The Suburban has to be the toughest tiller I have ever seen. I think Merry Tiller suffered because they had few repeat customers, nobody ever replaced them. The first one I worked on was 25 years old, I installed the fifth engine and a pair of tine shaft seals, the case had never been apart.The customer was doing custom tilling so it had lots of hours on it.

Saypoint,

"I'm tempted by the International even though I suspect the Suburban would do the job."

The big advantage of the International over the Suburban is the triple reduction transmission and the dual V-belt clutch. Two V-belts are better than one and a triple reduction transmission is better than a dual reduction transmission. The International gives you much higher tine torque and you can make lots more liberal use of slipping the clutch.

"Maineman has mentioned the add-on wheel/drag bar kit (around $50) but I don't quite get what that does for me."

It is just spring-loaded captive pins instead of having to pull a cotter pin, pull the pin, change the wheel position or the drag bar position, reinsert the pin, and reinsert the cotter pin. The pins are held in by springs instead of cotter pins. It saves you a minute or two when you change the drag bar depth or the wheel position.

"I assume this kit makes it easier to adjust the drag bar somehow but don't know why another wheel is involved."

No extra wheel is involved. The system just makes it easier to adjust the drag bar or the wheels. It's just a convenience factor.

I think the International model is significantly more capable than the Suburban. I think you would be perfectly satisfied with the Briggs & Stratton INTEK. In fact, the Honda engine option doesn't give you a throttle control on the handle, while the B&S choice does have a throttle control on the handle.

Either mid-tined Merry Tiller (the International or the Suburban) can till significantly deeper than either the BCS or the TroyBilt.

MM

OK, so the Suburban is tough ("rental tough" after all ;) but the Int'l offers the other advantages (I'm familiar with high end power tools - like cabinet saws - offering dual belt drive versus single belt ...). A couple hundred$$ extra now might be appreciated over the long haul.

So I'm pretty sure I'll order an Int'l w/B&S Intek and the drag bar kit from West ... I'll just mull it over a few more days first.

Thanks !

Hello Maineman - are you out there ?

Well, it's April 2008 and I just ordered a tiller. I wanted to let you know that your replies from last year helped tremendously. Thanks very much for your time. Unfortunately, I did not end up going with Merry, but opted for a Honda FC600.

I have the typical issue with MacKissic - call them to get a distributor; call them to get a subdistributor; call them to get the name of a retailer; call them to find out they've never heard of a Merry Tiller, but if the distributor says so, they can get one ...

OTOH, there's a Honda Power Equipment dealer 4 miles from work - they don't stock the FC600 so I'm still buying blind, but they'll get it, discount it a bit (enough to negate local sales tax), get parts & service it.

I like that the Merry is made in the USA (I had to ask the retailer before I found out that the Honda is made in Japan). I would have most likely bought the International with the B&S engine to keep the cost around $1200. I would have preferred the rear transport wheels. On the Honda, I like the side guards since I'll be tilling against a fence and/or raised bed sides now & again - not a deal breaker. And at 5'11" with an occasionally quirky back, I like the idea of being able to raise the handlebars so I'm not stooped over when tilling deep. The optional tines that Merry offers are a small plus, but I doubt I'd ever buy them (or worse, I'd pay for them and then never use them !)

But more than the Honda v. Merry discussion (because I'm sure I'd be happy with either) I'm grateful for the advice on mid-tine tillers. I think I'll be a happy gardener this year !

saypoint1,

I think you will enjoy your Honda FC600. The adjustable handle is a big plus that the current Merry Tillers don't have and at your height with a quirky back, that feature alone could be a good reason for picking it. I am 5'9" and fortunately the fixed handle height of my Merry Tiller is pretty good for me.

However, if they had an adjustable handle option, I would get it. My old Merry Tiller Exporter did have an adjustable handle, that could swing left or right as well as up and down, and I used its adjustability to its fullest.

The Honda's side guards are probably a good feature, too. I got your email, but I am answering it here. Considering everything, I think you made the right decision. Happy tilling!

MM

I have been reading the exchange with Maineman regarding the Merry Tiller Suburban vs. Honda FC600 tillers in the Tool Shed Forum on GardenWeb (I just joined). I am considering replacing my worn out MTD front tine tiller with either of these models. Saypoint1, I am wondering how you like your new Honda 600?

I have an established 1500' garden that is almost rock free and I wish to pursue using green manure in the futute (I'm getting too old, and my back is too tenuous for too much more digging, although I just put 8 yds of rotted cow manure in by hand and tilled it all with a Honda 220C--a bit small for the job, but the only mid-tine machine I could rent locally (I wanted to till it in as deep as possible). How well do you think the Honda would do tilling in rye grass in each spring?

My big concern between the two machines is that the Honda transmission only has one speed range, while the Merry tiller has the 3-tiered gearing, which seems like a significant difference. Your point is well taken though--it is definitely easier to work with a dealer locally than a distributor out of state.

Incidently, I too live in CT--Montville (very near Garnder Lake).

Any comments on tilling green manure with a mid-tine tiller would be appreciated. I know they will not shred and compost the grass like a rear-tine tiller, but I till thoroughly early in the spring, and again a week or two before I plant--the rye grass seem to break down quickly.

sekjr,

"Any comments on tilling green manure with a mid-tine tiller would be appreciated."

I planted Winter Rye as a green manure crop in my Fort Worth garden many years ago, on the advice of an article by the Tarrant County Agent in the Fort Worth Star Telegram. It grew mightily in the mild Texas winter and, when it it came time to till it under in the early Spring, I had an enormous amount of green material in the garden.

I started to till it with Slasher Tines on my Merry Tiller (the top of the line triple-reduction dual V-belt model back then was called the "Exporter") and I was in for a rude shock. The individual plants of Winter Rye bordered on huge, both above ground and below ground. The tiller had no trouble turning the tines, (I had already added enough sand and organic matter to get a decent sandy loam) but the Slasher tines did not cut through the fibrous root bundles. Cutting through them would have been almost like cutting through a thick hemp rope. The tiller would uproot the plants and turn them over and over in the soil without slicing through them.

I switched to my Bolo tines (nice for general cultivation and self-sharpening) and their slanted tine design was better at uprooting and then releasing the Winter Rye plants to the side of the tiller. The plants tended to slide off of the slanted tines. But the Merry Tiller was not turning that Winter Rye under. It was just digging it up with impressively large rootballs. I wound up piling the big plants up in a large pile in the corner of the garden and that pile rotted fairly fast that Spring to produce an impressive amount of compost that I wound up side dressing my corn with. (The Silver Queen corn grew over 10 feet tall with legendary "stove wood sized" ears.)

In order to turn under that crop of mature Winter Rye, I would have needed a good one-bottom moldboard plow with a large-sized self-sharpening blade. I was raised on a farm, and developed a healthy respect for what a good moldboard plow can do. It can wrap under some insanely tall weeds and leave nothing but a few stubs poking out. The buried weeds rot rapidly.

"How well do you think the Honda would do tilling in rye grass in each spring?"

It's a good tiller (I like its adjustable handle), but I don't think it would be any better than the Merry Tiller with rye grass. The Merry Tillers have available special-purpose tines, like the Bolo Tines, that could give them an advantage, but I think rye grass can be too tough to deal with either tiller if it gets too mature.

I would be curious how well a powerful high-RPM rear-tined tiller could handle mature Winter Rye. Its tines would need to be razor sharp. My Dad had good luck with Hairy Vetch as a green manure crop, and a rotary tiller can cut through its stems well enough, but regardless of how well you turn it under, enough seeds will have formed, or not germinated yet from your original planting, for it to become a potential weed. It is a rather nice looking plant and, as a legume, it is good for the soil.

Some people have suggested Winter Wheat as a green manure, but after my experience with Winter Rye, I would be hesitant to try it. If you do try one of those, be sure to turn it under before the plants get too mature. And if I were choosing between a Merry Tiller Suburban and a Honda FC600, I might very well pick the Honda for its adjustable handle. The Honda's tines look more like Merry Tiller's bolo tines than Merry's massive slasher tines, and the Suburban is no International.

ZM

sekjr,

"My big concern between the two machines is that the Honda transmission only has one speed range, while the Merry tiller has the 3-tiered gearing, which seems like a significant difference."

The Merry Tiller International has a triple reduction transmission, which gives it a somewhat slower tine speed and higher tine torque, but both tillers have a comparable range of tine speeds that are controlled simply by the throttle setting on the engine, and neither tiller has gears. Both tillers drive the tines with an enclosed roller chain and sprocket mechanism that is in turn driven by a V-belt connection to the engine. The Merry International adds a second stage inside the chain and sprocket unit, and dual V-belts in the engine connection for better slippage control in the clutching action. The transmissions of the Merry Suburban and the Honda FC600 are rather similar, and only the engine throttle controls the tine speed for any of the tillers we have been talking about.

Incidentally, a disadvantage of the Honda engine on the Merry International, as compared with the B&S engine on the Merry International, is that the B&S engine comes with an on-handle throttle control lever, while no such lever is provided for the Honda engine (for some reason). You control the International's Honda engine with the on-engine throttle lever. For that reason, it is questionable whether it is worth the extra cost to choose the Honda engine on the Merry Tiller International. I discovered that after I took delivery of my Honda-powered Merry Tiller International. Both I and my Merry Tiller dealer were unaware of that until after he had set up my Merry Tiller. I was going to miss my Spring tilling if I sent the tiller back, so I "ate" the problem. Its not super serious, because in normal tilling you don't change the speed frequently and, when you do, it takes only a second or two to reach down to the engine. Still, I can't understand why MacKissic didn't develop an on-handle throttle linkage for the Honda engine on their International Merry model.

ZM