Can't help with the fertilizer question, but I have read some fairly critical things of miracle grow potting soil.

Hi Edenh, I'd look at the labels to see which ones might also contain organic elements. Inorganics work fastest and flush through the soil fastest with increased water. They also are the most likely to pollute ground and other bodies of water. Being stronger, more concentrated, they're also the easiest to damage plants with. A mix of organic and inorganic would give you the best of both worlds...a fast pick-me-up for more immediate results and a longer, slower feed to even out the nutrient levels so it won't be feast or famine. You can't "burn" with organics easily, but you can over apply and cause damage. Any all purpose, "tomato" or "flower" (even specifically roses) type should be completely fine, with the best being a combination of organic and inorganic.

As for how much to use, if it suggests a table spoon per plant, I'd use less. You can't hurt anything from using less and you can always add more. It's virtually impossible to take out what's already been applied.You're likely to have a lot more rain and hose water going through those pots than many due to the climate and heat. Both of which break down time released fertilizers very quickly and flush inorganic sources of nitrogen through the soil. By having both source types of each nutrient, you'll see fast results as well as provide longer lasting supplies between feedings, and you're less likely to accidentally burn anything. I hope the suggestion helps. Kim

Hi Edenh, I am not sure about the deficiency you are seeing. My roses are in the ground so I tend to use Plant Tone. My MIL has potted roses, Osmocote is generally a good one to use...if you are looking for a specific name. Good luck.
~Rene

I don't grow roses in containers, but I remember the local nursery owner stating that she just threw a handful of Osmocote periodically on her potted flowers.

Hope that helps.

Kate

Osmocote and other time released types can be quite convenient. Just watch for how much you use and make sure it isn't clumped against the plant itself. You'll find with time released products, they give a range of time it should remain effective as the hotter and wetter it is, the faster it breaks down. Cooler and drier conditions allow it to last longer. Keep it (and all other fertilizers) as evenly spread over the surface as possible around the plant and not clumped up against the canes or shank where it can draw moisture from them as it dissolves. In cool conditions, you can get away with overfeeding. When it heats up and the stuff starts releasing quickly, heavier applications can lead to problems. It's safe and effective up to the label application rates. Kim

Fish emulsion use per the instructions

Thanks for the info! I am using drip irrigation as I am expanding my "garden area". I am a bit concern with using time released fertilizer because the water drips near the base of the plant. I like Kim's idea of using a mix of organic and inorganic. I think I saw plant-tone and holly-tone at Lowe's. I hope this can be used as organic part? and I like Kim's "weakly,weekly" motto. I hope the combination of Miracle grow Bloom Buster and the plant-tone/holly-tone would be enough. I am going to repot them into 7 gallon pots with miracle grow potting soil. I also have mushroom compost and milorganite and would like to know if I can add to the miracle grow potting soil?Do I add holly-tone/plant-tone to the soil or sprinkle to the surface? Would the lime green leaves turn dark green again after fertilizing? How do I keep the pots from overheating?Florida sun is soo strong! Many thanks

My experience growing other plants in containers (I have never done that with roses, however) is that they need extra nitrogen. I think the watering process runs the fertilizers through rather quickly -- which means that the plants run short on nitrogen rather quickly, producing lighter green leaves. That is why I always use the high nitrogen version of Osmocote (they have several different kinds of fertilizer)--if I remember correctly, the nitrogen is listed as about 18. I might add that the fertilizer runs through the pot quickly enough that it does NOT feed the plant for 3 or 4 months like they claim. Probably lasts about 1 month--which tells you how quickly it loses its nitrogen!

I do grow beautiful hanging plants (non-roses)--and I use the extra high nitrogen fertilizer on them. When I run out and substitute a lower dosage (say, 4 nitrogen), my hanging plants lose their special "healthy" look--so I run out and get the high-nitrogen stuff--and before you know it, my hanging baskets start looking superb again.

I'm extrapolating from that experience to growing roses in pots. If that isn't helpful, just ignore my advise.

Kate

One easy organic thing you can do to add to your other feeding strategies is to add some alfalfa to the soil. In the ground, I just lay it on under the mulch and the worms mix it in for me - in pots you might need to mix it in a little into new soil when you top up the pots or repot them when the soil gets tired. The nice thing about organics like alfalfa is that they are naturally slow release, won't "burn" the roots, and the plants take them up when they need them, and alfalfa seems to encourage new sprouting canes from the base, or basal breaks. If you use the organic mixes like RoseTone that usually has alfalfa already in it, but the straight alfalfa is cheaper if you can't find the organic mixes.

Alfalfa is also cheap and easy to find, just not in the garden sections. Look in the pet sections, particularly those for small animals. If you only need small amounts, look for small bags in the guinea pig/rabbit section of alfalfa hay (my preference) or alfalfa pellets for rabbits, if you can find some without supplemental salts. If you need large amounts, go to a farm/feed store - I buy the 50 pound bales of alfalfa hay meant for horses and scatter them around the base of my roses in the spring.

Cynthia

Use the Plant Tone & Fish Emulsion. Your roses will love it. The foliage will green up nicely. Keep everything simple.

Thanks again. I might be able to get alfalfa pellet from a feed store ( though i think they sell feed and grain for pets only. The store was closed when I went there).
So here is the plan:
1. Use Miracle Grow potting soil
2. Mix in alfalfa pellet and plant-tone
3. Use miracle grow fertilizer and fish emulsion after 2 months or so when potting soil runs out of premixed fertilizer.

To Dublinbay, I only see Miracle grow Bloom Buster at local Homedepot and Lowes., would appreciate if you can give the exact name of the fertilizer you use. My annuals, perennials and tomatos' leaves all turn light green no matter how much or how often I fertilized. It could be the sandy soil, the hard water, the rain or me trying too hard. I used to have green thumbs but somehow lost it when I move to Florida :( My plants look terrible.. even KO roses have lime green leaves

Edenh, is the soil the organic, or the fertilizer included type? That may burn new roots. You can buy compressed alfalfa at a pet store but make sure it is the pure alfalfa. you may have too much salt going on.. Make sure the pot has good drainage. I believe plant tone is mostly organics? Less chance of od'ing the rose. And I believe alfalfa is more of a root stimulant . The lime green could be a nutrient defficiency or too much water causing it? I think the bloom booster is too strong. Are your roses babies or bare roots? If they are, hold back on the ferts. You will find your magic formula!

I do not use any Miracle Grow products--ever.

As I stated above, I use the timed-release fertilizer called Osmocote which supposedly lasts for 3-4 months (depending on which version you get). For my hanging baskets, I get the version that lists extra high levels of nitrogen--the number on the side panel will be something like 18 or 19 for nitrogen. I don't know that the different versions of Osmocote have different names--I have to read the panel (required by law) that lists the 3 top ingredients (the first one always being the amount of nitrogen) plus other kinds of ingredients in the product. Like I said, for hanging baskets it doesn't seem to last more than about a month, even though the container says it will last for 3-4 months.

It also says on the container that this product will not cause "burn."

I think it is a good product and often also use it on my roses planted in the garden--but usually the version that is more balanced (like 6-6-6 or something like that). I put it on in June and let it take care of things for the next several months that can be unbearably HOT months in my area. (For early spring--for roses planted in the ground--I usually use the organic Plant Tone or one of the other Tones which already contains some alfalfa.)

Hope that helps.

Kate

P.S. I see Osmocote at just about every store that sells plant food. Shouldn't be hard to locate at all. Start with Wal-Mart or Home Depot or Lowes.

I am using Miracle grow moisture control potting mix. It already has fertilizer mixed in. I just bought a bag of rabbit food pellet. It has alfalfa meal as second ingredient. It has other things in there including (if I remember my basic chemistry) salt compounds and different vitamins. I saw osmocote at walmart and will be buying them for my perennials coz they are more forgiving than the roses. I bought water-soluble "miracle gro for roses" . I have not started moving the roses to bigger pots yet so there are still time to tweak...

Sounds like too much salt...from every source.. But they may like the bigger pots.

Alfalfa pellets sound like a great idea but I'm afraid to try it because of the racoons, possums, squirrels & cats wandering around my neighborhood.

I'm planning on trying Christopher's recipe for smoothies this spring & hope the wildlife just passes by without stopping to taste. It makes perfect sense to me because of all the vitamins & minerals in banana/vegetable peels, egg shells. Thanks, aquaeyes!

Here is a link that might be useful: smoothies for roses

The deficiency you describe is most likely iron, provided the new leaves are affected more than the old. A soluble fertilizer such as Miracle Gro for Roses or MG for acid-loving plants (Miracid) provides iron in a form that plants can take up. These fertilizers are well-suited to pot culture and there is not a thing wrong with them. It does usually take a few weeks for the leaves to green up, though. Miracid has extra iron, and it is fine for roses. One TSP/gallon every two weeks is what I have used.

Hi
I have potted 7 roses in 7 gallons pots. Some are potted in Miracle Gro Moisture Control and some ($3 Pierre Ogers from Lowes) are potted in a mixture of compost, peat moss and sand. What is the difference of iron vs nitrogen deficiency? I have perennials like Bush Daisy with lime green new leaves. On the other hand my bougainville (whole plant) is turning lime green. This is despite the fact that I have been feeding them with fertilizer and they were planted with added compost. My Eden was planted in-ground in compost and was doing great until two weeks ago when it started showing new growth with reddish tinge around the perimeter of the leaves and darker green vein (looks different than normal, regular new growth). I normally added a cup of plant tone near the stem every 4 weeks or so. I am wondering if the root is spread out by now and if I should apply the fertilizer farther away from the stem?

I thought I read somewhere that a true organic fertilizer is less effective when added to fresh potting soil. There aren't sufficient soil microbes to break it down. I've always used Osmocote or Miracle Grow in pots.

Maybe one of our chemists can tell us if I really heard this or was too drunk to understand.

It might be less effective, but it still works. If you mix in a little fresh active compost, you'll be "seeding" the pot with microorganisms. The Jobe's Organic Knock-Out rose food I use also has some active microorganisms in the mix. The organics I used for potting-up my bands last year must have worked, since I didn't use any synthetics, and almost all of my baby roses grew like gangbusters.

:-)

~Christopher

Some of the comments about organic fertilizer vs inorganic are wrong - they are the same chemical. See the link below for more details.

Organic formulations can also burn roots.

Nitrogen is very soluble ans is one of the first nutrients to wash out of a pot.

The problem with alfalfa is that the nutrients in it will be released very slowly over weeks and months. If the plants in pots need fertilizer it is best to use a traditional fertilizer or ozmocote which releases the fertilizer more slowly.

Here is a link that might be useful: GardenMyths: what is organic fertilizer

Did you read the next post in that blog? When you stick to organics, you're feeding the soil for the long-term, which allows the plants to get long, slow feeds. When you use synthetics, you're feeding the plants more directly, yes, but that's essentially all you're doing. If your garden gets all the plant nutrients via synthetics, you're likely missing out on the other benefits of a good, active "live" soil -- beneficial fungi and nematodes, larger populations of earthworms which keep the soil turning, etc. While you do miss out on some of those benefits in a pot, by "seeding" your potting mix with active soil from the garden or compost pile, you can still get "good stuff" happening in there.

:-)

~Christopher

Here is a link that might be useful: GardenMyths: what is the real value of organic fertilizer

This post was edited by AquaEyes on Fri, Feb 7, 14 at 20:38

Hi all,
My roses are about 10 months old but they are more like 4 months old because they were in water logged soil and almost died. Right now they are recovering nicely and the roots were poking out of 1 gallon containers. Half of them now are in miracle gro moisture control mix and the other half are in self-made peat moss and compost mix. I suspect those in the miracle gro mix will need fertilizing soon as we are getting a lot of rain lately and the ones in peat moss mix will probably need fertilizing now. I will add plant tone and compost as per Christopher's suggestion. Hopefully it will kick in on time for those in miracle gro mix.