Hi Lux! First, does Iceberg set hips by itself where you are? It doesn't, everywhere. In the hot inland valleys around LA, it doesn't set hips, but grow it in the coolth of the coast and it's a bloody fruiting plant! If it doesn't set self hips where you are, then use it for pollen instead. If it does set self hips, go for it! Generally, though, Iceberg provides better results via pollen. That doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't try it, but I would try it both directions and see which you prefer.

Don't give up on using Teas for seed parents. Not all Teas will produce seed and even fewer produce easily germinated seed. For me, here, Viru's Faith Whittlesey works splendidly in both directions, as do George Washington Richardson (Mlle de Sombreuil) and Mme Antoine Mari. I'm sure there are others out there, but of the ones I grow, these two are VERY willing mates. I'm waiting on a Faith Whittlesey X (R. X Actii )(Wichurana X Hugonis) seedling to flower and it's definitely a hybrid! And, I put pollen from Jesse Hildreth, Devoniensis, GWR, Bassoues Tea, Fred Boutin's Bloomfield Abundance, Ping Dong Yue Ji (fertile both directions), Lamarque, Marechal Niel and Faith on a bunch of things around the yard. Oh, and Florence Bowers Pink Tea is also fertile in both directions. It produced a lovely repeat blooming rambler with Paul Barden's 42-03-02.

White Beauty is the color sport of The Doctor. It may grow more vigorously own root (not my experience with them in the Newhall garden) but that likely isn't going to be an issue in breeding. Most often, sports are only "skin deep". They don't extend to the sexual level. White Beauty is most likely to produce nearly identical seedlings to The Doctor. It might be a fun one to play with only because of the scent, flower size and romance of the plant's age.

Susan Louise? HMF doesn't list any offspring for it. I agree, it's a gorgeous thing and may turn out to be worth playing with, but the historical record doesn't provide any evidence to support that. I hope it works splendidly for you so there will finally be some proof she's worth playing with.

Are you using the pollen donor flowers to apply the pollen? That may be a big part of the issue. Ralph Moore felt his failures were most likely due to insufficient pollen being applied to the seed parent blooms. If you have the musk parent in your garden, you are in luck! Pick a BUNCH (I mean LOTS) of buds showing color between the sepals or a more fully matured, but not to the point of being fully open as the pollen begins falling pretty quickly. Pull off the sepals and petals, then use a pair of small scissors to cut the anthers from the flower. Collect them on a sheet of paper. I use old bills (why not get multiple uses from them before recycling or shredding them?) to dry them until the pollen falls. I've explained and provided photos to illustrate what I mean on my blog at this post. http://pushingtheroseenvelope.blogspot.com/2012/08/pollinating-roses.html If you're interested in the squeezers (scissors), the most cost effective source now is a jewelry supply source. https://www.riogrande.com/product/squeeze-action-4-75-straight-blade-micro-scissors/119341 I was buying them from sewing sources until they all raised their prices to nearly $20 a pair! They are ALL made of stainless steel and ALL made in Pakistan. ALL of them, no matter from whom you purchase them. There is one sewing source which guarantees them and will replace them, "free". They sell them to you for $25 a pair then want $6 a pair "handling fee" to replace them "free". Notice RioGrande Jewelry sells them for $4.99 a pair. I've had the $25 ones and they ARE identical to the $4.99 ones.

I dry a TON of pollen from many different roses in the yard. And, I hold it for MONTHS, adding to it as flowers arrive, until I've pollinated everything I want to pollinate with it. I get results which are obviously crosses between the parents so the months old pollen, simply held under the house temps (mid sixties to low seventies) in the formal living and dining rooms where the wind won't blow it off and no pets (or people!) are likely to disturb it.

Jesse Hildreth

Purezza

Bassoues Tea

Ping Dong Yue Ji

Even Grey Pearl!

In these conditions, the pollen begins falling in a day and continues for quite a while. Moving the dried material around on the paper leaves a layer of pollen on the paper surface. With a ton of it, you can more easily pour the dried material into a clean glass baby food jar (my newest ones turn 25 years old tomorrow as my youngest nephew's 25th birthday is July 2. The oldest ones are now 27 years old) where you can easily shake it to make it cling to the jar sides. I usually use my finger to rub it off the jar sides and massage it into the stigma of the seed parent bloom. I do have some small camel hair brushes for use with flowers whose stigma disks are deeply recessed, making finger application difficult or impossible. I used a brush to pollinate the R. Stellata mirifica blooms last summer with Minutifolia pollen. Where the pollen was required was deeply recessed inside the ovary, making my finger unsuitable for application. The brush worked perfectly!

I used the term "massage" the pollen into the stigma because that's what the bees do. No, you don't want to crush them, but you do want to LIBERALLY apply pollen to the entire stigma area to insure fertilization. If you are using dried anthers attached to a dried flower, that can be rather difficult, but if you have a PILE of dried anthers and stamen, shedding a TON of pollen on the papers, you can literally flood the blooms with straight pollen. And, you can (if desired) revisit those blooms the following day to apply more. Mr. Moore played with repeatedly pollinating the same blooms over several days and felt he obtained some results he had found difficult to achieve. Have I done it? Nope, too lazy. Plus, I have too many other flowers and pollens I want to play with to remember to repeat what I previously did. That's a left over or a rerun and I don't really "do" either.

I hope I gave you some new ideas to play with! Please feel free to ask any questions you think of.

This is the Florence Bowers Pink Tea X 42-03-02.

Kim