Dirt and smudges on the wall I think is to be expected to some degree. Depending on the type of paint they can be hard to clean too. I think most expect to repaint walls between tenants.

I disagree with lyfia. They are perfectly capable of cleaning anything they muck up, either themselves or by hiring a maid. Any cleaning you have to do after they leave should be deducted.

It's not typical to have to repaint after 3 years. The house I live in has a much older paint job, and it looks fine because I clean up any smudges that accrue. If you have to repaint because their patching was insufficient, then they need to pay for that as well.

I will say, with all intentions of kindness, you need to grow a backbone if you want to survive the landlording business and prosper. You can find some great resources (and a very helpful discussion board) at mrlandlord.com.

Thanks all.

The paint was indeed flat paint. This was why no matter from what angles you look at the walls, you can see the dirt and smudge. The painter suggested egg-shell paints for easier maintenance. He said flat paint is the worst to clean.

Ah, flat paint. I hate that stuff. :)

But just saying that will now probably start a paint war, because I know others hate paint with any kind of sheen to it. It's all personal preference of course - but in a rental property, I think you're kind-of nuts if you have flat paint on the walls. :) Eggshell or satin is a much more durable choice.

I'd chalk all of this up to learning experience and move on.

Yeah with flat paint and depending on the quality of it that was used it is easy to get it looking horrible in no time with kids in the house. They touch everything even though I have repeatedly told mine to not do it, they still do including glass. I don't paint anything flat even though there are some flat paints that do say you can clean them I still avoid it. Eggshell would be a better choice and one that says it can be "scrubbed". Then I think the paint should hold up better and you may not need to expect to paint more than touch-up between tenants.

Thanks again guys/gals. I just want to be fair. Now is time to speak to wife if she agrees. The painter asks for 1200 for the doing interior of the entire house, we just need to get the paint. Sounds like a good deal according to Angieslist. We just might chalk it up as a learning experience.

I agree that you should have been there when they moved out. Some of the damage such as the things that were broken should be deducted but the cost of painting is on the landlord. Painting especially after having someone living there for three years will make the place appear fresher for the next tenant. I think you are very lucky to only have this small amount of damage after three years.

BTW, there is no requirement that you do a joint walk through on the final day of tenancy. It would not be uncommon to find some damage while you are prepping for the new tenant that wouldn't have been visible at the time. Example: freshly shampooed carpet and 2 days later it dries and you can smell the cat pee. Typically you have 30 days to send an accounting of the security deposit along with any refund due to them.

I agree that their likely is no requirement to do the walk thru on the last day nor likley that it be conducted jointly.

However, Judge Judy and I both agree completely that it is moronic not to do so. (And do take pictures for before and after.)

You are the landlord, you are running a rental business, Think like a business owner and treat this house as a rental business. Don't be mean and rude, but STOP being nice (like not raising the rent, repairing at your expense) and expecting your tenant to see your kindness and return the kindness. Its a business

If something is damaged, take pictures. Repair the damage. Keep records of the cost of the repair. Make copies of pictures and receipts. Deduct the cost of repair from deposit. Send them the remaining money from the deposit after deduction. Send them a copy of the pictures and receipts.

Dirty paint is wear and tear. Kids with crayons on the walls is not wear and tear. Use common sense to judge what is normal wear and tear and what is damage. Dirty carpet is wear and tear. Fleas and pee spots are damage.

What I like to do is call them when I receive the monthly rent and ask them nicely if there is anything that needs attention? This way things don't accumulate. Every couple of months, I will arrange a visit for HVAC service or pest control. I will attend personally. At that time, I will take a personal survey of condition. I will fix anything I see.

Include in the new lease a penalty for late rent. I charge $50 a day after 3 days late. It gets added to the next months rent. Send them a letter notifying them of the penalty payable in the next month's rent, if they are late. Do this via US mail and send it return receipt request. This way it's a legal notice. More than one or two instances of late rent, I do not renew the lease.

If you decided to allow pet, charge them. Require a fee, not a deposit.

While we all try to be nice and accommodating, this is a business. What would an apartment complex do? If it's a really small fix, okay. Let it go. If there are 50 small fixes, add them up.

Failure to water the lawn when a sprinkler is provided is damage. But, I would chalk this up to an experience. In the future lease, be certain to require that they water the lawn. I usually pay for lawn service and include it in the rental fee. This way, I know the grass will be cut.

You only learn these things the hard way. If you are lucky you will get a good tenant. If you do, do anything to keep them. Most of the time you will get a poor tenant. Don't let them take advantage of you.

I was a landlord for many years. Smudges are ordinary wear and tear. You will have a hard time collecting for that.

First of all, you need to run this venture professionally, like a business, not like you are friends or buddies. When a tenant moves IN, you provide a move-in sheet, indicating the condition of each and every area of the home. Tenant signs each section.

When a tenant moves out, you compare the sections and the photos. You charge for dirt and damage, but not ordinary wear and tear. It's a fine line sometimes. You can pretty much plan on painting between tenants. Most won't keep it as nice as you hope, in my experience. Some will. For those fabulous and careful tenants, I just return the deposit in full and handle small things myself. They made my life easy. I make their move-out easy.

You never let rent slide, at all. Rent is due on the first (or date you choose), no exceptions. (For a good tenant who tells you in ADVANCE or actually forgets, I've made exceptions). But you have to set expectations up front. The mortgage company doesn't wait for you. You are not at liberty to wait for tenants.

Next time, make sure you have your documents in order. You can easily demonstrate that the tenant signed off on undamaged areas when he moved in, but they were damaged afterward (photos of before, photos of after). Repair all damage and deduct what it cost you from the security deposit. Return the security deposit ASAP ( you are required to do it by whatever your state limit is - here is is 45 days, last I checked. I do it right away).

No pets, ever, is my rule. One of the best tenants I ever had asked me, "Why would I have a pet? I'm a tenant! I will have a pet when I have a house." Right answer. Make your life easier. If you choose not to do accept them, just know you will have additional damage from pets. On the other hand, it is harder to move with pets because a lot of people don't accept them, so maybe they will stay longer. Just know you will be likely replacing everything (or refinishing hardwoods. Not always, but often).

I would use satin paint, for a rental. Keep the touch up paint at your own house, after repainting. That way, you will have matching paint. It may disappear if you leave it in a rental place. Sounds like your repairs were pretty normal, and not expensive, so pretty much wear and tear for a 3 yr tenant with a family. However, being late with rent, is not acceptable. Getting half and waiting for the other half is not acceptable. Yes, it is a business, when you are a landlord. You also have the right to inspect your property with notice to the tenant, at least a couple times a year. Stop moving trees, and changing things, just to accommodate them. They know what it looks like when they move in, so they dont need you to change things to how they like. Take pictures, before anyone moves in, and take pictures again after move out. Have those pictures printed and stored with the name of the tenant on them. Dont forget to take picturs of the outside of the house and the yard too.

I have 2 comments.

1. Dirty paint is not wear and tear. Cleaning the premises after they leave is deductible from the deposit. Read your lease carefully. I am assuming it says to leave the premises in clean condition, normal wear and tear excepted. Cleaning, whether walls, carpet, or whatever is the tenants' responsibility.

Edited to say: I guess I should say, a few scuffs on the paint isn't wear and tear. I stand corrected!

2. I suppose it depends on your local market, but when renting out a house with a yard, Landlord can agree to pay the water and gardener in the lease. You can charge more for that, but we found it far better for the health of the outdoor plants, and it's nice to have someone who works for YOU visiting the property regularly.

Needing to paint is ordinary wear and tear, especially after several years. Almost every landlord I know routinely completely repaints between tenants. It's just part of the expense of bringing in a new renter.

"Broom clean" is the normal standard. That doesn't mean polished to perfection. You should set your rents such that you can afford a full professional deep cleaning between tenants (ie the kind where you get a 3-4 person team in for 4-5 hours of work) . You should not expect the party moving out to leave the place clean enough for you to re-rent as is, nor take that out of their security deposit.

Yards are hard-- you either need very clear up front (in writing) expectations of work to be done by the tenant or to have a landscaper in your employ visiting regularly to do the work.

Regarding late rent. Currently, I only have one rental property, I have had as many as two at one time. It is my policy to text the tenant on the day the rent is due. I tell them up front that I will do this. I explain that it's not an insult. It's for their benefit. This way they don't forget and end up owing me money. As long as they know up front that the text will be coming, I have gotten my rent on time. If they pay early, they don't get the text. After a while, I will stop this with a long-term tenant who has proven they are responsible. I think it's a good idea for a small landlord to incorporate this in their business model.

If something goes wrong, I am there in minutes. For example, we had a septic backup. I had that fixed and professionally cleaned up within two hours. You don't ask people to wait for you when you have a serious issue. You get it done and you do it correctly.

I don't know your state laws but if it were me I would not charge for the painting but I would charge for all of the late fees. Unless you specifically told them that you would not charge the late fees, in my state and with my lease you would be able to deduct the late fees from the security deposit.

I have learned the hard way that trying to be too "nice" doesn't pay off. People will take advantage of you as much as you let them. Set policies and follow them. Run it like you would any other business.

I disagree on the advice to do a move out walk through with tenants. Tenants can become belligerent when told that they will have deductions from their security deposit. I am not going to put myself in that position if I can help it and it is not required in my state.

Thank y'all. I am treating this as a learning lesson. We had an episode before with the tenants when a misunderstanding had turned into them screaming (like banshee and I have never in my life knew how someone could scream and yell a that capacity) to us. My wife still remembers the incidents and does not wants to deal with them.

At this point we just want this out of our lives. I am deducting material costs (total less than $50) from the deposit since. We will be repainting the house and replacing the carpet with LVP.

One question I have is, shall I just email them and let them know the reason for taking the $50 out of the deposit, with cost of each materials we had to purchase? Or just return the deposit with the money taken out?

Itemize the amounts withheld. (Does not your lease address this?)

As SaltiDawg mentions: follow your lease provisions for notifications. Make sure you stay within the days allowed for notification which is dictated by state law and should be in your lease as well.

I would send a letter via certified mail within the time allowed by my state law.

Got it. My lease only stated I have to return the deposit within 30 days, and it doesn't mentioned itemize the withheld or anything else. I think it was created with a very basic lease template, as it was only 5 pages long.

Based on your last post, most definitely check your state's statutes about your LL duties of notification to the tenant. Not that all short leases are missing info, but many don't comply with the applicable laws. Be on the safe side.

Marks and dirt on walls is normal wear and tear. Holes in walls other than where a picture hanger was are damages. We always repainted in between tenants so the new tenant had fresh walls.

As someone who has owned and managed rental property for over 30 years, you need to have your lease reviewed by an attorney periodically. Rental laws vary by state. Finding out the your lease doesn't comply with state laws when you are in court is an expensive lesson.

Oh, and you never EVER let a tenant be late on rent. That has to be a hard line if you don't want to be pushed to the bottom of the monthly bills. Rent due on the first, late on the second, period.

When you own your home, you can paint or not paint for as long as you want. it's usual and customary to re-paint between tenants, especially after several years of tenancy.

They were there for three years. I think its going to fall under normal wear and tear. You as a landlord are expected to have to paint every few years.