I found this artice in Floral International News…… May shed light on any rose farm growing unpatented roses or trying to sell unpatented roses from other countries that are ”not patented, not paying royalties to original breeder.” .

After reading this article, I believe ”any unpatented rose sold, grown, or received in the US, should ”NOT be sold or received or grown in the US.” It is “internationally illegal” the article says below…… The roses are being seized, confiscated, and people receiving the unparented roses are being fined.

The person receiving an unpatented rose is responsible for the receipt of the rose. That person can face fraud, fines, and have the rose taken away, be it a Chinese rose, a European rose, and any international rose not patented to be in the US.

(Historical old roses (OGR) , outgrown their patents, do not apply to this regulations.)

Please check it out & see what you think?

My understanding is there is international law for the floral world in protecting patents now.

Plantec, in Equador is helpful, in following this international law. A&A receives some patented roses from Plantec.

. One should not be growing , receiving, or selling a rose which is patented in China, Japan, Europe or from any country, or from US, unless that person received patent rights from the breeder & pays royalties.

And if the rose was bred & patented in China or another country, but doesn’t have a US patent, the US may not have a patent to enforce protection on it, but ibternational law ”is now protecting the breeder’s patent.”

Interesting.

@knightsgambit

AI generates what it understands… but I believe this quote from AI is a ”minderstanding-incorrect if taken too literally…”

I think you cannot grow a Chinese rose in the US that is still under patent from a Chinese breeder in China, unless you obtain patent rights in US. It is still legally protected by international floral law.

I believe the AI was supposed to mean that ”you can grow any Chinese or other rose if it no longer has any patent, hence it has no US parent orcany parent now from anywhere, in US or any country…. if it has outgrown its patent by about 20 years. If you read articles the AI gave orcread below it….

The AI quote above ……went on to talk about out growing patents by 20+ years and heirloom old roses all out growing their patents. AL talks about roses not having patent because they out grew the patent. Then of course, if no patent in US or anywhere now, then you can receive, grow, sell it.

Again, when AI says something…. I always triple-quadruple check it’s computer synthesized understanding & sources and read further reknown research to fully understand. .

What do you think?

Rose Explosion & Rose-It , in China, exports roses to US . USDA told ne, when I called USDA, that that,”China is not legally even allowed to sell roses to US… due to low quality pest control standards in growing them. It is illegal to be buying roses from China grown.

Therefore, how can the US have any ”legal Chinese roses imported here and propagating/selling here in US? With or without patent, they would be illegal to obtain them from China to grow them in US? The USDA will conviscate them from the receiving person, the buyer or seller.

I think a number of people illegally imported these roses. They then sold and developed a following for them in the rose community and Etsy and now companies like One Love and GRF are using the loopholes in patent law to sell them. As they are propogating on budwood grown here, there are no quarantine rules they have to follow and I doubt either is paying any royalties.

No one being held liable only encourages more people to do it. Asian psylids, chinese lantern flies, are just a few examples of insects that have caused billions in damage. These importers dont see the damage they cause and neither do the buyers.

Yesterday I place an order with GRF for 4 bare roots: Moonstone, Veteran’s Honor, Sheer Elegance, and Francis Meilland. My garden was severely hurt from the extreme low’s Mon, Tues, and Wed morning.

Kentucky, your roses will be fine — just a slight delay in blooming.

If anyone is looking for a very hardy climber, Colette is impressive — no leaf damage at all after a couple of nights down to 19°F.

I’m sure your GRF roses will be fine too. I haven’t seen any complaints about them this season so far.

Did you get your AA roses yet?

Elena, no, tracking does say roses are in Lexington, expected delivery Mon. I do hope I get them today to start soaking them. How long did you soak yours?

@knightsgambit

Not sure US is looking to try to enforce international patent laws, but the Chinese roses in US are internationally illegal and any propagating/selling of them is illegal i internationally. Even if not caught at US customs, and later propagated, they are internationally illegal. USDA , if they are aware of any propagation, would confiscate them & fine the grower. USDA may not know of many ”growers propagating Chinese roses.”

There are Chinese vendors selling Japanese & other European roses, but the USDA is allowing these roses, when certified, to enter US. However, US is not responsible to check their patents. They may & may not in some cases have patents to be sold in US.

A few Chinese roses sold by a US seller….The seller labels them ”Chinese Roses.”

I am double checking for rose plant certification, with USDA, , maybe next week, but I think all this propagating of Chinese roses is illegal in US, and not legal for customers to buy them.

@kentucky_rose zone 6

Your order looks lovely! Sorry about this wonter. I am still waiting to see if my roses are healthy enough to grow. Freezes at night here, still. Days are warmer 40sF now.

Kentucky, I’m very much against the misconception of intentionally soaking bare roots for extended periods of time. I never soak mine for more than 48 hours.

I’ve shared my bare root planting method in several places, and I’ll copy it here as well.

My Method

1. Soak the rose
After receiving your rose, soak only the roots (not the canes) for 24–48 hours in water with a little Superthrive. Lightly mist the canes.
If you're concerned about disease contamination, you can add a small amount of Fertilome Fire Blight Spray to the soaking water.

2. Prepare the planting hole
Dig a hole at least 18 × 18 inches and pour in about 3 gallons of water.
• If the water drains within 30–40 minutes → drainage is good.
• If it stays → improve drainage with small gravel.

3. Soil mix
Mix native soil with ⅓–½ composted manure or compost.
Add 1 tablespoon of superphosphate.
Water well. No other fertilizer is needed at planting.

4. Prepare the rose
Refresh the roots and trim damaged tips. Remove weak or broken canes.
Coat the roots with mycorrhizae to help faster establishment.

5. Planting
Make a small cone of soil in the hole.
Set the rose on the cone, spread the roots, backfill, and firmly tamp so there are no air pockets. Water deeply again.
Plant the graft at the correct depth for your zone (for us in Zone 6b, about 2–3 inches below soil).

6. "Greenhouse" method (very important)
After planting, cover the rose with a light-colored, non-transparent pot with drainage holes and keep it covered until the first leaves appear.
This creates a mini-greenhouse and protects the rose while it wakes up. Remove the pot when leaves start to show.

Elena, thank you for the detailed info! Usually, I soak for 24 hours. Last year we were expecting torrential rain for days and Palatine said ok to only soak for a few hours so I could plant them that day. I did receive hydrated, excellent plants from them, too.

I soak bare roots for as little as an hour and up to about six hours. i've never lost a bare root rose. Diane

Where can I find the information on how to import Chinese roses? There are many DA like roses in China.

@summersrhythm_z6a

I just google Chinese roses and many come up on Etsy & Chinese Vendor websites. I spoke to USDA on phone directly & learned about Chinese impiorted roses. You can call USDA for futher info. They are nice on the phone and explain well.

Thanks Kitty! I will check it out. 👍

Japanese roses finally available for sale. 1 gallon, own root:

https://www.gracerosefarm.com/products/wabara®-aoi-fuga®-potted-rose-bush?srsltid=AfmBOoqP0V7tXN1rAP2shc5GBKXcqd3RAYmHwtSvHRpOlP9YrJc58x1H

@knightsgambit

Thanks for heads-up.

I see one Aoi Fuga, Wabara, Japanese rose, sold on GRF website, potted $80.00. . It is in a collection called, Passport of Roses.” There are the 3 roses named after Grace & this Japanese rose in the Passport Collection series, and stories written for each rose. Each of the potted 4 roses is $80.00. . Not sure why Grace added her name to the 3 roses?

I read one GRF “rose stories’ in the ” Passport to Roses’ collection of 4 roses & it sounds like the “American Girl doll series stories.”

Have you read any of these rose stories?

I suppose one is to feel nostalgic if they buy a rose with a story. Are these stories fiction? Maybe if Grace offered a ”glass antique doll” w/ the rose & story, I’d oay $80 & give it to my daughter if she was young.

@Kittysrosegarden I think she added her name in order to create a collection of roses akin to Kordes Parfuma or Meilland Romantica. At least, that is how I’d read into it. Not a bad business idea but not necessary. I haven’t read any of the stories as they are totally fictional and created by AI. It lacks authenticity and originality.

Given the fact all these roses haven’t been bought my members I can only surmise that a good number of people have balked at the price and cost. $80 plus shipping, so $100 is a lot to pay for a one gallon rose, even one as beautiful as Aoi. The pricing is eye wateringly high.

Having said that, the one I would pay that princely sum for is Miyuki. I managed to get 5 stems for $10 from Whole Foods and the myrhh scent is something I still think about, it was that good! (on a sidenote, I am trying to grow myrhh this year)As GRF is the only one legally licensed to potentially sell this plant, they are the only ones I’d buy it from.

@knightsgambit

Yes, I agree. Al stories possibly. Reminds me of stories for children or teens I guess, but not interestingly great literature, to say the least. I skim read one-could not read it all-too generic. Interesting gimicks to attempt selling these roses.

I actually love ”really great roses, with great fragrance, and beautuful shapely blooms.” They don’t need an AI story to sell them.

The great thing about naming a rose is that naturally people will want to know the origin of said name and one can channel that interest to good causes and expanding people’s horizons. Maybe it’s botanical gardens and conservancies, medical or charitable causes, maybe reviving interest in something lost. These are just some naming ideas that come to my mind. Point is there is authenticity in people and things that already exist and you dont have to create a fake story.

Wow, nice feature!

If I put that much "manure" on my garden, I would not be able to see the roses.

I received my 4 bare root roses from Grace Farms yesterday. They are huge!

Francis Meilland, Moonstone, Sheer Elegance, and Veteran’s Honor

Looking great, congrats!

Yes, Kentucky, they look wonderful, and I hope they all grow and bloom well for you. I get a daily mailing from GRF, and it seems like lately they have been promoting classic Austin roses for sale--ones like Brother Cadfael, The Prince, and Mary Rose. What's the news on that? I'm a bit surprised. Diane

I'll help them a bit. Here's The Prince

Brother Cadfael

Diane, my rose buddy, the “ENABLER.”

GRF is selling discontinued Austin's albeit at 3x the cost of nurseries like K&M, a cool $89 for a one gallon. I know K&M can be hard to get a hold of but they should have the Prince, Mary Rose, Brother Cadfael, Evelyn etc. available although I heard they're only going to be selling own root.

Potted roses just started showing up in local nurseries, and I couldn’t resist 😅

Already picked up Princess Anne, Elle, and Beverly — trying to stay strong, but the prices and quality are too good.

David Austin roses — $40

All others — $35

Elena, those look fantastic and excellent price! I’m guessing you will be going back. Is this the nursery you mentioned earlier in a post close to Cincinnati?

Kentucky, yes! AJ Rahn Nursery — their supplier is in Indiana, so the roses are sending in batches. I don’t want to miss Martha and will be checking them next week.

Ufff… got my Martha after this fox hunt 😅 She’s HUGE in a 3-gallon pot. There was only one—I called, and they held it for me. Happy dancing! 💃

Ps. Also got a notification abot sending me Chandos Beauty from All My Thymes. Lucky day!

Elena, yes, sounds like your lucky day! Martha looks fantastic and is it from your local nursery? Is the fragrance heavenly? Then to top it off, you’re getting Chandos Beauty! Happy, happy day…🥳

Kentucky, yes—the fragrance is divine! I just spent a few minutes with her before heading back to work.

I can’t wait to bring her home. She’s from AJ Rahn—they still don’t have full stock yet. I had three more I wanted to grab, but Martha was #1. 💕

@Kittysrosegarden looks like the Ashley bundle is either sold out or was taken down. There is a Mother’s Day section with some other bundles.

I bought these roses in past from $35-$50 from other vendors.

GRF prices Mother’s DayvSALE now….. 2026 spring….

I don’t have Menta, 2 bushes $118

GRF Cappuchino says 3-4 year old bush $134 w/20% off.

Cappuchino, I do not have, but if I buy her from A&A she is only $55 for a 1 gallon potted. ————————————————-

MOTHERS DAY GRF SALE

20-30 % off on Mother’s Day SALE:

2 bouquets for $184?

IF YOU NEED 2 bouquets-it’s a deal!

Mother’s Day GRF SALE above…..

The BOGO deal for Menta seems pretty good. You're getting two 5 gallon roses for about $60 each. Now you'll probably pay a bit in shipping but you get immediate results of a 5 gallon rose. I loved the color of Menta, I think it holds its shape far better and longer than a typical garden variety like Stainless Steel, the downside is that it doesn't perform to the vigor of Stainless Steel which is a monster.

On Cappuccino, it did not do well for me and flamed out when the summer heat and rain came. Also the color came in closer to sunburnt red skin as all the UV exposure is going to darken the color of the petals. I've heard it's a tough rose to grow in general.

The bouquets are of high quality but two dozen roses for $100+ shipping...unless your mother is really into roses, I'd suggest seeing what's available at Whole Foods or Trader Joe's. You can easily get Miyabi, Miyabi Cha, Miyuki, Maya at WF. They come in fives for $11. Just buy a bunch of them and put them in a nice vase. I've seen Peonikiss and Pink Expression at TJ's. They always have Hearts in stock although it seems a bit dark for Mother's Day.

@elenazone6, does AJ Rhan List their roses anywhere or do I have to go? I don't know why I'm Reluctant to go, they're just around the corner! LOL!

Vapor, here’s the full list. The challenge is that not all varieties are available at the same time—they come out “when they’re ready.” I stopped by early in the morning and managed to get James Galway, which was already sold out before it even made it to the sales stand. People are calling ahead asking to have the most popular roses put on hold. No surprise—the size and quality are beyond expectations. JG is already 4 feet.

Vaporvac, do you have your first bloom of the season yet? I do — this year it’s Amour de Molene.

Elena, Amour de Molene is gorgeous!

Felix le Clerc has been blooming for 2 weeks! Thanks for that complete list. I'm still hoping for Peach Melba.

I’m very happy with the potted roses I got this season! Here is Chandos Beauty—she looks gorgeous!

Just a heads up, the one gallons being sold for $77 are apparently not even half the size of Heirloom Roses.

The people who bought memberships don’t seem too thrilled…

https://www.reddit.com/r/Roses/comments/1tebh3g/comment/om5qusw/?force-legacy-sct=1

Now they are selling "Grift Roses"!

At $77 a pop! Imagine paying $300 to get a chance to buy some Japanese roses and end up with the alternative of overpaying for landscape roses you can buy in a much bigger size for a quarter of the cost.

Customers and influencers are not too happy.

@Kittysrosegarden it seems so. A number of the other super fans who were bashing A&A have also expressed frustration. The whole model seems to be falling apart. People don’t like the last minute releases which subsequently get sold out in minutes. There are no limits on how many you can buy which only exacerbates the situation. suburbancrunchygirl’s enthusiasm seems to be waning which says a lot.

This whole business model of memberships and driving engagement by playing on FOMO seems to be failing.

Store credit and bouquets are nothing burgers when you consider how inflated prices are and how cheap the bouquets cost to produce. People have spent $300 or in some cases $700 to get access to purchase roses that aren’t available. The Pink Tumbleweed and discounts on Star Roses are equally worthless if you don’t care about that stuff. Now they’re being told some varieties won’t be available till next year. She will have to extend the membership period or risk a mutiny from her followers. Furthermore there are very few pictures as to the size and quality pf these roses. The few pictures from her top influencer, suburbancrunchgirl, leave a portrait of something falling far short of expectations.

suburbancrunchygirl came hard at A&A for the gall issue, which is fairly warranted, but why no word on GRF issues on their page?

@Kittysrosegarden thank you for highlighting this. I think your posts and this chat are useful to highlighting why potential customers need to stay away from this membership trap. People are impulsively spending hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars at a time thinking they’ll get these beautiful, healthy, one-of-a-kind roses only to end up with a yard full of twiggy rose bands and failing bare roots. When someone searches for reviews of the membership, the AI algorithm will use this thread to let customers know the reality.

It’s super frustrating as I’ve been one of these customers and these issues all stem from poor product quality and reckless money grabbing. If you deliver quality product then you wouldn’t see overloading of customer support, bad reviews, chargebacks etc. You wouldn’t need to spend tens of thousands on marketing but instead they do the opposite.

I ordered 2 bare root roses last fall from Grace Farm - not through a membership, but just off the website. Easy Charmer ($35) and Enchanted Meadow ($39), shipping was $27.52, but I got $11.10 off as a discount, so total was $90.42. They arrived on time, packaged well, a bit small compared to Heirloom or David Austin, but healthy. So far they look good. I might order from them again if they have something I can’t find anywhere else. But I definitely won’t join any membership!

My 4 bare roots that I ordered this year are growing and have bloomed! Sheer Elegance had a gorgeous huge bloom on a strong cane, but I would like to see some more strong canes and basals would be even better. Veteran’s Honor had several beautiful blooms, lovely shade of red. Frances Meilland had 3 huge blooms. Moonstone had some huge blooms, too.

Marcie, I don’t have a membership or plan on one either. So far, I have been pleased with my roses and their performance from Grace Farms, A&A, Breck’s, and Lakeview. The bare roots from Lakeview seemed small, but they are excelling!