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making top soil where none exists.

16 years ago

my land is a glacial berm about 30 'above a river that borders back yard,when a septic was put in to replace a cesspool the town engineer told me i had the gold standard course sand gravel cobble sized stone down as far as the back hoe could reach.it perked at 1"in ten min.i have been gardening for 15 years in one place but a pool and peach tree forced move to new area last year.i have a commercial composting plant around the corner and with a couple truck loads of horse stall wood shavings well rotted,and the composted wood and my leaf mould i started growing but the wood compost starved the nitrogen from my plants and i had to heavily miracle grow to keep them from shrinking ,also i always have watering problems once summer starts a dry spell, surrounding soil wicks away my daily watering,can i add clay to make top soil?we have pool sand called dead sand that may be clay could tilling this or a yearly addition of kitty litter work?

Comments (10)

  • 16 years ago

    Clay is a start. Loam and sand are the other two inorganic components of soil.

    Rather than tilling it in I would call on a landscaper or a professional grader to mix it up. He'll bring a tractor to the site and do his thing. When he leaves you'll have a perfect surface for a garden. If he brings something that is not a tractor send him home.

    Is there plumbing pipes or electrical under the area to be restored?

  • 16 years ago

    What differentiates "topsoil" from subsoil is the amount of organic matter in the "topsoil" which then also helps increase the amount of air the "topsoil" is able to carry. All anyone needs to do to make good topsoils is add organic matter the the mineral soil they have.
    There is no magic stuff called "topsoil" that you can actually buy even though many people sell something labeled that way. You also cannot make Loam, a certain kind of soil, unless you already have that because Loam is a blend of 45 percent sand, 25 percent clay, 25 percent silt, and about 5 percent organic matter.

  • 16 years ago

    Forget the clay. Unless you find someone doing construction/excavation, you are unlikely to find any for sale. And 'fill dirt' is even less desirable - usually just junk soil and with the potential for all sorts of debris and garbage included.

    Locate your local bulk soil providers and check out their products. Chances are they will have some sort of garden planting mix that would be an ideal addition to your garden. Barring that, just add compost. If properly composted, wood or wood shavings will not rob nitrogen - it's the fresh stuff incorporated into the soil that will cause problems but that can be offset by adding alfalfa, cottonseed or other seed meals. And 86 the MiracleGro - it's not doing anything for you that can't be addressed through any number of other and much less expensive methods.

  • 16 years ago

    What had you done differntly in your old garden spot? or was the ground that much different if so you might consider another relocate other wise keep adding that compost put in some drip lines because you are not going to be able to hold any water and multch heavy over the top to retain what water you can and to continue to build the soil

    There are people on here that garden in pure sand so with some work it is doable

    I'm not sure what the tractor is for, yes there is magic topsoil it comes from on top of the ground

  • 16 years ago

    ..
    You might check with local sources like master gardeners or an Ag Extension service. They will probably be familiar with what you are confronting.
    ..

  • 16 years ago

    jonas302, the tractor would only be to mix ingredients. Some people try to mix with a rototiller. Tractors can mix much deeper and more uniformly.

  • 16 years ago

    i guess i got some stuff to figure,but the loam description is what i am aiming for.my old soil started out with gold or light colored course sand thati spaded starting 15 years ago till i got a tiller,to spade i had a tough time getting half the depth of blade in soil,it was tightly packed with stones over the years i tossed them out got a large pile now. with adding organics from yard and any where else over years it's now fertile i leave the stones under rake tine size.its got a black fibrous look to it now when i sink a spade into it,a peach pit grew into a shade tree on edge and a pool encroaches the old garden it is about 20 x15'pool takes half more.so as i start new ground the same results are expected just want to keep it moist with clay i already mulch.

  • 16 years ago

    Does anybody know if the" pool dead sand" that the OP mentions is really clay? I did a few searches and most sites, like this site talk about fine silica sand or diatomaceous earth being used for pool filters.

    It doesn't seem to me that any of these would act like clay if added to the soil. In fact, it might make it worse, i.e. drain faster.

    Claire

  • 16 years ago

    I deal with the reverse problem. All I have is clay. So when I plant something, I have to put sand in the bottom of the hole, for drainage.

    Of course I have the compost or other material, mixed in, because eventually the roots will reach that area.

    So clay in the bottom of your rows/planting holes at least 8" below should help. If all your clay is mixed as well drained loamy soil, you will still lose the water, from the roots.

  • 16 years ago

    the pool "dead sand" is for setting a above ground pool liner,not for filtering,some call it dead sand and also clay.because it allows you to bank it for the cove shape at bottom of pool wall,and unlike plain sand that wont stand up vertically when it drys out.dead sand does keep it's shape.some said that composted wood chips don't rob the soil of nitrogen,tell that to my tomatoes and veg plants ,they just slowly wilted and turned yellow till i m.g.them on a weekly basis.when i kept chickens years ago i put wood shavings down over the droppings then would shovel them directly into garden they never burned plants but decomposed completely into soil.