly thankful for Javier, I really am. He’s just wants to impress with his work, and to him a good garden is a tidy, sparse garden. He has repeatedly said, “No show you Daddy till I finish”. My aging parents recently had all their lawn ripped out, and replaced with mulch and succulents. I’m hoping he doesn’t think that’s what’s going to happen here!:) That’s where the catalogs will come into play. He has no concept of perennials going dormant and looking like a few sticks at this time of year. To him, they were dead, and needed removing. I’m try to look at the bright side. I really can replace what has been removed for a fraction of the cost of what this work would have cost me, if someone else had done it. Throw in the free materials and I’m coming out way ahead. But, only a true gardener would understand the feeling of sadness when a plant is forever gone, that you’ve raised from a seed, or a 4” pot into a 4F bush. The only plant I truly cannot replace, is a clematis that my deceased husband bought for me many years ago. I have carried it from house to house for over a decade. THAT ONE, I shed some tears over. What’s done is done, and I won’t be using the translator app to tell him about it. There’s no bringing it back, and no need to make him feel awful. He’s honest, kind, and working hard to take care of his family. I’m not afraid to be home alone when he’s here. You all have given me some great tips for how to work with him. I think using the translation app, the picture catalogs, Marlorena’s words:), and covering my smaller plants with containers will go a long ways. I’ve also decided to put tags or signs on my native plants on the slope that say “NO AGUA!!” so that they don’t have drip emitters installed to them. I am looking for a Spanish speaker amongst my sons friends, but I know that their close friends do not speak Spanish. I’m still looking and surely in So CA, you’d think we’ve got to know someone!

With these plans in place, I think it will be ok, but I’m going to be realistic. There will be mistakes made, and there will be loses. I can’t sow a packet of seeds across a border and expect that the seedlings won’t be killed while the drip irrigation is installed there. I’m just going to have to accept that. Thanks so very much, everyone. I’m glad to know I’m not the only one who fears someone else stepping clumsy foot in my garden:) Lisa

Well put Lisa. No one but us knows where our treasures are.

Put up little orange or yellow flags to mark what you don't want removed or cut back. I know he is trying to be helpful but it might help if he sees the flags and knows the boundaries.

Lisa, I just want to give you a hug when you told me about the Clematis in your email. So, sorry about your plant.

You have such a big heart by not telling him. You are right what is done is done.

Jin

Lisa , you have such a good heart to not want to hurt Javiers feeling by telling him about your clematis. He would feel so awful . You have such a sweet spirit by considering his feelings over yours

Lisa, I have an ownroot Evelyn from Heirloom, and she grew like a maniac in her first year and a half here. She's easily one of my most vigorous roses. First she threw out lots of 4ft basals, and then threw lots of 6ft laterals (starting near the base of the basals). I know they say not to prune young roses, but Evelyn had so many canes, I needed to thin it out. I looked at her yesterday, and she's growing a lot more laterals this spring all along each of the basals, and I'm wondering if I didn't thin her out enough...but I don't like to heavily prune unless I really need to.

Since you live in an area only slightly warmer than me, your Evelyn should grow back fast, similar to mine. The laterals growing from near the base seem to grow much longer and are more flexible than the basals, so you should have many new canes to work with soon.

Thanks, so much everyone. You’ve all been so kind and understanding through all of this. I’ve not seen Javier again, and my texts,( his preferred way of communication) asking what day he will come back are answered with “Ok Seniorita”. It’s a little frustrating because I’m not sure when to expect him, or when to be prepared. I believe he was unable to support his family on his landscaping alone, and now works laying brick during the week. He did mention something about not being able to work his other job during rain, and coming here then, but our predicted rain always fizzles out into nothing. I can certainly see his wanting to earn the money when he’s not earning it from his regular job, but I’m not crazy about the thought of watching his every move during a cold rainy day, either. He’s a strong young man in his early 30’s. I’m a rather weak woman with multiple sclerosis who’s 50 years old. I guess I can rush from window to window, if it comes to that. Let’s hope that with our plans in place, that won’t be necessary.

MAD, I’m so happy that you told me that! Thank you!!! Mine is also ownroot from the same source. I feel so much better after reading your comment. So far, my Evelyn sounds like yours, just not quite as far along. How are you growing yours? Are you training her around something or against a fence? It was a very chilly week(for us) last week, and I didn’t have a lot of energy. Today is sunny and pleasant,so I hope to get Evelyn trained around something today. That, and a number of other things. Today would be a great day for Javier to show up! Lisa

Lisa, I have my Evelyns from the same source as MAD with the same experience. I wouldn't be thrilled either if they were cut down but if anybody can make a quick comeback, it would be Evelyn in our climate!

I used to stress out a bit over my helper's mistakes but try to remind myself that I can't watch them all day and in the greater picture, I would never be able to accomplish what I want to without them.

I have moved my favorites to areas where only I'm the only one allowed to do anything with them, and then there's "their areas" that they're semi-in-charge of with supervision!

I would find that stressful, having potentially rose damaging people around my plants too Lisa. Ideally, he could get the project finished and be gone because worrying about what damage might occur is too nerve wracking. I think this is a sensitivity issue where some people are earth movers and lawn specialists and others are tuned into individual plant treasures. I doubt you can educate one into the other. It is a matter of values and priorities.

Lisa, I’m glad I could help ease some of your worries. If you can’t find flags, you could also use those bright, paper, party streamers and wrap the bushes you don’t want to be touched (like police tape).

I am trying to train my Evelyn as a tall bush. I like the shape of tree peonies, so I’m hoping Evelyn can be trained to that shape eventually. She’s in a circular raised bed next to Jude the Obscure and St. Cecilia. Evelyn looks like she needs more space, so I’m considering either moving Jude and St. Cecilia and giving Evelyn the entire bed as a specimen or moving Evelyn to a spot along my fence. Who gets to stay right up front will depend on their bloom production this year.