Oh my, fresh seed do float don't they! You soak so that it's easier to remove the outer coat and plant the seed that is inside on the Brugmansia seeds. Best of luck!

Thanks for the response. But I'm curious about the 'outer coat' you mention because the FAQ doesn't touch on that. The seeds are pretty thin-too thin to nick or peel and I'm not sure I'm following.

You wouldn't know if there's a site that has instructions with pics would you?

Thanks

MBT

Datura seeds won't need peeling but some brug seeds have a cork on the outer coating and will float. After soaking this corky outer coating can be peeled off then you can plant them. Here are a few links Copy and paste the first one or click on the 2nd one.
http://www.abads.net/brugmansia_seeds.htm

Here is a link that might be useful: planting brug seeds

SJN,

Thanks for the link(s). Unfortunately the copy paste link doesn't work for me, but the second link provided by you seems to answer my question.

The brug and datura seeds I received don't have that coarky coating and are a yellowish color. So I think maybe the trader peeled them before hand.

Wish me luck, LOL.

MBT

MrBrownThumb, what do these seeds look like? Are the the same looking seeds?

Karma, they sort of look like dried bell pepper seeds. I just received some more Brug seeds and they look like they have the cork on them, but the original ones I got didn't have that. They're flat and white to yellowish.

MBT

i have only grown a few brugs from seed.i have never removed the corky covering-although a lot of folks do recommend it.i also soak mine overnight.i'm trying to grow some sanguinea from seed now.one seed sprouted,then died.i'm now waiting on the others to sprout.

MrBrownThumb, sounds like the first set of seeds were datura seeds. Best of luck!

trigger_m, I have found that the fresher the Brug seeds are you don't have to remove the outer coating but it give the plant a getter start not having to fight the outer coating.
Sanguinea seed can be tricky, keep doing them!

KHT,

Thanks. You know I got to trades one of Brugs and one of Datura and the seeds look identical..neither of them have the outter shell. Anyway I just checked on them and after 5 days of using the baggie method I have germination. I probably transplant them tommorrow. I guess I'll have to wait and see what they are once they sprout.

MBT

MrBrownThumb, If at all possible wait to transplant after the second or third set of leaves appear, just open up the baggy and set it into a pot.

Hi kht,

Would you please expand on those last instructions? MBT didn't mention how many seeds he placed in the baggie, nor how many have germinated, but let's say there are at least 5. In the typical baggie method of germination (speaking of most plant types), the seedlings are normally potted up ASAP after germination takes place. Please tell us why you would wait for 2-3 sets of leaves to develop before transplanting. I'm picturing an overcrowded little forest-in-a-bag with roots interwoven and a challenge to separate. You pretty much know what you're doing, so please elaborate on the reasoning behind your suggestion.

Thanks,
Patrick

Hey Patrick,
First of all I really don't jump on all these new fangle ideas of bags and buckets and whatever. I tried the baggie method many moons ago and the night ladies need air to grow so I cut the bag and pop it into a pot so they were stable. The reason around the 2-3 sets of leaves gives these lovely ladies time to grow and become more stable than just a short stalk which can be lost at a young stage and again they need air or you invite a host of problems as they grow. As for them being crowded and root over crowed, don't laugh but I have 3 trays of babies that are a foot tall and they are doing great in their crowded conditions. I won't pot them up until this spring and again you will laugh I'll just tip them over and ease them out of their tray one at a time. If you have them in loose soil with a mixture of peat and whatever they will ease out just fine. I will add that they have been in this mix since planted a early last spring. Started in the heat bed, no cover and left in the greenhouse all summer where the fan was blowing. I will say these I did test Messenger on as these were a mixed batch of pinks that weren't special seeds. When I test other folks seeds they get better treatment. Heck I'm a no fuss type, if they grow great if they don't they go into the yard with a marker to see if they will sprout at a later date. Markers are removed after a years time but noted in the journals as to what was put where. Hope this helps if not scream. We have started hundreds of seeds of both Daturas and Brugmansias this way for over 10 years. karma's cocktail is a big help too!

Hi kht,

Thanks for elaborating... I appreciate the insight into what works for you when dealing with brugs on the large scale approach.

Because the "baggie method" starts seeds between layers of damp coffee filters or paper towels rather than any kind of growing medium, I think opening the bag and sticking it in an empty pot could quickly end up with dead seedlings...the system requires enclosure to keep a moist environment. I do agree that's not a good environment to keep brug seedlings in...they should be potted up asap after germinating. I had quick germination with this method and overall good success. It works well on the smaller scale most of us novices are practicing and has the benefit of letting us see the earliest stages of germination.

Patrick

Patrick, you are saying that you don't put dirt in the coffee filters? But again like you say us novices, novices might do some good getting a good seed starter book. So tell me the size you pot them up in? Ya know differ strokes for different folks and you will not get the same answer from any gardener. Why not pot the up in a good seed starter and put that in the plastic bag? One less step?

No...no soil of any sort...the seeds are placed between layers of a folded damp coffee filter (preferred) or paper towel. Then the folded "paper" is placed in a baggie. The benefits include a high rate of germination and usually a faster rate of germination (my brugs & daturas were germinating in about 7-10 days).

If some seeds sprout earlier than others, you can pot up those that have sprouted and leave the others longer. I located the following link in the GW seed starting forum. It's not any of the ones I was reading there a year ago, but it looks like the forums have been reorganized under new titles. Read thru some of the posts to see what others have to say about this method.

I used it on a number of kinds of seeds early last spring...worked great for me, indoors and in conjunction with growing the seedlings under fluorescent lights. For seeds that need darkness to germinate, I placed the baggies (stacked flat on top of each other & covered with a cloth) on top of the light fixture where they got some bottom heat. Baggies with seeds that need light were taped to the edge of the light reflector, where they got light and some warmth. I "candled" the baggies & could tell when roots were emerging without opening the baggies.

Patrick

Here is a link that might be useful: baggie method

Aha...I think this is the more detailed "Baggie Method" thread I was looking for.

I will admit this is more labor intensive than some methods, but I don't mind taking the time and very careful handling required to move the sprouting seedlings from the coffee filter to the pots or 6-paks (for brugs I use either the large 6-paks or individual 3.5" - 4" pots) with sterile potting mix. I work with improvised tools to facilitate handling without breaking delicate roots...tootpicks, pencils, kitchen cutlery...whatever comes to mind & proves to work well. The toothpics are excellent for slipping under the seedling as they lay on the wet coffee filter & to manuever the seedlings to holes dibbled in the planting mix. Once in place, I gently pull the sides of the holes against the seedlings, then spritz with water to aid in making good contact between the "soil" and the seedling.

Granted, this may be way too labor intensive on a commercial scale, but it works really well for the home gardener who doesn't have a greenhouse or other commercial facilities available. It can be very beneficial when dealing with seeds that are expensive, rare, of limited numbers, or have a reputation for being very slow, difficult or irratic in germinating. Over and over, people report really liking the results they get with this method.

Patrick

Here is a link that might be useful: original thread on the Baggie Method

Again Patrick, different stokes for different folks. Have you compared the difference in growing this seed from a baggie method. compared to adding soil to your filter or even compared to direct soil? My notes (from 1995) when I was playing to find the best method was the direct sowing in dirt pots was the best when covered with some sort of plastic. I won't even start my tomatoes that way, ya want to give them the best start you can. If you don't start with a good foundation, you growth will flounder.

I'd love to hear the experiences others have had, starting brug & datura seeds without benefit of a greenhouse or coldframe....and in cooler climates that require starting the seeds indoors. I'd like to know the percentage of germination they achieved, as well as how long germination took. I've read some posts in the past that touched on this, but can't quote specifics...just that my impression is some frustration with poor germination rates and irratic germination over a long period of time...even giving up and composting the seed-starter soil, only to eventually find brugs or daturas coming up in the compost pile! My limited experience using the baggie method gave me quick germination & all within a few days of each other. I did a number of daturas this way, but due to the large size of the brug seeds I was working with, I moved the seeds to individual pots after about 5 days. I feel the time spent in the baggie, with the uniform moisture, did speed the germination process, because all of them sprouted within 10 days.

Our discussion has gotten away from the subject of how long to leave germinating seeds inside the baggies, when using that method. Now that you know there is no soil involved, I'm sure you would not recommend leaving the seedlings inside the baggies until they've formed the 2nd or 3rd set of leaves.

Patrick

Patrick888, I wouldn't recommend starting them this way at all, the key is to give them the best start you can and the less handling of them the better off you will be. The key is to keep them health. Besides by the time I get some of them out of the karma cocktail they are showing signs of growth.

kht, we're definitely in agreement on "different strokes for different folks". How many of us hobby gardeners have the Karma cocktail to work with? Those who don't, need to look to other options. If you read the threads and related posts on the Baggie Method, you have to recognize that many of us have tried it and find it an excellent method, often yielding faster and better germination than other methods.

My reason for posting to this thread was to question the instructions you gave MBT in the use of THIS (baggie) method. Beyond that, what method you or others choose to use is a matter of personal choice and I have no issue with it.

Patrick

Hi,

I have some brug seeds from a trade and thought just for fun I might try some. I have a short growing season, end of May through September, so I wanted to see if I could get some bloom on them this coming summer. I wondered if I start seed indoors now, might I?

I was going to peel off the cork, soak the seed over night, plant in a potting soil, cover with a dome and place on a table over a heat vent that periodically heats up which is in a Western Window with sun from 12 noon to 4pm approximately. Is there anything I should do differently?

Thanks,
adam

Wow, I hadn't realized my thread could still be alive. Well as you may guess I pretty much had the same results as Patrick. I wish I had kept notes or remembered to come back to see if anything else was posted. But I figured this thread had died long ago.

Anyway, using the baggie method( with paper towel) I was successful in germinating a few Datura seeds and removed them from the baggie once I saw them start to sprout. I just removed the seeds and placed them on soil and put another baggie over the pot and covered it again until it got almost as tall as the bag covering the pot. Once it was too tall I split the top of the bag to allow for air circulation and to acclimate it to less humidity. I thinned out the weaker looking seeds and kept the strongest one. It is now about 5 inches tall and sprouting it's second set of leaves.

I tried another set of seeds that I got from a trade here and those I tried in soil. None of those sprouted and they seemed to have turned to mush. The seeds in the baggie were sitting next to the seeds in the pot in the exact same spot and recieved the same amount of heat, but the ones in the bag recieved less light and I am guessing more moisture.

Adamn,

What you decribed is basically what I did in the same spot except the seeds were in a room with north facing windows. I used the heating vent in the floor as my "heating mat" to provide warmth from below.

Adam...you plan sounds pretty good, but I think you should soak the seeds first...then peel the cork off. Once under your dome, I'd suggest going for moist soil but not wet & don't let a lot of condensation build up. If you don't have lots of bright light to grow your seedlings in while indoors, consider putting them under a fluorescent light.
Keep up posted on your results.

Patrick