Essirah,
Again several methods to starting seeds and no one right way. Mainly what works for you. I wet the planting mix before I plant the seed for inside planted seeds. Then I cover whatever I planted the seeds in with Saran wrap, plastic dome, ect. I usually prop up one end or a dome and put a small slit in the Saran wrap. Have never had any problems. I don't water again till the seeds have germinated and it appears they need to be watered. I personally don't put mine under the lights till they germinate. I have two heating mats I hardly use. I start most pepper seeds in the bathroom which I keep warmer. The rest of the seeds I plant are started in a spare bedroom.

The only time (knock on wood) I've had damping off was the year I tried watering from the bottom. I don't anymore. I know many swear by it. Doesn't seem to work for me as well. Again what works for the best for you.

After the seeds germinates I move them to the light shelves and remove the domes and saran wrap. The only reason I see for using lights before germination is for a little heat. In my opinion not needed till the plant germinates and emerges. I then only water when they need it. I start 5-7 seeds of peppers and tomatoes most years. Average anywhere from 85% to 97% germination most years. Seed source can really bring that down. I would of have over 95% two years ago but seeds from one source averaged around 30% even on replants and using a heat mat. As I had planted several seeds from this source brought my average way down. Jay

Watering from the bottom is the way to go, but...you don't let them soak, just dip the pots til they feel heavier.

It would take a whole lot of misting to put enough water in a cup filled with seed-starting mix to actually have excess water run out of the bottom of the cup.

I start seeds pretty much the way Jay does except I don't cover the flats with plastic wrap or a dome.

I am not a huge fan of bottom watering because it can keep the lower roots really wet while the upper roots are fairly dry....that's more of an issue while the seeds are sprouting and are tiny and haven't sent roots down very far yet.

Like Jay, I make sure my seed-starting mix is good and moist (but not soggy wet) before I plant. You want soil that feels like a sponge that has had the excess water squeezed out of it and you do not want soil that feels like a dripping-wet saturated sponge. If you plant into a dry mix and then water heavily from above, you can wash seeds out of the soil.

I only use a mister for teeney-tiny seeds that might wash out of seed-starting mix with top watering.

There are many ways to start seeds and you'll just have to experiment to figure out what works best for you. I've done it many different ways the last couple of decades and I've generally been happy with most of them. Whether you water from the top, the bottom or with a hand-held misting bottle, the key is to aim for evenly moist soil. Not super-wet soil. Not water sitting for hours in the bottom of the flats. Just evenly moist soil. It also is especially helpful to have good air circulation in the area where your seeds are growing. I keep a fan running during the day when the lights on the light shelf are on and then turn it off at night.

More people harm their seedlings by keeping them too wet or too hot or too wet and too hot. Strive for even moistness and temps in the mid-60s to lower 70s indoors.

Seedlings are tougher than we think they are and they shouldn't need to be watered every single day. I water based on how the soil and plants look and feel and not on a schedule.

Everyone does things differently and there's nothing wrong with that and you will learn what works best for you.

I have seeds/seedlings of about 600 plants growing under lights right now and will be starting more today and tomorrow. I seldom lose a seedling to anything although every now and then damping off might get one....but most years I don't have any damping off at all. I tend to keep my seedlings a little on the dry side because excess moisture encourages disease. Excess moisture also can smother roots because it interferes with oxygen uptake, so for my plants, less water is better while they're at the seedling stage.

For many years, I only direct-seeded veggies and flowers into the ground and planted purchased tomato and pepper plants. Once I started growing from seed in the early to mid-1990s though, I became hooked on starting my own from seed. In the early years, I had to learn not to kill my seedlings by "loving them to death", which is a phrase we generally use to describe a combination of overwatering and/or overfeeding.

If you keep your seedlings' soil evenly moist, have good air circulation in the room, grow the seedlings at a slightly cool temperature and keep the lights close to the seedlings so they don't become leggy, then the seedlings will grow just fine. I tend to neglect my seedlings once they've sprouted because I'm busy with other gardening chores. I turn on their light and fan in the morning, check their moistness and water any that need it and then don't give them another thought until I go into that room to turn off the light at bedtime.

Dawn

Dawn's methods as she says are a lot like mine. I will share a few more of my opinions. I do use a couple of methods depending on what I have time to do at the time. I use the method of a local lady who runs a nursery and starts several thousand plants every year when I have time. She put her starting mix in a big bowl and adds water to evenly moist then fills her flats. Smoothes off the top. Adds seeds, sprinkles lightly and puts them in the germination chamber. I'm like her I don't have time to bottom water. Even with my 500-700 cups, pots,ect just dipping them till each felt heavier would be too time consuming. After I had the trouble with damping off from bottom watering I did some research. I talked to the larger nursery growers and some university horticulture research personel and the general agreement is there is no advantage too bottom watering. Just a personal preference and what works for you. For me it isn't practical. For others especially those starting and growing small numbers it works well. I would never say any of the methods 'are the way to go." Like Dawn said it is a lot easier to over water than many think. And I've killed more plants with love than I ever have neglect. I tend to let plants wilt a little before watering. And I usually have very nice plants. Jay

I don't bottom water young seedlings either, but when they are outside hardening off, I find that works OK for me. I have all of my plants in pots or cups sitting inside open mesh type flats. I put water in a solid flat and set the open flat down into it. Since by this time, I am outside most of the time, I just go by occasionally and trade them out, after I can see that the water has started to wick up to the top of the soil. It takes a while for this to happen tho, and if I wasn't already going to be outside anyway, it would be way too time consuming.

This is my first year to try and start seed and I started mine on monday. I had brocoli sprouts yesterday and tomato sprouts today. I did 2 containers and in one I presoaked the seed starting mix, and in the other I just watered from the top. The sprouts all came from the presoaked one, so now I know!

How do those of you who water from the top do it? Everything that I've seen says to water from the bottom, but I would prefer not to have to move all of my flats each time I need to water. I have a mister that I use for the tiny cells, but I'm not sure that it would get the larger ones evenly moist. Do you use a sprinkler watering can?

-Megan

Megan,
First I will say all of the bigger nurseries I know around here water from the top. Whether they have a mist system or use a hose with a sprayer. There is several reasons. One is it is faster, less labor and just as effective. On my seed trays inside I use a couple of methods. While they are young and small you don't need to water that often. I use a bottle with either a pop up top or a sprinler end and water when needed. After I pot up and have moved outside to my frames and on my winter sown cups I just use a hose end sprayer. After a plant is in the ground I don't ever spray as it splashes up soil. But with clean sterile starting and potting mix I've never had any problems. I water basically like a nursery does. With my time constraints I don't have the time to bottom water like many do. One reason it didn't and doesn't work for me. If I was retired and had plenty of time then I'm sure it might work better.

The other thing is all of my trays and holders have holes in the bottom especially when I move them outside. And again would take too much time to move them to a solid bottom container just so I could bottom water. If you use a solid bottom when hardening off and get a rain then they can drown. Jay

Carol, You know, I will bottom water outside if the plants get too dry while I'm away at a fire and they'e miserable-looking when I get home. I'll fill the flats (which don't have drainage holes in them, since I use them indoors) with water and leave it for a while so the plants in their cups can soak up the water. I always come back out and drain off the excess so water isn't sitting in the bottom of the flat long-term. That's about the only time I do it though.

I hate to say it, but since my flats are near the house and I'm usually near the garden some distance from the house, my seedlings are probably more negelected when they & I are outside than when we are inside. Once I'm outside, I'm too distracted by 1 million and one other things.

Kristin, Congrats on the blessed arrival of the veggie sprouts! See, doesn't spring feel closer already? I like the way you tried it both ways so you could see what works best for you....that's the best way to learn things.

Megan, While the flats are inside I usually water using a small watering can with a small spout You can buy these little indoor watering cans in the gardening supply area at places like Wal-Mart, usually near the small indoor bags of potting soil, water-soluable fertilizers, flower pots, etc. If I look at the seedlings and only a few need water, I just fill up a drinking glass at the sink and quickly water those few.

Once they're outdoors, I will water with a hand-held garden hose set for a pretty low flow and I do my best to put the water on the soil and not the plant foliage. Sometimes if I have planned ahead and put a watering nozzle on the hose, I'll water with it, but I really don't like getting moisture on the foliage at all. I try to keep all my flats of seedlings on folding tables or on the patio or a porch where I don't have to worry about soil splash.

I think Jay and I both have already mentioned soil splash at least once, so I'll tell you why we avoid it....some fungal and bacterial plant diseases are soil-borne (and airborne or even seed-borne). Whenever you water in a way that water first hits the ground or any other unsterile surface and then splashes up onto your seedlings, the seedlings can become infected with these diseases. The longer you keep soil splash off your leaves, the better you help the plants avoid infection.

Jay, The rain issue isn't usually a problem in my flats without drainage holes because I'm not usually gone all day long, except during a bad fire. It isn't often a big rainstorm kicks up while we're at a grassfire/wildfire and, if it does, I'm usually home pretty quickly since the rain will normally put out the fire.

I sometimes do have trouble with high winds beating plants to death while I'm away. If I am home and the wind comes up, I can move the plants to amore sheltered area, but if the wind is calm when I leave and then it strengthens, the plants can suffer. Last year was the first time in years I've lost a lot of seedling plants to wind, but then last year we had a horrid winter fire season--with much of the issue being the hard winds were driving the fires and making them advance insanely fast. The fire season has started here this week (though not at our end of the county) but I don't think it will be a bad one, so hopefully the seedlings won't be so neglected this spring.

I have more seeds to plant, and flats full of paper cups set up and ready for them, but with snow in next week's forecast, I'm trying to slow myself down a bit.

Dawn

I plant my seeds in pre-moistened starting mix, then plop a very loose fitting top on it to conserve a bit of moisture but it's not tight by any means, just haphazardly tossed on.

Once they germinate, I usually bottom water. I'll plop a flat in a water tray, get distracted by something else, come back and switch them out a few hours later. I only do that when they're tiny, though, as once they start getting large enough to put up into individual pots, it would take too much time.

Once they are larger and potted up, I top water with a "shower" setting on my hose end. They're pretty tough so I don't need to baby them. (I keep a fan on them most of the time so they get strong.)

I also let them dry out to the point of near-death most times so I don't need to water them all that often. Once they're outside, awaiting planting out, I occasionally bottom water again since there are usually puddles to plop trays in and forget for a few hours -- and I'm too lazy to drag out the hose.

I've only had damping off problems one year, by the way.

Diane

I guess I am getting a little worried because I started them on Monday and still don't have any signs of life there. I have misted enough to soak the top soil, but have been very careful to not let any thing splash out side the cup. I only mist when the soil looks really dry. I didn't wet the soil before I planted. I keep the light for warmth, because although they are in a room in the house, it is one of the cooler rooms. I turn it off at night. Maybe it is just too soon to see anything yet?? I see where some people seen things in two days...

Ezzirah,

I think maybe why mine came up in just a few days is because I have them sitting on top of a heating pad. If they are under a florescent light, I don't think they put off much heat. Maybe a warmer place, like on top the fridge?

I considered that, that maybe if I went out and got a heating pad or moved them...

Ezzirah, If you planted into a dry mix, that likely is part of the reason your seeds are taking their time....although it has been less than a week so it certainly hasn't been long enough to worry about how 'slow' they are to sprout. You have to be careful not to overwater them or the seeds can rot before they sprout.

Different kinds of seeds sprout at different rates too. For example, tomatoes sprout more quickly than peppers.

Since your mix was dry, there wasn't much moisture there for the seeds to soak up and they need a certain amount of moisture to induce germination. So, your seeds are likely a bit slower to sprout because they started out dry.

Bottom heat makes seeds sprout more quickly, but only by a handful of days.

Krisin, If you have enough fluorescent lights they do put off quite a bit of heat. My seed starting shelf system has a total of 10 four-foot long shop lights and each light has 2 fluorescent tubes, so that's 20 tubes in one room, and that room heats up quite a lot. In fact, on a sunny day, the combination of sunlight and articifical light heat it up so much that it is way too hot in there.

Once the seed-starting lights are on, I close off the heating vent to that room but it still is the warmest room in the house by far. On sunny days, and this includes pretty cold sunny days, I have to open up windows and let cold air into the room to cool it off. I do keep the door to that room closed so its odd temps don't interfere with the temperatures in the rest of the house.

Dawn

Ezzirah if I were in your current position I'd give those seed flats a good bottom soak in warm water to make sure they were evenly moist and had enough water to germinate. They may already have enough but I'd personally take the guesswork out for myself and make sure they're good and moist.

Then after they've germinated I'd water as needed (from the top or the bottom whichever method you prefer). I don't know that I'd worry about a heating pad or not (I don't use one) but if they are resting on a cold surface like a counter top or something like that you might put a kitchen towel under the tray.

My set up is on the kitchen bar with towels under them. I always water with warm water. I use plastic tops to hold in a little heat just until I see things starting to happen. Once I have sprouts I put them under the lights.

Like Dawn I'm not sure you've given them enough time though so I wouldn't worry so much yet. :-)

Just figured I'd share what I'd do if I were in your position. Good luck to you.

Mandy

Like Dawn and Mandy stated it is still too early too get worried in my opinion. There are exceptions to the rule about germination times. I usually see most of mine germinate in the system I use in 5-10 days. I have very few earlier than 5 days ever. And always have some that may be up to 15 days. And have had a few even at 25 days. But that is rare.

I will say in the future I would suggest wetting your mix good before planting the seeds. If I'm going to soak it I do it 3-7 days before. Then I drain the tray in an hour of so and then again the next day. Like I said last year I used the method the lady at the nursery uses also. Wet it good in a large bowl and then filled the trays and planted shortly after I filled them. If they are nice and moist then I've never had problems with the mix getting too dry. Too wet is the problem most have when they've asked for my advice. Several coworkers are now starting their seeds after hearing me talk about it last year. A couple had over watering problems last year. Your case is a rare one where being too dry could possibly be a problem. I would wait a few more days before I took real drastic measures. When I did my last germination tests. I had one variety I think was around 75-80% after like six days. One was already 100%. Then after nine days all ended up 100%. Gardening is like training a horse. Patience is first thing a person needs to learn. Most want the biggest fruits, veggies and flowers now. They add fertilizer one day and wonder why the plant is still yellow the next. I've been there and done that. So I have been as guilty as anyone. Now many coworkers can't understand why I'm so laid back. The only thing now that gets me into high gear is the tomato hornworms. Keep us informed. I wouldn't be surprised to read by Monday you have little heads popping up. Jay

"Gardening is like training a horse....". Jay, that's a great analogy. I can see the book now....'The Tomato Whisperer'. LOL

I am surprisingly laid back now too, compared to 'before' and mostly it is from hard lessons learned. I used to push so hard to plant early, but got tired of having to cover up the plants repeatedly on late, cold nights.

Hornworms don't bother me in general, unless they get on one of my favorite plants....but those darned stink bugs get me riled up pretty fast. Other than that, I don't mind having a garden full of or surrounded by critters--well, except for the large, four-footed ones.

I tend to forget my seedlings every now and then and I'll go into the room and they'll be wilting and looking pretty sad. I water them, they survive, and so it goes.....but if I have a friend or family member with me and they see the seedlings wilted, they're just horrified and worried that I'm going to lose them all. I just shrug and say 'nope, they'll be OK' and then they're surprised I'm so calm. Honestly, though, there isn't much that riles me up when it comes to gardening....it is supposed to be an enjoyable, relaxing, joyful adventure so I refuse to worry over every little thing and let it stress me out.

Dawn

So, I haven't started my seeds yet!! I am just afraid that my plants will get too big to keep in the house. It's so darn wet around my house. I don't want to take any chances in getting my plants going too early and then losing them. I put too much love and care into them just to lost them to too much moisture!! Having said that, I did get some wintersowing done at the first of last month. I got some perennials, lettuce, cabbage, and broccoli. Have checked on them on Friday and they were still moist. I'm going to go ahead and start seeds this week. Just have to get my table set up and my lights ready. I had 2 4' shop lights given to me last summer. I was so excited!! When I plant my seeds I place the soil mix into the pots first then get it wet and let it drain off excess moisture. I then put my seeds in and then top with a bit more mix. It seems to work well for me. I cover mine with a plastic dome and don't even water them again till my seeds have sprouted. I have several more veggies that I'm going to grow this year, so I've got to get me some more domes.

Jay, I got the seeds in the mail on Thursday and was so excited!! Thank you so much. I think I'm going to try each of them that you sent and whichever works out better is probably what I'll stick with. And, I'm going to definitely going to save seeds from each of them.

I do still have some seed that I need to order. But, I'm trying to look thru all my catalogs and find the best deal. What a job. And I want to get good reliable seeds.

Carol, Is it extremely wet over there like it is here? NO MORE RAIN!!! We have gotten so much rain already that I'm not sure when I'll be able to work my garden area. And having said that, I'm also afraid to put onions in the ground. I don't want them to rot like they did on me back in the fall.

One thing I love about the seedlings is that I let my kids help me and they get really excited when they start to see sprouts!! I love it.

Dawn, You are my hero! I can't believe how many seedlings you have. That's great. Wish I had enough room for that many.

I have only just begun. : )

In a wet year like this year, I go wild planting everything as it makes up for the all-too-frequent drought years when I cut back on planting because of a lack of available water.

I AM worried about seedlings getting too big before they can go outside, but I do have some options that are possible if the weather is only a little too cold, including a screened-in back porch, an east-facing front porch with morning sun, a south-facing side porch with afternoon sun, a concrete slab patio and a barn/garage.

I like to move seedlings out of the house as soon as I can in order to get them into the cooler temps and slow down their growth, and in order to make room to start more seedlings.

I'm hoping that after tonight's/tomorrow's rain and Tuesday's rain/snow, maybe we'll get a break and can work outside some. We are still exceptionally wet here...still have big ol' puddles of standing water....but my raised beds are drier than the grade-level ground.

Here in Oklahoma (and I'm sure it is true in NM, KS, TX, AR and MO as well) if we wait for 'perfect planting weather', we'd never get our planting done. So, at some point, we have to ignore the mud and transplant our little seedings out into the big bad world. I'm planning to get the onions in the ground before the end of Feb., and potatoes immediately after that. It's time!

Dawn

Melissa, Yes it is very wet here. Today is the first day that I could walk across my garden without getting muddy and rain is predicted for tomorrow. My garden is not ready to plant except for one raised bed. I started a few cole crops inside this week and most of them are already up. I put them under lights today, and should have done it a day earlier. I just bought Texas Sweet onion plants tonight at Lowes so I hope things dry out soon.

I had planned to start my tomatoes and peppers today, but haven't done it yet. I start teaching a census class on Monday, so I guess I will be planting at night.

So, while exchanging a water heater today, I browsed thru the seed section. I went ahead and picked up a package of cucumbers and 2 different types of zucchini. I was really tempted by the onions, but still too wet!! Also got another seed starting flat. I am going to try to get my seeds started this week. I think they'll be ok. I don't have a lot of extra space so I don't want to plant too early and then have to re-pot into bigger pots. Would like to just plant them outside when it's time and not worry about the weather! But you're right, Dawn!! We can't depend on Oklahoma weather or we would be let down constantly.

I have a lot of 2 liter pop bottles that my MIL saved for me. I think I will use them as covers after I plant them to give them a little more protection from the weather till it's consistently warm. I think that will work?! Maybe, hopefully.

Carol, sounds like you're going to be busy as a bee!! lol And what is up with all this rain?! Maybe we can ban together and pray it away.

Carol, You know, before it starting raining overnight, I could walk through the top half of the garden without sinking too deeply into the mud. Now it's right back to where it was a few days ago...with water standing in the pathways. This is driving me crazy! It's probably just as well you haven't started too many seeds yet because I bet it stays too wet for planting for some time now.

Melissa, Blame it all on El Nino. This is the second strongest El Nino in the USA since they gained a better understanding of El Nino and started tracking its effects on weather patterns in the USA, and it is performing precisely as expected.

I looked at long-term temperature and precipitation forecasts for March today and they predict higher than average moisture for Oklahoma and lower than average temperatures....so El Nino will continue to wreck our gardening plans in March.

It tends to be 'too dry' here in southern OK much more than it tends to be 'too wet', so I'm not dealing with the 'too wet' part very well. You know, if I had wanted a mud-colored floor and carpet, that's what I would have chosen when we picked out the flooring for the house.

Keep a close eye on the plants under the 2-liter bottles on sunny days (if we ever have a sunny day again) because they get can really hot if the sun stays out for a few hours.

I have raised beds that are draining better than the unraised areas, but they still seem too soupy to plant onions and potatoes. I need new raised beds on top of my current raised beds!

Dawn

I have one raised bed that is 12 x 4 and it has a piece of plastic over it, so it will be the only thing I can plant for awhile unless I do a few containers. I only have two flats of seed started right now and even at that I will probably have too many plants to take care of once I have to pot them up. It always looks so little when you are looking at tiny seedlings, but by the time you would like to get them in the ground and they NEED to be in the ground, you wonder why you planted so many, especially if you have to tote them in and out for sunshine. LOL

Well, it is Monday, and I have had 3 seeds come up out of 20. They are tiny little threads. But only 3....sniff...sniff...

I bought a heating pad and I put it under the seeds. It has auto shut off and it is on the lowest setting. We will see what happens I guess. I decided to experiment and put one in a paper towel like I saw on the web. They are racing now to see who will germinate first.....:)

Ezzirah,
In my experience the ones with auto shut off don't work that well. I prefer the ones with just an on/off. And then use the low setting. The auto shut off will shut if off every few hours. I can't remember how long. Hope it helps. Jay

Carol, I need to start potting up tomato seedlings from their starter flats to individual paper cups and I am already worried about all the space they'll take up on the light shelf.

I think I can move my four flats of pea seedlings out to the screened-in porch in a day or two and that will free up more space for tomato seedings.

Ezzirah, I share Jay's feelings about the heating pads with the auto on/off. Most seedlings germinate just fine without heat....heat is just a little insurance to speed up germination if you're on a tight schedule.

Some years I have pre-sprouted many types of seeds in paper towels or coffee filters, and prefer coffee filters because the seeds don't stick to them as much as they stick to the paper towels. You have to watch them carefully--checking them daily and moving them to soil as soon as they sprout. If you leave them in the coffee filter or paper towel too long, they can grow through them/to them and suffer root damage or even stem breakage when you try to remove them from the paper.

I haven't pre-sprouted much of anything in paper towels this year since it is not a good year to plant early and I am in no hurry.

As Carol said, it can be a huge issue to have to carry ever-taller plants outside every morning and inside every night once they're too tall for the shelves. When we have cold weather that delays transplanting, having too many plants that are too large to maintain indoors becomes a big problem.

Dawn

Ezzirah, I've linked to what we're trying for the first time this year. I wasn't sure how well it would work, but I had germination of two types of kale, cauliflower and broccoli in only two days. It's been 5 now and almost everything I started has come up--even a few of the peppers sprouted up this morning! I have taken everything but the peppers off of the heat beds now so that they don't get too leggy. I had domes with vents on over them, but I've taken them off of everything but the peppers as well. I also have a ceiling fan on high full time in that room.

Our set up is a little different than the one in the link. We used cardboard boxes that will hold full flats, but the basic idea is the same. I think that the whole thing ended up costing us around $20 to heat a 2' by 4' shelf--which will hold 4 large flats of seedlings.

Here is a link that might be useful: DIY Seed Heat

Do any of you feed your seedlings? If so, at what stages and with what?

Thanks!
Andria

I don't usually till after I pot up and they are usually at least 4 weeks old or older when I do. It also depends on the potting mix I use. If it has no feed at all then I will feed with fish emulsion of something similar. I've had a hard time finding the good commercial mixes like Pro-mix the last two year. Used 3-4 different mixes last year. This year I finally gave in and have bought a few bags of Ferti-lome mix. One I bought has some food added and the other don't. I may pick up some Miracle Grow also. If the mix has any at all I seldom ever add any. Unless I have to hold them longer due to weather ect. Last year I used a mix that had nothing and after around 3 weeks they really got stunted and took me a while to get them to bounce back. I let the plants tell me when to feed them. But I've never needed to feed before a month till last year. Jay

Andria,

Whether and how often I feed them depends on what kind of soil-less mix I use when potting them up, but I pretty much do the same things Jay does.

Sometimes, I mix up my own organic potting mix and when I do that, I'll feed them with a commercial water-soluable fertilizer diluted to half-strength, and I'll feed them either every week or every other week depending on what they look like--if they're hungry, you can see it in their off-color or slowed growth.

Sometimes I pot them up into regular Miracle Grow potting soil (NOT the organic one) and if I do that, the soil feeds them and I don't have to worry about it.

Of those two options, I actually prefer using the MG potting soil for potting up seedlings, although I'm mostly organic in every other way, precisely because I then don't have to worry about feeding them. There's so much going on in the spring that not having to feed the seedlings is just one less thing to worry about.

I usually pot them up at three weeks of age. The above is mostly for tomato, pepper, eggplant and some very slow-growing flower seedlings since I hold them longer as seedlings--usually until they're 8 weeks old for tomatoes or about 10-12 weeks old for peppers and slower types of flowers.

Other seedlings, and esp. the cool-season crops like peas or lettuce go into the ground very quickly---at 2 or 3 weeks of age if the weather permits, and I just put them into the prepared beds and water them in. The compost and other organic matter in the beds will feed them as needed and I usually put a handful of Tomato-Tone plant food in the planting holes at planting time. Broccoli might get fed once, around 3 weeks of age, if it goes straight from sterile soil-less seed-starting mix to the garden which it usually does at 4 or 5 weeks old.

In general, I avoid non-organic fertilizers, preferring to feed the soil and let the soil feed the plants. My favorite organic ferts are liquid seaweed, liquid fish emulsion or a combo of the two, like Neptune's Harvest. I also use compost tea a lot. Sometimes, though, I'll use Miracle Grow water-soluable fertilizer either with very young seedlings (they need food fast due to their small root systems and organic ferts are slower-acting, so MG is what helps them most quickly at that point) or I'll sometimes use a Bloom Booster type fertilizer if I am trying to manipulate peppers and tomatoes to bloom during a rare summer cool-spell that occurs after the heat has already shut down fertilization.

If I use a commercial fertilizer with seedlings, I dilute it to half-strength because they're babies and I don't think they need full-strength fertilizer at that point, but I am flexible....if it is raining every day or every other day and the nonstop rain is leaching the nutrients out of their soil, I might feed them more often to compensate. I remember I had to do than in 2007.

Flower seedlings in general don't get fed unless they show a sign of nutritional deficiency. I don't care if they get off to a slower start because they'll catch up and bloom. With veggies though, since I'm often in a rush to get them to produce before the heat arrives, I like to give that supplemental feeding to push them along and get them to produce as early as possible.

Dawn

yeah, the darn heating pad cuts off in two hours. I think I will get a germination station for the next round of seeds. (I plan on planting to keep plants going in my square foot gardens) I am still hoping for the coffee filter, watching it closely I have it on the warm DVD player in the living room!

I have about 4 that have sprouted up, both my brussel sprouts, one of my sweet 100's, and 2 rainbow chards. I am happy about that...there is many others that I have not seen anything out of...

Ezzirah, you can take out the auto shut off from those heating pads. Open up the control, find the offending wire, and snip. (This is assuming you know what you're looking for. LOL)

I don't fertilize my seedlings but I do use MG potting soil for potting up so they get fed through that. That's the only fertilizing my plants ever get, other than what's in the soil outdoors.

Diane

dawn - I didn't even think of that!! Duh.....and here I was going to take the darn thing back. You just saved me a trip!

Some of my little seedlings have weeeee little leafs. They have not all come up, but I guess they are slowly, in less some just don't...I don't know...

I'm glad this thread was started because I may have messed up already... :-"

Here's where I am: I planted my seeds in moist (not wet) seed starting mix and kept them in front of my patio double doors which let in several hours of direct sunlight each day. The seedlings started popping up in less than a week (so far so good). Soon, the seedlings started growing towards the sun so I would rotated them each day so that by sundown they were growing upright again.

In the meantime, I read where many people put multiple seeds in each peat pot but I had only put one (guess I thought I had magic seeds and every one would sprout!) so I went back and added another seed or two in each pot.

The original seedlings shot up real quick and were 2" tall in 3-4 days but were now growing tall and thin. Without proper lights/shelving, I pulled out a tripod stand that had a light dome on it and setup a make-shift lighting area. The problem now was even with the edge of the dome practically sitting on the soil, the lightbulb was still 6"-7" away from the tops of the leaves.

So, my question is will the seedlings eventually 'fatten up' as they continue to grow under the dome light (once there is less distance between leaves & light source)? Or should I bail on this idea and invest in some shop lights?

The only saving grace in this scenario is that second wave of seeds I planted which (as of this weekend) have just broken through the surface. So if need be, I can yank out the skinny seedlings and use the shop lights (or dome if that will still work) and continue growing the second set of emerging seedlings. This would only set me back about a week.

Ideas and suggestions would be greatly appreciated at this point. This first year learning curve is wearing me slick!!!

Thanks everyone!
Lynn

There were a couple of things that would have helped, but it may not be too late to save them. If they look healthy otherwise (other than tall and lanky), I would let them grow until they have their first two "real leaves", then I would put them in a larger cup and bury them almost to the bottom of the leaves. If they are healthy enough to be saved they will just sprout more roots along the buried stem. After you do this, turn on a small fan so that there will be some air movement in the room. The stems will strengthen to deal with the slight breeze. Others may give you different advice, but that is what I would do. Of course, it wouldn't hurt to plant a few more seeds and give them better light as soon as they germinate.

This is interesting, because I have used a grow light and the grow light is literately 2 inches from the plant, but they are still about 1 1/2" long with weeee little leaves on top. I still have the light close, but they are down in a box, I am wondering now about a fan and the light and the box. I don't know what "leggy" looks like, so if they are "leggy" I wouldn't know..

I wanted to add: I am worried I started too early...I didn't plan on putting soil in the raised bed until march 15, at what point do you transplant them into bigger paper dixie cups?

Lynn, I don't really have anything to add to what Carol said because she covered all the bases. Once seedlings are leggy, deeper potting helps some of them....like tomatoes which will root along the stem if planted deeply, but not all veggies root along the stem like that.

I'd try to salvage the ones I had, if I were you, by following Carol's recommendations, but I'd start extra seeds as backup if I had them. At this point, you really aren't 'behind' because plants cannot go into the ground until the outdoor soil is warm enough (and it isn't close to that yet for warm-season crops) and 'late' plants often catch up with those transplanted earlier and into colder ground.

Ezzirah, As we've discussed on the other seedstarting thread, a warm room, lack of air movement, too much water and too much fertilizer all can give you leggier seedlings.

I transplant small seedlings into deeper paper cups as soon as the seedlings have two true leaves. I am going to start potting up my tomato seedlings into their larger paper cups today, and these are from seeds sown on Super Bowl Sunday.

Dawn

Actually, I mis-spoke. I didn't start the seedings on Super Bowl Sunday although that was my target date....I started them a day or two later.

Sorry, it would have been helpful to specify which veggie I was concerned about ~ it is my tomatoes.

I initially planted twice what I thought I would need (if I wanted 2 plants of a certain variety, I planted four peat cells; for 4 plants, I planted 8, etc.) and then I went back later and added more seeds per cell. I think I'll be okay in quantity -- unless there is a seedling failure rate I should factor in? I have plenty of seeds so starting more wouldn't be a problem. All the seedlings look healthy --just a little skinny. They broke the surface this past Sunday and are now 2" to 2 1/2" tall. Does that qualify as "leggy" or am I being a nervous newbie? :-P

I guess if repotting deeper can build a greater root system, maybe that will be a good thing in the long run.
It's possible I'm worrying over nothing but the seed starting process is all new to me - we previously bought plants - so I'm not sure how they should look at what stage. Maybe someone has posted pics I can refer to for help as well.

Thanks again for your advice.
Lynn

Lynn,

If your plants have gone from breaking through the soil surface on Sunday to being 2 to 2.5" tall, then I would consider them to be 'leggy' although it is hard to know for sure without seeing them.

The problem with leggy plants is the stem is very narrow and cannot support the plant's weight and can fall over onto the soil surface and/or snap in half. Potting up the seedlings into deeper containers gives the thin stems support and eventually roots will form along the stem. Some years I pot up several times, each time into a larger container, to get larger root systems before I put the plants into the ground. Some years I only pot up once--from the starter flat to the inividual containers. For me, it varies from year to year based purely on how much time I have available.

Although we try to avoid legginess, sometimes it happens but it does bring a couple of risks.

First, there's the previously mentioned risk that the plant has grown too tall too quickly and the thin stem cannot support its own weight in an upright position.

Secondly, while we all would like to transplant our seedlings into ground on or before mid-April in central OK (and for southern OK gardeners like me, the end of March based on our average last freeze date), the fact remains that the weather controls us. If the late March/early April weather remains very cold, we'll have to keep our plants inside a structure and out of the cold for longer than usual. If our plants are already leggy, keeping them inside a few days or weeks longer can be very hard as they often get taller than the space available under the lights. At that point, you have to do something...and often that something involves carrying plants outside into part-sun daily, and back inside at night to avoid the cold temps.

So, avoiding legginess can keep you from losing delicate plants that can't hold themselves upright and it also can save you from spending a lot of time ferrying 'too tall' plants in and out daily. Legginess isn't the worst thing in the world though, but leggy plants often snap off at the ground level in our strong spring winds. Thus, your goal should be short and stocky, thick or dense plants and not tall, thin ones.

Look at the photos at the bottom of the linked page to see a leggy tomato standing right beside a more normal-looking one.

Dawn

Here is a link that might be useful: Link with photo of a leggy tomato seedling