In the transition area, nothing does great. A shade mix consisting of certain varieties of tall fescue and creeping red fescue is going to be your best bet for growing by seed.

Dwarf Fescues are very drought and shade tolerant, and they resemble the look and color of Kentucky Bluegrass alot MUCH better than Turf-Type Tall Fescue.

Do a search online.

the soft, tall fescues
huh?

tall fescues commonly used up in suburbia around Metro Detroit
huh?

Auteck,

One of us is confused. My understanding is that the Dwarf varieties are a type of Turf-type Tall Fescue. So, a particular dwarf Tall Fescue would be considered a Dwarf Turf-Type Tall Fescue.

For what it is worth, my understanding is that the dwarf varieties are more prone to drought and disease than the non-dwarf TTTF.

Welcome to the "middle." The summer is going to rough up any cool season grass and the winter is still too long for warm season grass to be a good choice. In partial shade, you are probably best off with a mix that is mostly tttf with a little fine or creeping fescue mixed in. It will stay green for most of the year without much help from you, but you will likely need to water to keep it green in summer. Unfortunately, tttf doesn't spread, so you will likely have to overseed every year or 2 to keep it nice and thick.

Turf Toes,

To answer your question:

Common Tall Fescue: Kentucky 31

This is a VERY old cultivar, one of the originals. It's corse and bright green and it grows VERY fast. It's basically a pasture grass, although some people use it as turf grass because it's cheap.

Turf-Type Tall Fescue: The Rebels, Penn1901, Palmer's Choice, etc.

Are MUCH better looking than the original K31. Finer bladed, dark green color, etc.

Dwarf Fescue: Mowless, Medallion, Bonsai, Emeral Fescue.

Finer bladed than TTTF, some cultivars are darker green than others, low growing, can easely be mowed at 1 1/2 to 2 inches - unlike Tall Fescue. Dwarf fescue is used primarily as a residential lawn and especially valuable in the transition zone of the U.S. where temperature extremes are possible.

http://www.highcountrygardens.com/catalog/product/52000/

A picture of Dwarf Fescue:

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auteck - is that what you have? I'm just across town from you and if you have dwarf fescue I'd like to pick your brain.

I also always thought that the dwarf varieties were not as tolerant of drought and fungi, etc as TTTF. Maybe I was wrong.

auteck - one more question: is that a stamped concrete patio? Looks very nice and about the exact color and pattern that I'd like to resurface my patio.

Auteck, I understand your division/categories based on description, but you can't redefine things based on your opinion or favor, even if it helps you tell the difference between the ones you mention. You don't want to confuse those you are trying to advise and help and those who are reading these boards whether you're trying to help them or not. Species and types of all grasses, whether turf type, forage, graze/pasture, or meadow, are already clearly defined and classified by higher powers than us.

What Turf Toes was trying to tell you is tall fescue is tall fescue because tall fescue is a species of grass. It is not a description of individual varieties or cultivars.

Within the species of tall fescue are many varieties and cultivars, all of which express individual traits and characteristic although many share the same or are similar in traits and characteristics.

Some of these traits and characteristics include growth habit, seedling vigor, shade tolerance, drought tolerance, disease resistance/susceptibility, genetic color, leaf texture, and so on.

Dwarf is a description that denotes the growth habit characteristic.

There is much more but this should clear things up for now.

jimtnc,

I could be wrong. But it seems that that picture isn't of his yard. The domain name for the site hosting that picture is for some landscaping company.

http://www.oclandscape.com/newport/new/planting/slides/plant02.jpg

Thanks, turf...I think you're right.

I normally agree with Auteck but the dwarf tttf varieties I have are not too good for color. Penn 1901 and bonsai were towards the end of the ntep ratings so I went with matador and solid gold.

Joe,

Those "soft tall fescues" in Detroit to which you referred, were fine fescues, not tall fescue. Same genus, but different species. Also much different look, feel, and performance. In general, the fine fescues don't like hot weather. This is particularly true of strong creeping red, and slender creeping. I suspect our transition zoners will, rightly, steer you toward tall fescue, a much better adapted species for your area.

We like to talk about "cultivars" of various grasses. This is short for cultivated variety. Turfgrass breeders are always developing new and better strains of our favorite grasses, and it is worth the while of every homeowner to use the best new cultivars they can find. For tall fescue, look for any of the following: Falcon IV, Rebel IV, 2nd Millenium, Justice, Guardian 21, Finelawn Elite, and Bingo. I'm sure I've missed some good ones, too.

A.J.

jimtnc,

No, I don't have that kind of fescue nor it's my backyard. It's a picture of Dwarf Fescue I found online.

Where exactly are you located? If you're close enough you can come by my house and I will give you a tour of my lawn as well as my neighbors.

bestlawn,

Fescues are divided into sub-species of shorter fine grasses and tall grasses; each having individual characteristics and specified use. The three major species currently being used in home lawns were listed, with the exception of Creeping Red and Hard Fescue (shade tolerant fescues)

Turf toes asked for advise, and that's exactly what I've provided. It's important to know that there are differences amongst Turf Type Fescues, and he should know.
Turf-type Tall Fescue and Dwarf Fescue have different characteristics, and should be noted.

I'm not much of Fescue person; I personally do not like the "bunch" type and coarse bladed turf it produces, so I stay out of it. However, If I had to use Fescue I will use the Dwarf type because it's much closer in looks and performance to Bluegrass than Tall Fescues.

Dwarf Fescue can be mowed at 1 or 1 1/2 inches if desired during the cooler months of the growing season, while Tall Fescue will most likely be killed.

My explanation of the 3 different types of Fescues currently available and being used for home lawns is accurate. There's nothing confusing about it, maybe you are confuse, and if so, please read again.

That was sooooo jakked up it isn't worth addressing.

Turf Toes, you know you were right. Nuff said.