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lilacs_of_may

Compost pile never made compost

18 years ago

In March 2007 I set up a wire compost bin and started ladling stuff into it: fallen leaves, grass clippings, yard debris, kitchen waste (plant based). I watered it thoroughly about every time I watered my vegetables, and I turned it occasionally. It never smelled nasty. Smelled rather like earth, actually. I also sometimes put some soil or compost on it and some activator to jump start it. I took the temperature in the middle of the compost occasionally, but it was never "hot." It didn't seem to get any hotter than ambient temperature. If the air temperature was 62 degrees, the compost bin would be somewhere between 60 and 65 degrees. If the air temperature was 98, the compost would be somewhere between 95 and 100.

This March, 2008, I set up a compost bin extension and started to empty out and sift my original compost bin, expecting nice black loamy stuff to add to my beds.

Didn't get it. Oh, there was some compost/soil looking stuff, but then I put compost and soil in there. There was some breakdown, obviously. Watermelon rinds were devoid of any watermelon and peach pits no longer had peaches around them. But most of what I took out looked pretty similar to what I had put in.

I didn't layer it formally like a parfait. Things got tossed in pretty much as I got them. A bag of fallen leaves, some greens, a biobag of kitchen waste, more leaves. But obviously I did something wrong. Raking leaves into a pile, which is what I did the year before, seemed to do a better job of providing black, loamy stuff than my compost bin did.

Comments (18)

  • 18 years ago

    I find wine corks, peach pits, grass clippings, and all kinds of other stuff that don't look all that composty. But I just add them into the soil anyway, and start a new pile.

    This is where I find bread crusts that look like that Ché Guevera poster.

  • 18 years ago

    It sounds like you might not have had enough high nitrogen material (greens) for the amount of leaves you had. If you never turned it, it may have dried out below the top layer. I've found that if I have a lot of leaves, it's tough to get the water to soak in past them.

    For me, the water near the top or edges evaporates pretty fast. If you're watering thoroughly, you may have pockets that are too wet and pockets that are too dry. Or it may be hitting the leaf layer and running off.

    My compost has lots of leaves and coffee grounds in it, along with kitchen and garden waste. I turn it every week or so except in winter. In summer time, I usually get usable compost every 3-4 weeks if I work at it. I screen it through 1/4 inch hardware cloth. That only lets really fine stuff through, and what is left (much of it no longer recognizable) goes back to get composted further.

  • 18 years ago

    Finished compost never will be "black, loamy stuff" but will be a nice fluffy, good smelling chocolate colored material. You would be the best one to dissect your compost pile but it sounds mostly like there was insufficent Nitrogen in the mix for the bacteria to be able to digest the material. Compost does not necessarily need to get hotter than the ambient air to be digesting, and probably that expectation causes more problems than it is worth.

  • 18 years ago

    Thanks kimmsr forthe reply to the OP. I never read what finished compost should look like. Smell, yes, but never color. I too thought it would be black. I am new to composting, and my pile has never gotten hot, which I have worried about. I agree with your statement: "probably that expectation causes more problems than it is worth."

  • 18 years ago

    I, too, started my first compost a year ago, in a plastic bin. This week, I harvested some from the bottom door - there was recognizable stuff, but mostly, it was looking fine. However, when turning the material, I found a chunk of intact leaves in the middle - probably got frozen in winter and hasn't warmed up even now.
    I got a new bin this year and chose a sunnier place for it. Also, I put a wire net at the bottom, since rats got into my first bin!
    Lilacs, how about worms - did you notice any in your compost? Maybe adding some of these would also help speed the process.

  • 18 years ago

    You did get some decomposition, its just not "finished"...You can use partially the finished compost on garden beds. cover it with mulch, eventually it will decompose.

  • 18 years ago

    Thanks for telling me what it's supposed to look like. I sifted the finer stuff through a compost sifter, and I came up with what looked like chocolatey brown soil, so that part sounds right.

    I probably did have way more leaves than green stuff because I have way more trees than grass. If I spend an afternoon weeding and throw the green weeds into the pile, I'll get a thin green layer. If I toss a bag of leaves into it, I'll get a thick brown layer. Is kitchen waste a green? Last fall, along with the leaves, I threw a lot of dead peaches into the bin.

    I haven't noticed any worms in the compost bin, although I see plenty of worms and wormholes in my yard.

    Any way to increase the greens other than steal weeds from my neighbors' lawns? Maybe I could trade leaves for grass clippings.

  • 18 years ago

    I respectfully disagree with the previous diagnoses. Your watermelon rinds and kitchen waste are indeed "greens". Given your location, I'm willing to bet that your pile was too dry. Toss the weeds and grass clippings into the bin by all means, but stir everything up and get in good and wet. I often find that a new pile just kind of sits and doesn't do much until I've stirred and rewetted it, then it takes off.

  • 18 years ago

    Nearly all kitchen waste would be considered a green.

    Is there a Starbucks nearby? Their corporate policy is to make their coffee grounds available for free to anybody who asks. You don't need to buy anything. Many of them have a bucket near the door. If the bucket's empty, I'll stand in line and tell them I'm just there for grounds this time (or I hand them my mug to be filled and ask for grounds). The corporate policy only applies to the standalone stores, not the ones in bookstores, airports, etc.

    Other places that sell coffee will probably give you grounds, too, but you'll probably need to make arrangements with them, supply them with buckets for that purpose, etc.

  • 18 years ago

    I don't do hot composting. I agree with the person who said not wet enough. I probably toss water on my pile every third day or so, plus other liquid.

    This is what compost looks like (2nd sifting).

    Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:290085}}

  • 18 years ago

    More often than not when you "toss" some water on your compost pile, or even run the hose over it the water you apply simply runs off, not into the pile. If you do not get the material moist enough when you build the pile it is not too likely that pouring some on later will realy result in wetting the inside where that water would be needed. Get sufficient levels of moisture in the mix as you build your pile to be sure it will be there.
    There are those that believe that if you build a depression into the top of your pile water will percolate through from that, but what I see is the water flows to the outside edges of the pile and on out, not into the center.

  • 18 years ago

    lilacs of may - I agree w/the "need more greens" opinions above (which is not to say that I disagree w/the "need more water" opinions - I just don't have an opinion about the water thing b/c my bin is in a container & I tend to have too much moisture more often than not).

    The way you described it - 1 thin green, 1 thick brown of mostly leaves - seems like it would take a real long time to decompose. I've noticed leaves in my bin take a long time, which I didn't expect. But, my bin takes a short time to decompose when I've used mostly garden/kitchen waste, intense greens (such as UCG/dried blood/alfalfa), and some browns such as (leaves/paper towels/napkins/shredded moistened cardboard) - IF I turn it ALOT (again it's in a bin so this might not be as crucial to your formula).

    Plus, I also find that we each have a preferred "formula" for our individual systems, lifestyles & area of the country.

    I've added below a link to my list of 201 Compost Ingredients, if you want to brainstorm about more "greens."

    BTW, we just got our first Starbucks (10 min away) - prior to that the nearest starbucks was 1 hour away & that was just in a bookstore. I am already collecting from a local coffee shop (actually, they were new about 2 yrs ago - pre-local-Starbucks - and I told them about Starbucks' habit of bagging & offering UCG for peoples' gardens & so now they're doing it! yippee!). And, actually, most of the UCG I gather go directly onto soil (under the store-bought pine/other bark/shredded mulch) or onto the grass.

    So, do it again this year & keep experimenting to see what works!

    polly in IL - that is BEAUTIFUL! Thanks for the pix!

    All the Best, Tree

    Here is a link that might be useful: 201 Compost ingredients

  • 18 years ago

    In a Rodale gardening book I read that for every 4 inches of leaves, paper, brown material, there should be at least 1 inch of green waste. Green being grass clippings, veggie scrap's, the peaches. The hard part is keeping it wet enough, like everyone else has stated. I'll keep a scrap 2x4 in the middle of my pile, I'll move it around to make the hole bigger, and fill it with water every few days. This keeps good air flow and allows the water to soak. I'll save my greens and add them every 2-3 days, and mix the pile when I do so. Water as I mix.

    An idea I just had could be to get a 5 gallon bucket, drill holes down the sides and bottom. Fill it with water and let is slowly soak you materials.

  • 18 years ago

    More greens, more water, more stirring. Gotcha.

    I have a Starbucks nearby in the local Safeway. I asked there once for grounds, and they kind of waffled and said they didn't have any. I never asked again. Without a car, that's really the only one close enough to get it home easily.

    And I don't drink coffee. Maybe I should start? :-)

  • 18 years ago

    The Starbucks inside stores aren't covered by the corporate policy and most don't save the grounds.

    Sometimes convenient stores, gas stations, etc will save the grounds for you. It works best in those places if you have two clean buckets. That way, you can drop one off. When you pick it up, drop off the other one. Make sure you clean the bucket each time before dropping it off. And if you're going to be gone, pick the bucket up, but don't drop one off. And let them know you're doing that.

  • 18 years ago

    lilacs_of_may, lists the location as 5/6 CO. I don't know about this location but I do know that in 5/6 NV it could require the addition of, sometimes expensive, water to produce compost.

  • 18 years ago

    Lots of water, actually. Every time I feel I have to water my vegetables and flowers, I water my compost bin, too.

    I dug into the new bin, and 3-4 inches down, it was quite damp and was beginning to look composty. (Is that a word?)

    I dug deep into the old bin, and about halfway down I began to find soil-like stuff, so maybe it is forming compost after all, just deep down. Of course, the deeper down I go, the older the pile is. At the bottom it's 14 mos. old.

  • 18 years ago

    you've probably seen my posts, about the urine making the compost hotter, well this one link reminded me of it, while i was talking to my neighbor today about this, he's a composter also, he also knows about the urine thingi, i have been reading ALL of the posts and soaking up all of the info, like i did on the winter sowing, and now i've found that i do actually have a compost bed, although i didn't think about it till tonight!! how cool is that!!!??? LOL the urine ratio is 1/20 and no meds. but i thought i'd let ya know it makes your compost hotter to do its job. hope this helps :'))

    Here is a link that might be useful: the link i've been talking about