Certainly the ones on the right seem to have more robust root systems, don't they?

They do indeed!

If I wanted to be more thorough I'd lop the topgrowth off, shake off the roots and weigh each with a scale. I'll probably do that *AFTER* the later, indeterminate tomatoes start producing and these are on their way downhill. Though if there are myco fungi in my garden soils, that might throw off the experiment once they get planted out.

Cucumbers and summer squash in a month or so...

Too early for a conclusion, obviously, but the difference is apparent. This will be fun to follow. The least developed of the inoculated roots looks better than the best of the non-.

These informal tests are worthwhile horticulturally (and I have seen encouraging suggestions with my own trial use on ailing pawpaws) but one has to realize that a rigorous test would differ. First and foremost, the "control" (without the fungi) would be conducted WITH the same "fillers" or "carriers" used with the fungi product but without the micro-organisms. These might well have fertilizer or root-stimulent strength aside or beyond the presence of the fungi.

Excellent point, gonebananas.

I'll try (within reason) to identify and duplicate the fillers for the control group. :)

Suggestion being that the myco-spore products may simply be spiked with salt fertilizers, especially salts of phosphate? Ground very finely so they are hard to notice?

I don't believe that gonebananas was suggesting that anything underhanded was going on.

Most myco products are mixed with fillers or carriers that to help support the growth of the mycorrhizae. It is possible that these fillers could be of some benefit to the soil life and the plant even without viable mycorrhizea spores present in the products, that's all.

Bananas was just suggesting a way to make anyone's trials more valid.

This being informal, it should be considered a "given" that it won't meet the standards of rigorous scientific methodology. Once ralleia has her sterile level 5 bio-lab constructed we can hold her to a higher level of expectations. Until then, it's an interesting opportunity to see some tangible results. We really won't know anything until she ships us all some tomatoes to taste.

Could get closer to rigor by doing a 3rd batch with myco-product that one has intentionally sterilized, maybe in the oven or something like that?

Could you explain how you inoculated them? Did you dissolve the material in water and drench the soil? And what is the composition of your media for the seedlings? Have you used any fertilizer or additive? I would like to try something like this and I appreciate what you are sharing.

I just love to see results... Great experiment... Please keep showing your results... I am wondering what your potting mix is comprised of. Was wondering if someone used some not sterile mix (say compost, loam, peat and perlite) if the results would be similar or not as noticeable.

Good idea about trying to sterilize the produce, pnbrown! I was going nuts trying to find out what fillers were in there that would need to be duplicated.

To inoculate transplants with a powdered product, one simply sprinkles a teaspoon of powder onto the roots. I try not to disturb the roots and only apply it to the exterior--once colonized it will spread. Water in afterwards. Here's an Old German tomato being inoculated to give you a mental image of how it is done.

{{gwi:137666}}

Alternatively, one can put a little bit of the powder under the seed when planting. For established plants, one has to dig probe holes to get the powder in contact with the roots, which isn't something I've tried yet.

My potting media is "Ultimate Potting Mix" by fertiloam. It has sphagnum peat moss, perlite, limestone, a starter charge, and wetting agents. No fertilizers for these seedlings yet besides the starter charge in the mix and diluted "worm tea" collected from vermiculture drippings. Soon they'll get some worm castings and a basic fertilizer mix of bloodmeal, bonemeal, and wood ash, once I determine what is safe for the fungi. High phosphorous levels (over 2% by weight) can apparently damage them.

Maybe a little later I can try incorporating some non-sterile component (compost only though--there's not really loam to be found in this clay ground).

I had a number of potted pawpaws (Asimina) in 10 gallons of bark-based artificial soil that just were a bit "anemic," i.e., slightly chlorotic or yellowish, though some were worse with leaves yellower or stunted a bit.

Pawpaws long have had a reputation for difficulty in growth, with soil inoculation from an established natural pawpaw patch, plentiful vermiculite, and even gibberellic-acid treatment of roots in transplanting proposed decades ago.

I made a thin slurry with commercial mychorrhiza powder, pushed a pointed 1/2-inch diameter rod down several places among the roots in the pots, and poured in slurry, then later squeezed the drained holes shut.

It was not a rigorous test in that I (1) had no controls, and (2) started to use alfalfa as a fertilizer because I read (albeit in a nonauthoritative source) that the fungi work best in making nutrients available from an organic source, and finally (3) the bark-based soil mixture had had another year to decompose more.

Nonetheless, my chronic multi-year problem did notably wane for most plants (but not all). My concern was far more for solving the problem than determining what exactly caused or solved it.

I wish I could find a reasonably priced commercial source of fungi in less than a pound measure.

Did you pull the non-mycorrhizal plants out of the pots too, just to duplicate the mechanical aspect of transplanting? Or did you only pull out the innoculated plants?

We all have different definitions of "informal," apparently.

No, since this wasn't a formal test, I didn't pull the plants that were not to be inoculated out of the pots. :)

However, the "control" indeterminate tomatoes that I did a couple days ago *were* pulled out of the pots and dusted with powder that I hope to have rendered sterile by baking in in the oven for about an hour at 200 degrees F. Not the most pleasant odor, mind you.

Thinking about it tonight I realize that I should have had a control control too, that wasn't dusted with anything at all, to see if there was a marked difference between the fillers and totally untreated, and/or to help diagnose whether the sterilization was successful. Too late to do that with the tomatoes now--everything has already been dusted with live or sterilized.

By next year I'll have a better system worked out. For this year we shall have to muddle through with less-than-perfect comparisons. :)

No critisizm intended. I appreciate what you are doing, and I think you experimental design is fine :) I do these types of experiments with my gardening as well. Besides, others researchers have conducted these same types of experiments on a larger scale with all of the controls and have had similar results as you have shown. You have a control, the four plants not treated. Thats probably good enough to have some meaningful results.

This is fascinating! Looking forward to the updates.

And if we send you a stamped self addressed envelope, can we take part in the taste testing part of the experiment? :)

No follow ups or what?

The differences is in the roots in the pic, I am wondering what the differences in the top of the plants after 30 days.

I am very interested in this thread, specifically:
* Has anyone gotten any results from their more-recent tests?
* I also wonder if anyone else has tried these techniques on any other types of plants, like trees, and
* have new mycorrhizal products turned up in the marketplace that anyone wants to comment on?

Thanks for all the interesting info! I love it!

I am very interested in this thread, specifically:
* Has anyone gotten any results from their more-recent tests?
* I also wonder if anyone else has tried these techniques on any other types of plants, like trees, and
* have new mycorrhizal products turned up in the marketplace that anyone wants to comment on?

Thanks for all the interesting info! I love it!

Mycorrhiza refers to a relationship, a mutually beneficial or symbiotic relationship, some fungi form with plants. There are many fungi that form these relationships not just one. There simply is no such thing as a mycorrhizal fungi.

Here is a link that might be useful: About Mycorrhizal fungi

Your links don't work for me.

I also did my own trial if I can get the photo option to work as I want. I also plan on using the mycos on cuttings and transplants this spring.

After I week of use of mycorrhizae on cuttings. Normal rootball- no mycos

and again with use