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laceywhims

Replacing 100 yo Pecan tree with new tree

19 years ago

Hi everyone,

Today we had to cut down one of the two 100-year-old Peacan trees which stand out from the corners of our house. This tree stood in the front yard, which is on the west side of the house. The tree provided at least 1/3 of the main shade for the house.

Do you have an idea of what would be a good replacement tree(s) for the Pecan tree we had to cut? I'm not really an oak kind of person and don't have another 40 years to grow another Pecan or oak tree.

Thanks in advance.

L

Comments (24)

  • 19 years ago

    You will have to decide if you want something fast growing (low quality) or an investment tree.

    If all you want is fast, go for Silver Maple, River Birch, Loblolly Pine, Weeping Willow, Bradford Pear. All will give shade in about 10 years from a 3-gal size. You will suffer with brittle limbs, shallow roots and suckering.

    I'm not trying to be critical; but you should understand the difference.

  • 19 years ago

    Thanks Alex. Here's the problem. I wouldn't mind having another Pecan tree. However, I have to get something (shrubs/bushes?) to shade the house before my mom dies and she is in her 70's. I don't want anything with limbs that are likely to snap (high wind area) or roots/suckers that will undermine the the foundation of the house.

    Have any suggestions about a tree that is comparable to a Pecan tree in size and amount of shade? What shrubs, bushes, or plants would be wise to plant close to the house to help shade the west-facing windows, while I'm waiting for a tree to grow? This is very important because there is an open field across the country street and the afternoon sun is absolutely horrible.

    Thanks

  • 19 years ago

    What area you in (generally)?

    Tulip poplar is fairly fast growing but still considered a quality tree.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Liriodendron tulipifera

  • 19 years ago

    Hey esh & thanks for the reply,

    We are in the Middle Georgia area. Actually, we have a Tulip Poplar tree. The poor little dear has had a hard life. lol It was hit/run over 3 times with a lawn mower or car and then the top got broken out of it. It now looks like a "tulip pine" - height but no pretty canopy.

    I was entertaining the idea of planting a line of three or four Tulip Poplars, which would run parallel to the road (about 75 feet from the house.) Then we could fill in several unshaded areas, which are closer to the house, with sapling trees such dogwood and others. I say dogwood because we have those in the woods behind the house.

    Any other ideas of possible trees, bushes, combinations, or arrangements?

  • 19 years ago

    Tulip poplars can be excellent fast growing trees (when they are not being run over, of course). My in-laws have a beautiful multi-trunked magnolia tree and they love to tell the story about how my husband mowed over it as a kid!

    I think your idea to plant a grouping of tulip poplars sounds good. Keep in mind the sun exposure where you might put the dogwoods - they would appreciate some afternoon shade. Redbuds are also excellent small trees. I like the cultivar 'Forest Pansy' both for it's leaf color and it's tendency to have a lot few seedlings.

    Other ideas for you to research:

    Sourwood (also called Lily of the Valley tree) - Oxydendrum arboreum; native tree, beautiful and unique flowers and gorgeous fall color.
    Black gum - Nyssa sylvatica; native tree, flowers are not showy, has berries for the birds and nice fall color.
    Serviceberry - Amelanchier species; native tree, nice spring flowers, birds adore the berries, good fall color. The cultivar 'Autumn Brillance' has even better fall color.

    Shrubs to consider:
    Blueberries, they have excellent fall color also (Vaccinium is the species name)
    Native azaleas, can be large enough to be considered a small tree; lots of choices, can be very fragrant.
    Viburnums are tough, durable shrubs. They can be fragrant, have berries, fall color (depends on which you choose).
    Hydrangeas - the paniculata ones can take more sun and have stunning summer flowers on panicles. Look into 'Tardiva'.

    One of my favorite garden books is The Southern Gardener's Book of Lists. It lists trees, shrubs, perennials for all kinds of conditions and desires (wet, dry, sunny, shady, fragrant, etc).

    Fall is an excellent time to plant (November would be fine). I'm sorry about your pecan tree; I know it's hard to lose such a old specimen.

  • 19 years ago

    Yiiipeeeee! Thanks for all the suggestions and great resources. We love the native plants so your suggestions were right on target. Mom has loads of flower beds with native plants. As long as the house gets some shade and we can keep things as natural as possible, she's happy.

    I can so relate to your story about the magnolia! There is a h-u-g-e Southern Magnolia tree in our backyard. Daddy managed to keep it in tact, mostly because it's so big. However, we did give him the dickens when he nailed the Poplar tree not once, but twice!

    Thanks for understanding about the Pecan tree. It sort of meant a lot to me. Loads of childhood memories associated with it. It was also nice to sit under the tree and imagine all the things it "saw" during its lifetime.

  • 19 years ago

    There are lot of QUALITY, LONG LIVED trees you can use that are FAST RAPID GROWING.

    Sycamore
    Tulip poplar
    Green Ash
    White Pine or also loblolly pine
    Sweetgum
    October Glory Red maple
    river Birch
    Bald Cypress
    American Linden
    Pin Oak

    There is even a discussion going on about Cottonwoods in the tree forum and how in the right place, they can be used but not for a small residential yard.

  • 19 years ago

    Black cherry is another one. The ornamental cherries are usually pretty fast growing too but the native black cherry does have nice blooms.

  • 19 years ago

    Catalpa is another one. I keep thinking of possibilities for you. This is a flowering tree with showy blooms.

  • 19 years ago

    Oh rats. How could I forget...
    American elm. Lke the d.e.d. resistant Princeton elms at home depot.

  • 19 years ago

    "One of my favorite garden books is The Southern Gardener's Book of Lists."

    Ditto on the book.

    IMHO, Tulip Poplar is not a good shade tree. They do not develop a broad canopy; they're very vertical in growth habit until they mature.

    Sycamore looks GREAT up north, they're never impressive in the south; same for Maples. White Pine is the most beetle ridden of all the pines I've seen.

    I guess you have to return to your timeline. How quickly do you want shade?

  • 19 years ago

    in the South, you have been looking in the wrong place. The park below Buford Dam has some truly massive Sycamores.
    I just planted some in my backyard to shade the house. One I grew from seed and another I found near the river. They grow slowly for the first year or two, then they take off. If you can get one in a 3 gallon pot, you should have shade quickly.

  • 19 years ago

    Agreed, Even in south florida there were some impressive large and vigorous sycamores. There is an alternative called London Planetree that can also be planted for anthracnose resistance which was one problem I noted with the florida sycamores but not here. Can you be more specific there Alex?

    Same goes for the maples.

    As for the tulip poplar when they are growing in a wooded setting or close to other trees they will tend to grow more tall and narrow, but there are quite a few around in open spaces that have a wide canopy.

    Not familar with pine pests but white pine is a beautiful tree, and you can not beat it for landscape color, ease of transplanting and growth rate. Not planting trees because of risk of any liabilities and OP will have a very barren landscape with maybe a plastic palm tree here and there. :-)

  • 19 years ago

    Northern trees are really at their best where the summers are not so tough on them. I know, I hear from folks that say the trees do good into Florida. The naturally ocurring ones in FL are essentially in swamps since they need so much summer water.
    BTW; I think we're off track here.

    The original question was to provide shade quickly. How quickly? How tall is the house that needs shading?

  • 19 years ago

    Sycamore is not a "northern tree." It may be planted more in cultivation up north but it is more prevalent as a pioneer species in lower latitudes. It's a staple of southern mesic habitats. It is also found out west and in arid climates. What exactly do you mean by "the summers are not so tough on them"? Are you trying to tell me that Sycamore which is native to Texas even Mexico and commonly planted there struggles to get through 90+ days of triple digit heat? That's absurd.
    My sycamores have grown like crazy through this past heat wave.

  • 19 years ago

    Ya'll are doing a fine job teaching me about the options and things I need to keep in mind. The house is approx. 75 ft. across the front and 32 ft. front-to-back. I'm guessing here, but my estimate would be that the house is about 20 ft. high, to the peak of the roof. At any rate it's only one story. lol

    Our neighbor, who lives two houses down, has a beautiful Tulip Poplar with a h-u-g-e canopy. Like was said earlier, it is sitting out in the open so it has had room to expand. This particular tree is more of a cone shape with a very wide base (bottom branches.) Great spot to put a swing for those warm summer nights.

    Another of my problems is that the Fall Line Freeway will be coming directly in front of the house, adding at least 2 or 3 more lanes of traffic. *SIGH* This is one reason that I would like to have a row of trees close to the roadfront property line. The front yard is about 200 ft. wide so that is a nice amount of room to add a few trees.

    On the property, we already have a Black cherry (which the freeway will probably get), 5 remaining Pecan trees, 2 Pink Dogwood, and a 50+ year old Southern Magnolia. Then we have shrubs/bushes such as several 6 ft. high Azaleas and Nandina (it's gotta go!) Mom has many native plants in her flower gardens including Cherokee Roses, Leather-Flower vine (reticulata), Money plant, Wild Ginger/"Little Brown Jugs", and loads of other plants.

  • 18 years ago

    If you want a big tree that will grow fast, Ailanthus is unbeatable. Drawbacks, yes, it is considered an invasive species. But it has been called a pretty tree, despite the fact that it is often held in low regards.
    Only in an emergency situation where time is of the utmost importance would I suggest Ailanthus.
    China Berry or Mulberry are fairly quality wood. They will both provide shade in a minimum of time, but again there are drawbacks.
    People are often faced with the problem of picking a tree to plant that they can live to enjoy, but it is almost always preferrable to plant a "good" tree like an oak or pecan and know that it will be here for others to enjoy and they will be glad you planted it

  • 18 years ago

    Drawbacks, yes, it is considered an invasive species.

    That's enough of a drawback for me! Ditto on China Berry. No way, no how.

  • 18 years ago

    I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think Ailanthus and company are the ugliest trees around if you can even call them trees. They are like palm thickets. Yuck.

  • 18 years ago

    "palm thickets"?

    I didn't think of that! Why not get a couple of bare root Sabal palmettos. Water them like the dickens and in a few years the crowns will regrow and can give shade.

    (thanks Quirckyquercus)

  • 18 years ago

    Lacywhims,

    I vote for tulip poplar. Great tree with plenty of foliage for shade, and fast growing. I wouldn't recommend the black gum just because it is a slow growing tree. Beautiful leaf color in the fall, but averages only 6" growth per year.

    perryrip

  • 18 years ago

    You might consider blowing in some insulation in the attic and walls, if there isn't much already. Even a "fast" growing tree is going to take 10 years before it will cast much shade on a house.

    Some growth rates from Michael Dirr's "Manual of Woody Landscape Plants":

    Tulip poplar - 2-2.5 ft/yr
    Sycamore - almost 2 ft/yr
    Ailanthus altissima - 3-5 ft/yr

    So a 10' tulip poplar or sycamore would be 30' or 35' or so after ten years. I wouldn't plant Ailanthus like esh_ga. Some people don't like sycamores because they drop stuff all the time -- ok in the woods, but not in a lawn, for some. Tulip poplar is one of my favorites.

    The shadow of a 30' tree planted 10' from a house would just reach the 20' peak of a roof, when the sun was at 45 deg (say mid afternoon in midsummer), assuming the direction of the shadow lines up. Lower parts of the roof and parts of the wall would be in some shade, of course. Later in the day, the shadows would be longer. At midday in summer, the shadow won't reach the house, unless the canopy has begun to spread. But most tall trees won't have a spreading canopy when they're only 30' tall.

  • 18 years ago

    With a highway going in front of your house, you will also want something to block out the noise generated by the traffic. I would suggest a mixture of Eastern Red Cedar, Mary Nell/Nellie R. Stevens hollies, sasanqua and Little Gem magnolia. These all go well together, grow quickly and are great for sound control.

    As for shade trees, I don't think that Red Oaks can be beat. I have one that I planted seventeen years ago that has to be fifty feet tall now; it gives great shade and has beautiful russet leaves in the Fall.

  • 18 years ago

    holy cow! somebody recommending planting Ailanthus?! unbelievable!

    Personally, I'd put in another pecan - they're just about as fast-growing as sycamore or tulip poplar and not a bit messier.
    It's my own preference, but I wouldn't want a sycamore in my yard - I can see three of them from the window here by the computer - a half-mile away across the pasture on the creekbank, they look great, their stark white bark shining in the winter sun; but in the yard, they're just...blah, and the huge brown fall leaves and seedballs are unsightly/undesirable.

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