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katy_richard

Lippage - about to begin tiling.

7 years ago
We are about to begin tiling our bathroom shower/tub enclosure, wall and floor.
The tile for shower/tub and walls is a Somer Tile 6x12" ceramic subway. Floor is rectified 12x24" porcelain.

My question is what are the best ways to ensure little to no lippage. What leveling system do you recommend?

Tiles shown below.

Comments (18)

  • PRO
    7 years ago

    To answer your specific question. "leveling system" Yes it says leveling on the products but they don't level anything. They are lippage tuning systems. You need to level & plumb your walls and floor prior to installation. Thus the points TFW posted.

  • PRO
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Holy rambling response let me try again ctec

    In Short form

    btw that looks like some nice wall tile.

    Lippage ?

    its a mix of many factors that eliminate lippage., Substrate, tile quality , skill-set, tile

    quality , setting product selection and application, factor in the DIY element. and TILE quality!!

    Id use a tuning system for the floor only and id make a smart grout joint assessment and choose wisely layout , pattern , stagger based on many tiles inspected from the whole batch..... A straight stack is your best friend usually....

  • 7 years ago
    Thanks for your responses. I should have quantified that our DIY is by my husband who is the profession, w 40 years experience in building/carpentry/construction. Has had a decent amount of tiling experience, but mostly in apartments where the goal is speed, not perfection. That said, he takes pride in his work and has only had issues w lippage once, w 12x24 tiles on the wall. We are trying to be extra diligent with our own home, thus seeking tips and techniques that we haven't thought of.
    We will be staggering the white tile as shown in photo, but stacking is a definite possibility on the floor.
  • 7 years ago
    PS - I consider both of these tiles to be of nice quality. Neither bought at big box stores.
  • PRO
    7 years ago

    I concur with what Creative Eastern Tile and TFW said....and will throw in my thoughts. Grid pattern on 12x24 is usually the best if you are going for 1/16" joints. (if you are finicky about lippage.

    Most large format tiles have a bow in the center....some are worse than others. You can place two tiles face to face on a flat surface...then you can look at the ends of the tiles. Usually the tiles are touching in the middle of the tile and there is a gap on the ends. You can try a few different tiles for this test and you will get an idea of how not flat the tiles are. Lippage is accentuated the closer the tiles are together.


    You will notice in the manufacturers specs for most large format tiles that they only recommend 33.3% offset and usually a 3/16" grout joint. That being said....most residential customers want 50% offset and 1/16" grout joints because it looks nicer. Obviously this is where you run into problems when customers, contractors, diy people don't educate themselves on what they will run into if they aren't aware of limitations like this. Usually there is going to be at least some minor lippage (if the tiles are pretty flat....major lippage if the tiles are really bad.) if you go 50% offset and tight grout joints.


    The 'leveling systems' i.e 'lippage tuning system are great for minimizing the lippage. But if you have 3/8" thick 12x24 tiles....tiles like that are pretty rigid often times and even the lippage systems can't totally eliminate all the lippage (at least that has been my experience for the most part.)


    Anyway you need to start with flat surfaces (which is the part that many inexperienced people forget to consider.) So you do whatever you have to in the prep phase to get your floors and wall as flat as possible. Once you have done that....the tiling can go much smoother and you will have a nice finished product.


    As far as those wall tiles you selected....Those type of wall tiles usually have a pretty rounded (and forgiving edge....instead of a sharp rectified edge.) If you start with flat wall then I think you would be ok with going 1/16" grout joint. Because of the rounded edge the grout joint would look about an 1/8" or so. I've have done projects with tiles like that and the finished product looked nice.


    Anyway good luck with your project....

  • 7 years ago
    Thanks so much for the advice. We are going to going to make sure the walls and floor are plum, level and flat as possible. And I don't mind stacking the pattern on the floor if that's what it takes. Will definitely go through tiles to pick best ones possible. I think it's going to work out beautifully. Also, the people at the tile store said the floor tile could be set right up against each other w the smallest of grout lines...we shall see!
  • 7 years ago
    Big Rock, also, thanks for grout line suggestion on walls. Sounds just right.
  • 7 years ago
    Another question: Very IMPORTANT! It's so crucial to me that the grout not yellow over time. It happened in my kitchen, and I've literally read hundreds of accounts of this exact problem. Sealed, unsealed, it didn't matter.
    Do you have any tips that would avoid this issue? A type or brand of grout that stays white? I hope you can help. Thank you!
  • 7 years ago

    I'm just wondering how you're going to grout this? I can imagine a nightmare, but maybe you know something I don't...


  • 7 years ago

    My designer recommended against white grout because it is going to show wear and tear more than a soft gray or beige would.


    I went with a variety of different subtly colored grouts depending on the tile. I held the grout samples up against the tiles that were being installed to find the one that blended the best as I didn't want high contrast grout as part of the design.

  • PRO
    7 years ago

    Helen, Good call. Now pay attention to the brand TFW mentions (albeit there are a few). Laticrete Silver Shadow is often a go-to for us in like applications. There are differences in brands.

  • 7 years ago
    Thanks for the advice everyone. I'll definitely keep brand in mind. I was also leaning towards a light gray because of the yellowing. My husband said he's started using an additive to mix the grout instead of water (which could be the yellowing culprit) and has had no problems.
    I don't think that the yellowing is a made-up internet problem though. It happens.
    I'll also consult w our tile store too for best possible solution.
    Grouting will be like any other job w a lot more clean up, I guess. Good question! Or maybe we will tape off the grooves, I wonder if that would work.
  • PRO
    7 years ago

    Yikes.... I wouldnt waste your time taping off grout joints. The glazed wall tile (in your original pic will clean up nicely.


    The floor Tile should be pretty easy to clean as well unless it has a texture or grooves in it. You can grout the faces of a sample tile to see how easy it is to clean. If in doubt you could Pre-seal the tile before you grout.


    Dont use additives much so can’t give you feedback on that. The laticrete product mentioned I have used before and works well. but mostly my suppliers carry Mapei and Custom brands of grout.


    For cement based grout I like Custom Prism or Mapei Ultracolor. Both are color consistent and fast setting. Both work well if installed following manufacturers instructions.

  • 7 years ago
    You're right Big Rock, I think it will cleanup fine. Thanks for the recommendations on grout.
  • 7 years ago
    Today the field installed, integrated tile flange was welded onto tub and plumbing for the tub and shower was completed. We dropped the tub back in, sealed it and might just take a bath tonight!
  • 7 years ago
    Also installed exhaust fan/light.
  • 7 years ago

    Let us know how the grouting goes...I get that it's a glazed tile, but it has the grooves that would worry me...especially if you use an epoxy grout (must work fast with that one!)


    I feel as if tape might be tiresome, but a good idea...maybe just a plastic tape? Anyway, I suggest a test board including grouting so you can see how much time you need to devote to a certain size section..

    Fingers crossed that it won't be an issue, though... :)


    My tub looks about like yours, too..we removed the existing cultured marble apron(?) but we're putting in a wood front...

    But I did take a bath before it's done...HEAVENLY!


    It's kind of a pita doing bathrooms and kitchens...I hope it all hums along nicely for you...