Our local nurseries have end of season sell offs of items that they feel might not age/store well. So I just buy whatever brand they have on sale (often 75 % off). After Christmas there are sales on left over Christmas tree antitranspirants (again at huge discounts), I buy those also.

There is a new brand that claims to be better than other brands. It is called "Moisturin 5".

I have not tried it.

Here is a link that might be useful: link for aboce

Ok, thanks Henry! I guess just follow directions on the product labels for correct mixture for roses?

The abstract of a published paper "THE USE OF FILM-FORMING ANTITRANSPIRANTS TO CONTROL ROSE BLACKSPOT DISEASE" gives some products and concentrations that Auburn U used.

http://hortsci.ashspublications.org/cgi/content/abstract/32/4/590-a

I "think" that in previous discussions in this forum one/some reported diluting from the recommended concentration.

Here is a link that might be useful: link for above

Henry, I seem to recall half the normal summer strength being recommended. Kaye in Arkansas used less than that, her formula being recommended by the Rose-Flora people. I do remember reading that summer strength applied routinely (every two weeks) caused a reduction in roses' shoot length. Sorry I don't have a reference.

I found a Quart sized Wilt-Pruf concentrate today. I'll try half the summer-time strength.
Do I need to mix in any horticultural oil?

Most anything that leaves an oily coating on the leaves will help prevent blackspot. at one time I mixed fish emulsion with my fungicide and sprayed it weekly, The oily sheen on the leaves acted as a barrier to germinating blackspot spores. These must be reapplied often as rain will quickly wash them away.

i bought a bottle Wilt-Pruf to use during the summer months when our heat wave hits but have yet to use it in two years. Is there a formula for using on roses to control BS.

The following is from "Least-Toxic Controls of Plant Diseases" By William Quarles (September 1, 2000) which is on the Brooklyn Botanic Garden web site:

"Antitranspirants
For a 3% by volume solution: add 7 2/3 Tbsp. to a gallon of water. For a 4% by volume solution: use 10 Tbsp./gal.

Diseases Controlled
Powdery mildew, black spot, rust, some blights. For powdery mildew, use at 3%. For black spot, use at 4%.

How Often to Apply
Every 10-30 days

Precautions
Spray small area first to check for plant damage."

http://www.bbg.org/gardening/article/least-toxic_controls_of_plant_diseases/#antitranspirants

Here is a link that might be useful: Brooklyn Botanic Garden link for above

OK, on the formula at 4% for Blackspot. One more question: You say spray every 10-30 days. Does Wilt-Pruf mixed with water come off very easily when it rains?

After it drys it has formed a surfact polymer:

"WILT-PRUF® is a natural product derived from the resin of the pine tree which we call a polyterpene polymer or more specifically a beta-pinene polymer which is a film forming short chain polymer component. When our product is sprayed on plant surfaces, the water evaporates leaving a soft, flexible film which degrades one molecular layer at a time when exposed to air and light. The film immediately starts a polymerization into a longer chain, higher weight molecule. However, the entire thickness of the film does not polymerize at the same rate. Only the surface molecular layer is going through rapid polymerization. The molecular layer of the film that is attached and sticking to the leaf is staying a low weight, soft, sticky substance. The film slowly weathers away through this polymerization mode where the top layer fully polymerizes becoming a solid material. It powders away in microscopic flakes which are either washed or blown away, as the rest of the layers go through the same process until the entire film is weathered away. This normally takes about two months under hot, summer conditions and four to six months under cold weather conditions."

http://www.wiltpruf.com/Home/Properties/tabid/394/Default.aspx

Here is a link that might be useful: wilt-pruf link for above

Approx 10 years ago, when the "Rosa Flora" topic as Michael mentioned was hot, I used Rosa flora in combination with spraying Wilt Pruf for two summers in a row. It did absolutely nothing for my BS. Probably in colder climates like zone 5 or areas where BSis not such a big issue it will give some protection, but definitely not in my climate.
Olga

olga, the University research was at Auburn ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auburn,_Alabama ):

"Auburn has a typically Southern climate marked by mild winters, hot, muggy summers, and moderate autumns and springs. Due to Auburn's position near the Gulf of Mexico, the city receives a significant amount of rainfallÂon average, 52.6 inches (1,336.04 mm) per yearÂthough there is a distinct dry season in the late summer and early fall. Severe storm activity is common from the late winter through early summer. ".

Here is a link that might be useful: link for above

I guess, "distinct dry season" what is making a difference or the temps are just too high for optimal BS. Optimal temps for BS spores germination is around 65-70 at nights when the leaves are wet. I bet Auburn nights in summer are much warmer. Anyway, I don't discourage anybody to try, I just say in my garden it didn't work. And I was spraying religiously.
Olga

One can understand blackspot mutating to overcome a plant's internal defenses, but how does a fungi go through a plastic coating? One literature explanation is that:

"In single-leaf laboratory studies, fungal infection could be completely eliminated; however, on the whole plant and field plot scale, studies found complete coverage by the hydrophobic kaolin was impossible and so failed to control apple scab (Venturia inaequalis) (Puterka et al. 2000)."

Later in the review summary they state:

"Based on these results (Glenn et al. 1999, 2001b; Puterka et al. 2000), particle film technology has the potential to suppress some bacterial and fungal diseases; however, the environmental conditions and treatment timing have not been thoroughly documented."

Here is a link that might be useful: link for above

I live in Kansas where the question is not if the roses will get BS but when. So I need all the help I can get. Now can I use a sticker solution instead of fish emulsion?

I would think that it is not of matter of "a sticker solution instead of fish emulsion" since they serve different purposes.

http://organicgardening.about.com/od/organicgardeningglossary/g/fishemulsion.htm

Here is a link that might be useful: link for above

Hi Henry, what do you think of this? It is called a Bordeaux Fungicide. Link below

Here is a link that might be useful: Bordeaux Fungicide

Henry,

Does Wil-Pruf mixed with water actually need a sticker to be effective at forming a film on the leaves?

I am not in a position to answer questions about Bordeaux Fungicide off of the top of my head. As time permits, I will do a literature search.

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jim1961 I would think that a sticker would be counter productive.

That's what I was thinking Henry about the extra sticker. I don't think Wilt-pruf needs any. I read somewhere it already has a somewhat sticker substance in it.

Title: A bothersome black-spot [of roses ] experience.

Author: Rosen, H. R.

Published in: Am. Rose Ann. (1936), pages 121-6.

Abstract: "The efficiencies of fungicides in controlling black-spot of roses were in the descending order Kolotex (a mixt. of dusting S, Pb arsenate and colloidal clay), Bordeaux mixt. (4:4:50), Palustrex Sulfonate B (2 tablespoonfuls per gal. water) and neutral and basic Cu acetates (0.5 lb./50 gal.). Palustrex, the Cu acetates, Cu2O (1-2 lb./50 gal.) and basic Cu sulfate (2 lb./50 gal.) seriously injured the foliage. With certain varieties of roses, S dusts caused greater defoliation in hot weather than did the Cu fungicides."

---------------------------------------------

Title: Spraying, pruning and die-back [of roses ].

Author: Rosen, H. R.

Published in: Am. Rose Ann. (1935), pages 43-7.

Abstract: "Bordeaux mixt. (4:4:50), Cu acetate (1-2 lb./50 gal. H2O) and Palustrex sulfonate B (2 tablespoonfuls/gal. H2O) were approx. equally effective in controlling powdery mildew and blackspot when Aresco was added as a wetting agent at the rate of 1 teaspoonful/gal. of spray. At the rate of 2 lb./50 gal., Cu acetate gave no observable spray deposit on the leaves, but it burned the foliage badly and caused much leaf shedding; no injury occurred when it was used at the rate of 1 lb./50 gal. With Palustrex sulfonate B serious burning of the leaves occurred on bushes sprayed with the last of the material remaining in the tank; the material also had a marked tendency to gum up the spray equipment."

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Title: Red copper oxide as a rose spray.
Author: Horsfall, J. G.

Published in: Am. Rose Ann. (1936), pages 117-20.

Abstract: "Good control of black-spot of roses was obtained by spraying the bushes at bi-weekly intervals with Cu2O (2 oz./50 gal.). Although the spray may speckle the leaves of certain varieties with injury spots, unlike Bordeaux mixt. it causes no distortion of the foliage. There are indications that the efficiency of the spray, in the control of both black-spot and mildew, particularly the latter, can be increased by the addn. of a small amt. of emulsified oil."
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Also see 1922 American Rose Society link:
http://books.google.com/books?id=uUkYAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA83&lpg=PA83&dq=%22Bordeaux+Fungicide%22+roses&source=bl&ots=BHrR8K-njM&sig=yobSZUKyI33FFfNEVskZMlIHcPo&hl=en&ei=BYrnS42IA8H88Aa8mY3xCA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CCkQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q&f=false

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Here is a link that might be useful: 1922 American Rose Annual link

I started using a cu fungicide after using neem which didn't work well for me. The Cu fungicide did a much better job but using it during our very hot summer months would be a problem. So that's when I'll be using the Wilt-pruf.