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stm25rs

Shower drain issue in new build

2 years ago

Fiancee and I are at tile for a new build and ran into an issue with two shower floor drains. One bathroom is Kohler modern brushed brass fixtures, the other is Kohler French gold.
Builder got 4" Schluter drains that are kind of close but not a real match. The drain collar is in, under the waterproofing and mortar that got coated in red. Sorry if I'm butchering the correct terminology, by the way.
This part was completed before builder showed us the drain colors and we saw they didn't match.
The Kohler drains are 4.5" and have a threaded connection between the drain itself and the drain collar. The Schluter doesn't have threads, I guess it gets PVC cemented in?
Is there any reason we can't just use a thread to weld PVC fitting? Or is there any other solution besides ripping up the shower floor?
I was only meeting with the project manager today, so will review with the owner on Monday.

Comments (20)

  • 2 years ago
    last modified: 2 years ago

    Hopefully someone will understand your question better than I did. I'll just recommend making some clarifications to your question if you didn't get responses. I THINK you indicate your builder installed plumbing for a PVC cemented drain rather than a threaded drain like you plan to use. I don't understand how you could thread in a square drain if your floor is already in. Maybe add a photo of your floor collar to help us visualize your dilemma.

  • 2 years ago

    Not sure I understand the issue.


    My shower was originally intended to have the kind of drain that used tile so it would blend in. However, they didn't follow the plan when they did the rough so I could only have the traditional drain cover.


    Luckily I found a vendor on this forum - Designer Drains - which have beautiful drain covers in a variety of finishes.


    Designer Drains


    FWIW I opted for a cover that didn't screw down and so it is much easier to clean out the hair when it becomes sluggish in terms of draining. And I also "splurged" on the $11.00 hair catcher which sits below the cover. It is hidden and helps prevent any "clogs" from moving down into the pipes and requiring a more costly cleaning.

  • 2 years ago

    Stm25rs, you may be confused about the question that some of us are responding to. If you have a properly installed Schluter waterproof membrane shower system, then there was no need for the Redguard waterproof membrane that it looks like has been applied to your shower. That is why people are concerned about mixing of both systems, calling it a Frankensystem, etc.
    For me personally, I would not mess with (tear out) your waterproofing system; I would explore some of the other options for drains.

  • 2 years ago

    By the way, Helen, those are some pretty cool drain covers at designer drains.

  • 2 years ago

    I don't have a picture of the shower floor as it is now, or any pictures of the floor system when it was in process of installation.


    This is the drain flange that's installed/set in the mortar.




    So it's a cement in PVC drain, I believe 3".


    The color matching Kohler drain system is like this, where a threaded collar screws onto the drain flange, then the drain cover threads into that fitting in the flange.




    So I was wondering if it's possible to use the drain cover/body from the Kohler, with a PVC adapter of female thread to male cement in fitting, so it can go in the Schluter drain flange? Although I guess the adapter would add height to the assembly? Is this just all around a bad idea?


    We could potentially match the floor, I hadn't thought of that option. Would probably prefer that to a mismatched gold tone. We're doing river rock stone tile for both showers, so Schluter's greige or cream might be a good match. And I can check other manufacturers for options that might be better matches to the stone.


  • 2 years ago
    last modified: 2 years ago

    How come I see Redgard on a shower that is using a Kerdi system drain install? They aren't really all that compatible of a shower system. I guess you could "technically" use a pre-fabbed Kerdi-board pan and then mechanically lap cement board coated in Redgard over the edge lips, but it is just a bad idea all around and is clearly a cost cutting measure. Also the fact that the person doing this work can't provide you with a clear answer on this and you are here even asking is a BAD sign.

    I'd take pictures of the current install and send them to Schluter, which will inevitably result in them telling you this is not a warrantied install, which you should then take to your contractor and tell them you want the shower re-done from scratch by a different shower/tile installer that knows what they are doing.

  • 2 years ago

    The project manager is just that, so I'll be reviewing with the builder owner (it's a smaller local builder) on Monday. The PM is mostly the one doing followups and sub contractor coordination, he's still newer, so we work closely with the builder himself with technical questions/details.

    For my education, in addition to the warranty question, what is the issue with using the two systems together? Do they trap moisture between the red guard and membrane?

  • PRO
    2 years ago

    Can you put a chevy engine in a ford? Yes! Will it work? Maybe. Is it a good idea? Probably not. Waterproofing systems are designed end to end to work a certain way. Topical waterproofing like redguard uses entirely different technology than a fabric system like schluter. There is no reason to mix them within a shower and when they are mixed it often shows a lack of training of the tile setter.

  • 2 years ago

    Well lots of people put LSx engines in all kinds of cars and those work well, even stuffing them in Miatas!

    But point received, thank you for the clarification.

  • 2 years ago

    " For my education, in addition to the warranty question, what is the issue with using the two systems together? Do they trap moisture between the red guard and membrane? "


    Quite often they will create a moisture sandwich. And you will have zero manufacturers warranty with that mix of products, none of which is in the instructions.

  • 2 years ago

    Update, it's a doozy.

    I called our builder on Monday morning, confirmed there's no way to use the Kohler drain cover with the Schluter flange. I then asked about the overall installation, did they use the Schluter membrane with redgard? He said no membrane, only the redgard.

    Is it acceptable practice to use the Schluter drain without the full Schluter waterproofing system? I'm going to call Schluter later today and ask them, but curious to hear from y'all.

    So, then I told the builder we don't want mismatched gold tones, and that I saw Schluter has some light colors that might match our floor tile. Told him fiancee and I would be going to Floor and Decor after work to look at them.

    The Schluter Cream color is a good match for the floor in both showers. So we text the builder and project manager group chat that we want the Curve drain style, in Cream. PM texts back and asks "for both showers?" I say yes.

    So that was Monday. Tuesday morning I get to the house around 10:30 for Verizon FiOS install. And I find out they've installed the Schluter gold drains in both showers! Floor tile and drains are set, but not grouted.

    I called the builder and say "the Schluter gold drains are installed. Why?" He says "you gave the go ahead to use them."

    "No I didn't." Then some silence, and he says "there's been a lot of confusion about what's going on with the drains." So I rehashed the story so far, told him that is not what we selected, reminded him that I just told him 24 hours ago that we were going to look at drains to match the floor tile, and we need to figure something out. He said he'd talk to the PM.

    Didn't hear back from him yesterday, so will be following up today.

    Overall, I'm extremely frustrated with this part of the project. Up to this point they've done an excellent job of communicating, walking us through various details of the build process, and making sure we are in the loop for all selections. This drain clusterF has been absolutely ridiculous. I don't know if they're just rushing to close out this project, or what.

  • PRO
    2 years ago

    At this point, accept the gold drains and take a discount. Removing the drain means retiling the shower.

  • 2 years ago
    last modified: 2 years ago

    Yeah, I think I'm resigning myself to that "solution."

    Ballpark idea how much of a discount I should request? Noting that there are two showers, one is 3' x 5' the other is about 3.5' x 5.5'

  • 2 years ago

    So, you're willing to use the cream drain grate that "is a good match" to the tile, even though it's right next to the tile and won't really look the same as the tile, but you're not willing to use the gold tone drain grate that is nowhere near the other gold things that it needs to match, but will still be gold and you say they are a close match. Seems like they're equivalently "matching".

    How well will either of these finishes hold up to shower cleaning?

    A fair discount would be the price of the drain grate. Nothing to do with the size of the shower.

  • PRO
    2 years ago

    "I called", "I asked", "He said"


    All no good. If you don't have an email to stuff in his face, you've got nothing.

  • 2 years ago

    We do have emails and texts discussing other options.

    The PM corrected the owner that we did not agree to the Schluter gold drains, so they're redoing it.

    The modern brass "match" was kinda close, but the one they had for the French Gold was further off.

  • 2 years ago

    We do have emails and texts discussing other options.

    The PM corrected the owner that we did not agree to the Schluter gold drains, so they're redoing it.

    The modern brass "match" was kinda close, but the one they had for the French Gold was further off.

  • 2 years ago

    We do have emails and texts discussing other options.

    The PM corrected the owner that we did not agree to the Schluter gold drains, so they're redoing it.

    The modern brass "match" was kinda close, but the one they had for the French Gold was further off.

  • 2 years ago

    " The PM corrected the owner that we did not agree to the Schluter gold drains, so they're redoing it. "


    Just careful with them "redoing" it as the pan waterproofing will get messed up guaranteed.