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andrelaplume2

Toro Personal Pace engine choice

12 years ago

Well, I may try the coil (thats another thread) but if that fails I think I am opting to replace my 1999 or so Personal Pace with the new model with the Chinese engine. The dealer said the Personal Pace with the Honda engine is not worth the $50 premium. He said that particular Honda engine is also made in China and has a variety of internal parts that are plastic whereas the toro counter part contains metal parts. I do not recall the exact parts he mentioned. As far as parts and pricing, he said the toro uses the same air filter as the briggs. He said the carb is about $5 more than the old Briggs. He said parts are readily available. I expressed concerns with the primeless starting. He admitted there potentially could be more issues down the road with this �newer� more complicated starting systems however, of all the engines, so far he has seen the most issues arising with Briggs engines without the primer on the cheaper toro models. Finally he said it�s also easier for warranty work, if necessary, to go through Toro.

I do not like the Honda mowers, they do not mulch as well and spew crap out the sides. I am pretty much sold on Toro...just the choice of engines I must decide...
Thoughts...?

Comments (9)

  • 12 years ago

    Yes, the OHC Honda engines use a resin cam and a polymer cam pulley. Then there's the timing belt. But, the GCV160 has proven itself here in the USA. I've owned one for several years and I'm now using a mower with the GSV190 - same thing but bigger and commercial-rated. I've been associated with two other GCVs, both heavily used and neglected. Neither one had any engine problem of any kind, although the one I still see from time to time will be scrapped soon because of a rotting deck. The previous owner didn't do any maintenance or cleaning and the grass build-up has nearly corroded away the discharge box on the rear. Nevertheless, it still doesn't burn or use oil and it continues to perform with full capability. The Honda OHC engines are tough. They're also quiet, fuel-efficient and strong for their size.
    Personally, a Honda OHC engine on a Toro makes a premium mower in my book.
    BTW, the Honda multi-purpose power equipment engine facility in Swepsonville, NC, makes over 1.5 million engines a year. Honda also makes engines and mowers in other parts of the world to the same standards. These are the most advanced mower engines available, period.

  • 12 years ago

    thanks saxman. Is the carb on the Honda plastic? It does not sound serviceable...do you just replace them? Are they Cheap? How often?

    If I understand the current promotion, the Honda toro is not on sale. It is $600.

    The toro toro (so to speak) is on sale for $499.

    Is it worth an extra $100 for the Honda.

    Is the 160 underpowered? Is it made in NC?

  • 12 years ago

    I've never had to touch a Honda carb but it seems to me that they are metal. From what I've gathered on here over the years they're also inexpensive to replace. I could not tell you where a particular engine was made, but I would trust a Honda engine made in China over a Toro engine made in China. Toro never made a lawn mower engine until they bought Lawn-Boy and continued to make the 2-cycles - they mostly used B&S, Tecumseh and more recently some Honda. I simply don't trust a Toro-branded engine that they obviously did not design. They simply went looking for an economy engine that could easily be adapted for their use. Who knows how long it will take to discover all the potential problems with it? That's why I favor the proven GCV over the 'Toro' engine.
    Under-powered? Not in my experience. What gets you is they SOUND like they are under-powered, but they do the same work as a loud old flathead engine. They are deceptively quiet and smooth.
    Good luck on your choice and I hope you get a great new mower. Oh, as for sale prices, don't forget to check the on-line retailers like Speedway and Wise.

  • 12 years ago

    The spare parts for the Chinese engines are not widely stocked at local dealers, but can be ordered and received in a few days. The report card is still out on the china engines. I believe quality is improving.

    the Honda ohc is a very cheaply built engine, but is also a very nice running engine that is usually easy to start, Removing the top blower cover and fuel tank is very easy - only three nuts. The carburetor is metal and does not cause many problems. Removing and reinstalling the carburetor is more difficult than the other engine brands. In my experience, the Honda auto choke has more problems than the briggs system.

    Most repair shops have parts for the flathead briggs quantum. this is a solid engine, but will require servicing more frequently than the Honda OHC. dirt collects in the cooling fins and carburetor. These areas will probably need attention every 4-5 years

  • 12 years ago

    Honestly, Toro parts have been getting so comparatively pricey, it is hard to recommend them. Nice mowers but the import engine? Quite frankly I find the engine price points by them insulting as a consumer if they are as you have described. You one think that you would get a 190 for the money. As indicated in an earlier post you made- search the web for a non current or have the dealer you know and love look for one.

  • 12 years ago

    my dealer was not so much questioning the quality of the Honda engine..they simply relayed to me that:

    1) in their repair experience, the Toro engine has held up well over the past few years.

    2) Honda is a real pain to work with in that they question everything related to warranty work. They said they hardly ever get questioned by Toro when an issue arises. Honda makes it more difficult for them.

    Personally, I think the Honda engine has proven itself so I might opt for that one anyway...the issue is right now the Honda model is not on sale making the cost $1000 more instead of $50.

    Anyway, I picked up a used coil and installed it and my old PP and it actually ran fine today...maybe I have bought myself a little time before I need to make this decision!

  • 12 years ago

    As far as I know, the the Honda GCV 160 & 190 engines sold in this country are made at the Honda engine plant in NC. I can't see Honda going to the expense of shipping engines made in China to the USA when they have a plant here that makes the same engine.

  • 10 years ago

    I have a garage full of Honda power equipment. My Honda trimmer and snow blower have worked ridiculously well, however my lawnmowers have been truly disappointing and expensive. My 7 year old HRR model blew a transmission in its first year, and recently the engine expired. The dealer showed me the expired internals and I was amazed at the high wear, particularly when I've used Mobil 1 oil for the mowers life. I've replaced the unit with a Toro Personal Pace that has a cast aluminum deck - and the Chinese engine. I was told that there were issues with the Chinese engine in its first year, however Toro resolved these issues and the engine is working fine since. I'm keeping my fingers crossed on this mower. So far it cuts better, is quieter, and starts on the first pull. I'm a Honda guy, but in light of what happened to my mower, I cannot recommend the latest Honda lawn mower engines.

  • 10 years ago

    I ended up with the PP with Chinese engine...second year now...no issues. My fatherinlaw may he rip :( had gotten the $299 Honda jobber....I hate it...horrible mulcher. It does seem to run well though.