Understood....I know how they work....they are preticated on surface tension and for a "lite" rain that is probably fine....what I'm talking about is a gully washer...it would seem to me (an uneducated mind though it is) that in a heavy rain, the water will wash off the roof with enough volicity that the surface tension principle wont work and the water will just shoot past the rolled upper edge.

The guy is comming out tomorrow and he comes highly recommended by several different people, so...I guess we'll see : )

I'm sorry, I don't know the name of the gutter shields, they came with the house. They are a perforated type, so some debris will get in, but not enough to easily clog the gutters. There have been days when I've had 8 inches of rain, no overflow.

Calling an expert for an opinon and estimate is a good move. Best of luck to you and let us know how it works out.

This post was edited by catkim on Thu, Jun 20, 13 at 14:16

{{gwi:34908}}

This type of gutter guard is reccomended for pine needles.

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:34908}}

This post was edited by bigbigblake on Thu, Jun 20, 13 at 19:48

Verdict is in. Had the contractor out here and he would do the job for about 2.4K for 246 lenier feet of gutter. BUT......and I didn't think of this before and I should have....I have a copper drip edge and the manufacture will not warintee the gutters due to the electrolysis (dissimilar metals) that will occur. Add to that that my fascia board is covered in stainless steel so it makes installation harder as their "self piercing" screws will not self pierce.

Soooooo........wish me luck grading laying down plastic and stoning. : ). It was worth a shot.

Chris,

Googled cost of new gutters. See link below. Went to another - there are a lot to choose - used my zip and your 246', came up with $867 for the better gutters. I think that contractor sounds like a scamster.

Rosie, hoping you can get them.

Here is a link that might be useful: gutter pricing

I've done a little research and that is about in line with what the rest of the guys in this area charge for commercial style gutters with a cover that is suppose to keep pine needles out and minimize over wash. However, it doesn't matter because I can't put them up anyway as the aluminium and copper don't get along. Thanks for your help! : )

Chris

Call me stubborn, but I really want you to find a solution, Chris. One question: why commercial style gutters? Also hoping you can solve the incompatibility issue. Don't understand the whys of it. Arrgghhh.

Found this link. As I optimistically read it, sounds like a solution may be at hand.

Best, Rosie

Here is a link that might be useful: copper-aluminum - how to avoid problems

Rosie..

Thank you for the effort you're putting forth on my behalf, you're very kind. I read the article and found it very interesting. However, here's the thing, even if you somehow separate the copper and the aluminum, the screws that are used to secure the gutters will pierce both metals and make the connection electrically. The metals don't even really have to touch...the same thing will happen if they are in close proximity, it'll just take a little longer. The other solution is to remove all the copper drip edge and replace it with something else. I suppose this is an alternative, but I am not willing to have that done. Copper will last forever and whatever I replace it will will eventually fail. The rock was delivered today and I am going to move forward with my original plan. If it is carefully designed, I believe it will work just fine. IF you're interested, I will be happy to keep you updated on my progress and ultimate success or failure. If not, no harm, no foul. Regardless, thank you again for your continued interest, it's because of people like you that many of us enjoy the success that we do. : ). Thanks Rosie.

Chris

I'd absolutely like to hear of your progress, Chris. I lived with a persistent water in the basement problems for many years.

Best wishes, Rosie

p.s. hadn't noticed y'all lived on a lake. Now officially jealous.
Ha!

OK...against everyone's advice, I put plastic down and covered it with rock since I could not really do gutters. First I cleaned all the crap out of the beds and then I used sand to fill low spots and I graded it so that there would be good flow down to the bottom of the sale. I have only done a realitvly small section until I see if its going to work...I need a torrential downpour!!

The previous pic showed the area before I did anything, the one below shows some of the low areas up close to the house after I removed all the debris and crap out....

Another one showing low area and incorrect grade...although I am not sure you can tell in the photos....

Brought up to grade using sand.....

Brought up to grade using sand.....

Plastic laid down....hole around each bush was enlarged to approximately the drip line and landscaping fabric was used directly around the bushes....

And again....

And the final product....

And again.....

Last one..... : )

And the final product....

{{!gwi}}

My condolences to you, brother.

:-)

That bad, eh? We shall see my friend...wouldn't be the first time I screwed up, nor will it be the last : )

That bad, eh? We shall see my friend...wouldn't be the first time I screwed up, nor will it be the last : )

Well, if that doesn't beat all. Snarkiness has no place here. Wish you'd just go away.

Did you cover the brick weeping holes or do you not have those in this type of home? Here in Texas, that would be a serious mistake.

If you're speaking to me, Rosie, I guess you don't get that the little smiley face means I'm speaking tongue-in-cheek ... not seriously. I don't think the same can be said of your rude comment.

Chris -

You will watch those plants slowly die with the plastic.

Yard....I understood the context of your comment, no worries....

Rosie....Thank you for looking out for me.....us newbies need all the help we can get...espically me!

pk ponder...no weep holes in this type of construction...good point though...

All....I do realize that it is entirely possible I will watch these plants die a slow and painful death due to the plastic. It's a matter of priorties though. I have a substantial amount of water seeping into the basement after a heavy rain. It's not good for the block long term as I am sure you all know. So....I neeeded to get the water away from the house. Be cause I have a copper drip edge, gutters are not an option. What I have done will get the water away from the house and thus fix the seepage problem. I did what I could to ensure the plants survuival and am even thinking of install a soaker type irrigation system to suppliment the water intake. The only OTHER option would have been to bring a backhoe in, dig down to the foundation 7 feet below and install or repair the french drain system around the footings in which case I KNOW I would have lost the plants. My solution may not work and if I lose the plants, I lose them....better then having the walls continue to detetorate due to constant moisture. We shall see. : )

Chris, it looks like you have window wells. Do the eaves overhang far enough to protect them from rain? I may have missed this in your narrative -- are you sure they aren't one source of your water penetration? Even if they have drains in the bottom, they could be a problem ... especially if the drains clog up, as we found out.

If you look at the pics you'll see a piece of wood on the outside of each window well that is tilted. That is directly under the drip edge of the roof and deflects the water coming off the roof. There are drains in the bottom if the wells and as you said, they are totally plugged with 60 years of debris. The "deflectors" keep most of the water out although you still get a lot of splatter......I doubt that in that grand scheme of things that is significant though.

Chris, have you investigated having the drains cleared out? We had that done with live oak roots invaded our main drain outlet.

Rosie

No Rosie, I haven't. These are old terracotta drains as best I can tell. I did think about it, but I am not even sure where they go to. I would suspect they tie into the french drain system at the foundation and I am sure that the capacity of that system is diminished. As I recall when I was a child, the basement had water problems back then too so it may be they were never actually tied in, or that the foundation drains never could handle the extra load. There is at least 6 to 8inches of debris in the bottom of the wells (decaying leaves etc.) And I would forever be climbing down in there cleaning them out.

On a positive note, we had a real gully washer yesterday and the area that I have worked on appeared to be draining as I intended......the only question is whether I left enough openings so that the azaleas don't die off.....

IMO, a couple of things should be done, Chris. Get a shop vac going to remove debris. Then keep it done. Then get those lines cleared. Also, drip irrigation would benefit the azaleas. It would be a hell of a shame to lose those established plants.

Glad to hear drainage appeared to work. Here, you could have put it to the test much sooner. We've had way too much rain.

Thanks for the suggestion Rosie. I have looked at the opening to those "well drains", and it's hard backed debris and I am sure that it would take some type of power snake to cut that stuff out of there as I would suspect it is packed all the way to the main drains would would be another 3 or 4 feet down.

I suspect I will put in some kind of drip irrigation to supplement the water supply to those plants. I would hate to lose them as well. The have bueatiful coral colored blooms when in bloom. I'll keep you updated. : )

Chris, power snake is what I had in mind. Maybe you could find someone who'd do it for a great price if he could do it at his convenience, meaning when he didn't have any jobs.

I have given it some thought Rosie.....my concern is that those drains appear to be vertical going straight down to the foundation drains (o course I don't know what they do below grade unless I dig them up) and running a power snake down them might get through, but the debris has no where to go but down due to gravity, further stressing an already questionable drain system. I don't know that I want to do that unless I am committed to replacing the whole works and at this point it's not an option. If my current system keeps the basement dry and doesn't kill the plants, then it's a mute point. Again thank you for all your interest and really appreciate all the suggestions. Keep 'em coming, lord knows I can use all the help I can get! : ).

I have given it some thought Rosie.....my concern is that those drains appear to be vertical going straight down to the foundation drains (o course I don't know what they do below grade unless I dig them up) and running a power snake down them might get through, but the debris has no where to go but down due to gravity, further stressing an already questionable drain system. I don't know that I want to do that unless I am committed to replacing the whole works and at this point it's not an option. If my current system keeps the basement dry and doesn't kill the plants, then it's a mute point. Again thank you for all your interest and really appreciate all the suggestions. Keep 'em coming, lord knows I can use all the help I can get! : ).

Quick thought - when we had drains cleared, the guy's auger brought them up and out - guess via a reversing mechanism. In essence, he cut them, then evacuated from the hole. Probably ran it thru twice, can't recall.

Chris, you might also look into window well covers. Those boards only work with straight-down rain. Mix a little wind with the rain and the wells be take on water, unless you cover them.

Also, if you ever do get the drains cleared out, the covers help keep leaves and debris from clogging them again.

We had problems with window wells leaking in a previous home and the covers helped it immensely.

Rosie...

The auger type snakes work that way. Even so, I am sure that some will be lost down into the main system. Currently that system works well enough to control the ground water when it comes up and I would rather not jerpordize that.

Mimi....

I had actually thought about well covers. My imeadiate concern of course would be the loss of light into the basement. I would assume they can be made out of plexglass, but I suspect they would be quite expensive to have them custom made and if I made them out of wood (which I did consider) I would lose what little light I have down there (yes I have lights). However, it is worth thinking about. : )

Rosie...

The auger type snakes work that way. Even so, I am sure that some will be lost down into the main system. Currently that system works well enough to control the ground water when it comes up and I would rather not jerpordize that.

Mimi....

I had actually thought about well covers. My imeadiate concern of course would be the loss of light into the basement. I would assume they can be made out of plexglass, but I suspect they would be quite expensive to have them custom made and if I made them out of wood (which I did consider) I would lose what little light I have down there (yes I have lights). However, it is worth thinking about. : )

Chris, you can either buy prefab plexiglass window well covers or make your own, with a wood frame and a sheet of plexiglass. I built my own, because our window wells were larger than any prefab I could find. Just make sure they slope away from the wall.

Understood. As I said, I did think about that initially, but elected not to do it for several reasons. The percentage of the time that the wind would blow hard enough to divert the run off into the well for a significant length of time seem relatively small to me. That may be flawed logic and if I find that to be the case, I can always add them later. : )

A more labor-intensive solution to altering a site with poor drainage is to excavate the soil and install underground drainage tiles or plastic pipes. Also you can plant lots of moisture-loving plants and turn the damp area into a bog garden.

For those of you that remember this thread and/or are still interested, I finished the redesign of the flower beds. Had a couple of torrential down pours the other day and the basement is totally dry. I went out and looked during the heavest part of the rain and the water was rushing down the through the swale. So far so good. The shrubery seems to be flourshing with much new growth, but I do realize it is still early in the game and any effects from water starvation make may take a while to show up. We'll see. I will post later on with an update.

Thanks to all who provided input. it was truly apprecaited!!

Chris

Glad to know you solved the basement water prob Chris. Great news. Azaleas look nice. Wish you'd consider letting themgrow a bit to achieve a more natural look.

Happy for your success.
Rosie

Well Hey there Rosie.....

The are already almost touching each other as it is , and if I allow them to go any higher it will obstruct the view from the two bedrooms. I do have some that are planted inside the driveway round about that I have not touched.....some of those are 10 feet tall. Lost a few of them a few years back in a Nor Easter, but they are slowly coming back. Take care Rosie! : )

Question(s). (Not an expert or garden person at all) Is there a reason you used sand and not dirt under the plastic? Was the plastic just plain black plastic or was it the black weed liner material? Have a similar situation. No gutters, washed out areas. No basement though but trying to pinpoint or at least aid a moisture problem under our doublewide.

Norma08, create a new thread where you can explain your problem.