Hey sugar Hill, moving your Niobe will be a piece of cake.Prune any growth down to the last set of nodes.Make sure you have your new hole ready to go.when you dig up the Niobe make sure you get most of the root ball if you don't thats ok just don't hurt the crown.I would do all this in the early morning make sure you water it in real well and your done. good luck and happy gardening

Sugarhill, I would attempt moving the clematis, if at all possible, without trimming it at all. Trimming it at this point in the year will make the clematis think it is spring and it will attempt to put out new foliage due to the pruning. In your zone 7 in Georgia, that is not what I would want to happen. You want your clematis to concentrate on getting its root system re-established now and not on putting out top growth that will get zapped by the first frost. If you have to prune, do so but do it judiciously and keep as much of the top greenery as possible. The top growth you keep will be able to continue manufacturing nutrients the plant needs for the rest of this growing season to feed its root growth and to build up reserves for the plant to use over the winter and next spring's ramp up in growth. On top of that, Niobe will bloom earlier in the season if you keep as much of the old wood as possible since it will bloom on old wood and new wood. Keep the plant well watered this fall and into the early winter so that it will stay hydrated. The plant's roots will continue to grow as long as the ground stays warm so keep the plant well mulched to conserve moisture and keep the top layers of soil warm so root growth will continue as long as possible.

hi sugar hill you better take the advise of the real expert on this forum don't prune it happy gardening

Clematis not bombs, I don't consider myself an expert by any means. However, your growing season in California zone 9 is very different than mine in my zone 7 and possibly zone 7 in Georgia. Sugarhill has to decide which area is most like his/her own to decide whether to prune it as you suggested or as I suggested. What works in one garden may or may not work in another garden.

I always tell people to Prune and fertilize and top dress their Clematis the same time they Prune their Roses!!..That will work in all Zones...for instance here ..I prune my Roses (removed winter kill etc) around Valentines Day-March 1st...So try using the same timetable that you use for your Roses in your area to prune etc your Clematis....Hope that helps...Jeanne

Hey Miguel I was being serious.I can tell by the way you post your answers they have a lot knowledge behind them you are right your zone is a lot different from mine.I must tell you this I don't mean to brag but I worked on one of the worlds only clematis farms and have worked with more clematis than most of you have ever seen this was my job not some little backyard garden.I was just trying to tell surgar hill it was going to be easy not confuse them the fact the plant was young I think it will benefit it being pruned.I'm sorry but I will not have someone say I'm giving bad advise.Have a great day and happy gardening

Clematis, can you say where you worked or will that get you into trouble either with your past employer or with Spike here on GW? I think working at such a place would have been very bad for me!! I would have spent all my salary on buying too many clematis!

hey Miguel no its ok I worked for Chalk Hill I was there for about 8 years I worked with Murry I did get most of the reject plants that where found not to be good cut flowers I also worked in the nursery and did most of the shipping I did get a lot of plants I injoyed the field prep the most I lived on chalk Hill road for some time. I was in clematis heavan but I since got a much higher paying job for the town of Windsor sure miss Chalk Hill though. like I said Miguel you are very knowledgable clematis guy people will learn a lot from you.have a great day and happy gardening

Hey Clematis not bombs, man what a job that must have been. I have conversed several times with Murray and found him to be a really nice guy and more than willing to help out with any questions I had. Are you by any chance the clematis dude on the other clematis forum?

Hi Miguel Yes that is me on the gardenbuddies forum. Murray is a really cool guy. I even worked on thanksgiving Day thats how much I enjoyed that job way too much fun to be a job.

Thanks for the info Clematis not bombs. It really says a lot about Murray when you work on Thanksgiving for an employer and enjoy it!

Hey Miguel I have a question when someone posts a question here and you answer it and they don't respond what does that mean? kind of bugs me why ask, is it because they have'nt been back on the forum or do they not like your answer.I gave some people some choices of plants and nothing. might just be me but it takes the fun out of it.I really like the other forum at laest they respond and kind of keep the conversation going. Have a great day and happy gardening

Clematis not bombs (would use your real name but I don't know it and last time I looked, it wasn't in your profile), this forum is a lot like many others. There are some posters who drop in to ask a specific question and just want answers and don't respond to the responses they get. There are others who are more frequent posters and viewers and they are more likely to respond to those who post to their questions. I personally don't take it to mean anything negative--it's just the differences amongst different people in my opinion.

I've seen various netiquette guidelines over the years that say not to respond just to say "Thank you" or Ok.. Postings should have more of sbustance and contribute something. Personally, I think a little conversation never hurt anyone...whats a few extra bytes :-)

btw, I didn't move the SAC discussed in a recent thread "transplanting in fall" after all. I decided I may keep it if it can grow up a stand of pine seedlings. (10-20' tall now). Do you think SAC will like that? Its current obelisk is about 5' away from the pine trees, but its just reaching them. Next year I could help it over there early on.

Wendy,

I would caution about SAC covering small trees and shrubs,..it is a prolific grower, and could smother the tree/shrub....IMHO

Hal

IMHO,, the world needs more "thank you's"

you do not have to post it, send it directly to the person that it is intended..

My pet peeve (which does not happen in this group, thankfully), is posting a question that no one takes time to respond....particularly for new posters, makes one feel very unwelcome.

Hal,
well, these 10-20' seedlings now will be 30-40' in no time. I am surrounded by 75'-100' pine trees. I think SAC doesn't stand a chance. And if SAC wins, thats fine too. I have way too many pine trees. :-)

But having said that, now I am thinking as the pine trees get older, they lose their lower branches. How will poor SAC get up to the "trellis" branches then?

Wendy

Wendy, you can always place wire fencing around the trunk for the SAC to use to climb on. Make a big circle of it to go around the trunk. For now you can overlap the fencing and then expand it as the tree grows. The pine tree will in my estimation do just fine with the SAC growing on it.

But how high up do I have to put it? We're fine now for the first 6' because SAC is on an obelisk near the trees. It managed to find the trees on its own at 8' or so. If those branches at 8' weren't there, that's kinda high for me to be putting fencing. Oh, did I mention its on a slight slope too. Ladder's not allowed!

Well, I'm not gonna worry about it. By the time I need extra support, I may not even be here!

It does seem to be that your tree is at a precarious height. How about some sort of guide wires from the obelisk to the tree to allow the clematis to make the jump from one object to the other. You could use something temporary that you pull down after the growing season so it wouldn't be visible during the winter months. Maybe some sort of coarse twine or rope that you could throw up into the tree's lower branches by attaching a rock or similar object. Just some wild early morning thoughts! You know what they say about where there is a will, there is a way!

Gee guys, I've been on the Gulf Coast helping my sister-in-law for the past week. Didn't know I had to read the responses and post in a certain time. Thanks a lot to the people who gave me advice about moving the Niobe. I'll take the advice on the gardener from zone 7, just because it's my zone. I appreciate the California advice because it took away my worry that moving a clematis might hurt it. And thanks to the Texas responder about the pruning advice. Here we usually prune roses the last day of February. So I guess that's when I'll prune the Niobe. Does that sound about right?

Someone was right when they said a lot of people come to the forum to post a question, but don't hang around for discussions. Since this is my first clematis, I don't have anything to add to clematis discussions. I expect a lot of people are in the same situation. I enjoy reading your forum though, and I'll bet a lot of them do too.

sorry sugar hill thats not what I meant I never said someone had to post in certain amount of time we went on with anouther discussion sorry about your sister in law once again so sorry good luck with your Niobe

Yup..the last day of Feb. seems right to me..I am Zone 8B so I can see your Zone 7 being more towards the end of Feb or the 1st of March..goodluck...and thanks Gardengal for your sage advice..that is a product I have never tried...I have always been so hung up on Composted Cowmanure..LOL...hugzzzz...Jeanne

Sugarhill, last year I pruned all my type III clematis at the end of December. Pruning rules are not written in stone and my thinking is that after your area has had cold temperatures for a couple of weeks, the plants go dormant. Pruning them after such a time period shouldn't be a problem since they are dormant and not likely to be awakened by a relatively short time period of warmer weather. You have to use your knowledge of what is typical in your zone as far as weather conditions goes as to when you can prune your clematis.

I know a lady, Penny Vogel, out on the west coast in Estacada, Oregon whose garden was featured in Linda Beutler's book "Gardening with Clematis". Penny has quite a few clematis in her garden and related to me in previous email conversations that she prunes her clematis when she has the time to do so. That could be anytime from fall to late winter. She reported that she has never run into any problem doing her pruning as she has done so. The last average frost date for her area is around April 13th, which is very similar to mine-April 15th. I am also including a link to temperature averages for her area and maximum highs and lows over a given year. You can see by examining them that her average winter temperature are right around freezing but not subzero temps and yet she has never experienced any problems with trimming clematis back as early as sometime in the fall. What I am trying to say is that there are probably quite a lot of people who live in zones colder than her who could prune much earlier than late winter/early spring--the standard times that people usually associate with when clematis can be pruned. Bottom line is that you should use the information you have gathered about your local growing area to decide when you can prune your clematis and not necessarily use the general guidelines that are typically espoused about when you should or shouldn't prune your clematis.

Here is a link that might be useful: Estacada, Oregon temperature information

Thanks, nckvilledudes. Is there any reason it would be harmful to prune at the end of February? If not, that works for me because it's easy to remember - prune the roses, prune the clematis. I have a more basic question though. If Niobe blooms on old wood, why would I prune it at all before it blooms? I think I'm becoming confused.

Sugarhill, if it is easier to remember to prune in late February since that is when you prune your roses, that is when you should do it. I know of no reason why it would be harmful to do so--especially since that is considered late winter as far as I am concerned. As for Niobe, it is generally considered to be a type II since it blooms on old wood but it will bloom on new wood also. I have up to this point always treated mine as a type III and pruned it as such. Next year I am going to treat it as a type II and see if I can tell any difference in the number of blooms it has and when it blooms (if I remember when I am out in the garden cutting them back that is!)

Check out the listing below for Niobe on Clematis on the Web and read their description of treating Niobe as either a type II or III.

Here is a link that might be useful: Niobe

Thanks guys. I think I'll treat it as a II and see what happens. I have certainly learned a lot by hanging out with you guys over the past couple of days - moving, pruning, and fertilizing clematis. Thanks for all the info. I think I'll drift back to the Georgia forum now because I can tell if I spend any more time with you I'll become a clematis addict. This forum is way too tempting, and I have a perennial border to finish before I start something new.

Although Niobe can be treated as a Group 2 or a Group 3, it might be a good idea to treat it as a Group 3 until it is more established. That will help it put energy into making roots the first year. Even 100% Group 2's should be hard pruned their first year (or two according to some). Some years, Mother Nature hard prunes my Group 2's and they are fine. They just bloom a little later.