Being aware of crown rot you might be vigilant about moisture remaining in the crown. Crown rot is not confined to crowns its just most injurious to the phal there. What about elsewhere on the main stalk? Do you water from the top like most of us? Could be water in those leaf axils.

H

Shoot! Yeah, I water from the top. You think you're being compulsive about getting all the water ...

Any remedies?

Thanks, Whitecat8

I've had this happen and never figured out why. Might be as Howard states, but I never had it kill a plant. I suspect (and could be totally wrong) water may have gotten into those leaf junctions but never spread enough to cause a full crown rot. I have also suspected chilling could have brought it on with some damage to that area. When it has happened it is mostly this time of the year or early spring. I suspect temperature/water.

Let the plant dry out and keep it warm - emphasis on warm.

Jane

WC I responded to your other post about not blooming. They are connected Some stuff for you to think about and fiddle with:

I strongly suspect a heat issue. Inconsistent heat both indoors and outdoors which fall short meeting the cultural needs of the plant. Contrary to the opinions on this board, there are specific cultural requirements with only a smal margin of swing. It really isn't a question of the famous discalimer "it works for my conditions".

Consider a G/H situation. They sucessfully grow and bloom 10's of dozens of species/hybrids under 1 roof. What do they have going for them? Consistent General Culture. ~ 80 day, 60 night. That cultural generalisation fits 99% of orchids. Any orchid from Dracs to Phals will thrive under those conditions. We have 1 advantage indoors in the consitency department; Light 365 days a year. We also can acheive stable temps with some effort.

We are at that time of year in Northern zones where heat is tremendously inconsistent in our grow areas. We click the heat on when we come home from work or 1st thing in the morning. Not good for orchids to have an increase in heat after the lights have gone off or are just revving up. We need to be comfortable and so do they. Unfortunately, we need comforatble temps at times that they don't.

I started to have yellowing leaves until I got the small orchidarium room fully operational. The heat is ultra consistent. The vent is closed in this room. The CFL's are basically heating this room consistently. I'm running about 80 day 60 night. I also see some yellowing at my window grow area. Too cold. older growths are the 1st ones to "speak" the warning.

Secondly, You may want to check your air movement, especially if you are growing on shelves. I ran into that problem too. Again it relates to heat. The plants were being overheated on the middle shelves. I had to run a small adjunct fan. Too much heat was being trapped by the lights. Air movement solves that. I cannot stress the importance of moving air. It is critical to maintaining health and temps. We don't get too much fresh air in the colder months, vigalence is necessary, along with a filter change.

A phal needs consistent heat year round. If this plant has been out all summer, it expects the same temps when it is brought inside. Who likes to live at 80+ indoors? The biiger cfl's assist in maintaining heat levels. If you recall, H said that putting them out may not be the best thing. I agree. The action of bringing them in stresses them. They are plunged into what they perceive as cold and dak. Reaction is bound to happen. Just as they are adjusting to being brought in, we start stressing them with inconsistent and inappropritae heat. 2 large abrupt changes in a short period of time can make them protest.

I am concerned about the turgidity of the leaves. They seem to be curling downwards. If I am seeing your pic correctly all the bottom leaves have turned yellow?? Is that right or is it the lighting? All but the newer leaves have yellowed? It doesn't appear that way in the top pic but the side view it does look that way.

Assuming I am reading the pic correctly, the curling and yellowing usually indicates that the plant is not getting taking up enough water through the root system and may be on the slide. I also see an abundance of aerials. Something may be off in the mix. ( see the too many aerial root post) You may want to think about a "winter mix" and while you're at it check for root loss. When I see the downward curling leaves and the yellowing together in "rehabs" the rot is almost always at the base of the plant under the media. The main "stalk" has rotted. It's an especially bad place since the roots grow from this area. I help them along by putting the excess aerials into the mix.

Any leaf yellowing is telling you that something is not right. Usually it is heat if you have sufficient light.

Clara

All this is great info, and it's going into the files.

Jane, it's good to hear your plants have survived similar mysteries.

I just unpotted the plant - more dead roots than expected for being repotted in mid-June, & all the dead ones on the side that has the 1 yellow leaf. So, the dead roots & aerials got trimmed and aerials stuck into the sphag. In mid-June, I tucked all the aerials in the sphag, too. Hmmmm.

Tonight, the sphag was still fresh under the top layer, and moisture was uniform throughout.

Clara - Air movement - got that. However, since the chids have been inside, daily temp swings have been minimal - rarely a 10-degree difference and usually high 60s-low 70s, so maybe I should shut the door at least and possibly turn on the heater to get the max higher. Our fall has been extra mild so far. We're supposed to get the 1st hard freeze next week - finally.

Humidity runs between high 30s and mid-50s right now.

As for yellowing leaves, of 10 leaves, 3 are yellow. 1's on the bottom left; the other 2, opposite each other right in the middle. Clara, your comment made me think, though, this plant may have been off from the start - numerous, loooong aerial roots - straight from FL - all but the very top leaves have always been a bit leathery, have curled under some, and the color hasn't been just right. Nevertheless, during the 18 months I've had it, it's acted normal - put out new roots & leaves and has bloomed regularly.

Just thought - the leaves on the other Phal from that grower have always been off, but none has turned yellow, and there haven't been the # of aerial roots.

I put both those plants at risk by keeping them in the grower's Florida mix, rather than moving them to sphag right away.

Bottom line - because all the other Phals are thriving, including species, I'm wondering if water sat at the base of those leaves.

Much food for thought.

Many thanks, Whitecat8

Fl grower...mmm.. intersting. I have my theories about moving plants that were raised in sub-tropical zones. Coming from Fl I can say with near certainty your phals are protesting the lack of heat factor. The temps you quote are night temps(?) You have to realise that it doesn't get below 70 very often at night; only for a few months in winter. (usually jan feb-ish) Once they're raised in a FL G/H I swear some never get used to another climate. It's kind of like me. :-)

I brought some up when I moved. Some turned into mush bombs right away, others took their time. But like you say, they are just never right. I don't buy too many things from distant zones anymore, especially if the G/H is doing the raising/cloning. The plants seem to do 1 of 2 things: struggle/fail to bloom or they end up in Mush Bomb condition. I thought I was the only one. Don't know what the FL mix was but I remember a lot in chc. My phals still do best in chc. Stays wetter than bark and more aerated than spag.

If it was an other plant with a yellow leaf I would say it was due to the prolonged fall. I have that issue too. But not a phal

Clara
Looking for her own winter spag coat

Clara, Your comments make me wonder if it's all the Florida Factor. There's a 3rd plant from that grower I forgot about last night because it doesn't do anything - just sits there w/ its 3 leaves. Across town, though, my buddy's has bloomed, and to be fair, for several months mine was loose in the pot.

The other large one is the Phal Cameo, which has been in bloom since early June. (I posted pix on the Gallery.) Also, it won a 1st place at the little State Fair show, but that could have been just for the flowers and not the plant.

The mix for all 3 was bark and rock & something else - didn't recognize it. The grower said they got "natural" sponge rock from a local quarry.

Big Leaf's Phals are doing fine here, but they're smaller and often come from Thailand(?).

If you sweep the floor, you may have enough sphag for that coat. I would here. :)

Thanks, Whitecat8

I still go for wet and cold. Warm it up and see what happens. Most of our plants come from warm climates. If it were new I'd say it was adjusting, but you've had it for a while. I've had it happen and the plant turned around.

Also, I know I'll get flack for this, but I do not believe in burying aerial roots. They are adapted for air growing. I always leave them be.

Jane

Jane,

Thank you. I'll get the Phal nice and toasty.

Gosh, my experience is too limited to know about aerial roots one way or another, but word is you have most amazing and beauteous plants - as if they'd all been grown in a G/H. Stands to reason your Phals loooooove their aerials.

Thank you, Whitecat8

Geeze Whitecat...Clara and Howard had too much wine.

Wish it were true though.

Jane

Perception is reality, and their perceptions offer pictures of lush, well-grown realities. :) WC8

No flack from me Jane on aerial roots. Bad watering/medium may be the cause of some aerials running rampant but when you use clear pots, can see inside roots and know how old the medium is and they STILL want to ramble, I let them win. I have one huge phal that has sent two aerials straight up - they never even sniffed the medium. I think it is because I have so many lower leaves on the plant and the aerials are so high up, it was easier for them to grow up than fight through the leaves to grow down.

whitecat if your plants were outside taking advantage of free water and sun, water stayed in the leaf bracts and popped a little bacteria. With a phal with that many leaves it would be easy for the moisture to be trapped.

Taiwan, not Thailand, and mine are doing great.

Brooke

WC save that spag! Auntie Clara doesn't have a proper winter coat! I thought a spag lining would do it since I leak spag anyway! ;-)

What I said about Fl raised orchids is exactly what Jane is saying about the heat factor. They seem to be extra sensitive to under-heating. It's as if their ability to swing a few º doesn't exist. If the orchid is not at the right temp, watering will produce the yellow leaves. You are actually over-watering him if that makes sense.

I still have a a couple phals in re-hab from Fl. Interestingly, they were put out during the warm part of the summer. Did great. Grew very fast. Thought they were in the clear. When they came back in, they is slid again. The orchidarium room runs 78-80º. You would think that was hot enough. No change. The middle 2 racks run at 85+. When they live on the warmer racks, the stop their protesting. Took me 2 summers to figure it out. They seem to want a minimum of 85º or they unravel. I didn't think growing in this small room was going to be a good set up but the heat from the CFL's really works for the warm growers when you leave a couple of shelves with little "head room". Traps enough heat to give them what they want.

I always give this analogy. People go on a Miami vacation from Northern climates during holiday season. The Northerners are in shorts and t-shirts, complianing about the "heat". The locals wear sweaters and jackets. Same for the orchid. Their scale of hot and cold is very different.

I agree with not burying aerials unless the orchid is experiencing distress. At that point, it needs all the help it can get to recover. If the mix is really loose, it will do more benefit to put them in the mix than to leave them out, especially at this time of year. I usually use chc, combo of the chunky and the fluffy fine. The new aerials go right for the mix.

To clarify- the cocktails were poured after we looked at Jane's collection. (although I never really stoppped peeking) We made a beeline straight for them... who wouldn't? OMG! :-))

Jane did you find out wht that odd Aussie Den is? Its too cute!

Clara
Jane- "Cherry Cheeks" sends you a smooch! He is literally hanging around with his new friends basking under "Bertha". Thank you!

Pshaw Clara - a phal doesn't care if it was born in a FL G/H or an ILL G/H or in a Taiwanese G/H - it is the after care we give the plants in our environment, not their birthplace or where they emerged from a flask.

Brooke