I too got rid of my Hot Tamale. Unfortunately for it, I had Rainbow's End right next to it and Rainbow's End was hands down the winner. I assume you have RE already because for my money it's still one of the best minis out there. Of the ones you listed only two rate more then poor to mediocre with the ARS. That would be Palmetto Sunrise and Sweet Revenge. I looked both up in the RIR from the years following their introduction and the general comments about PS was that it opened quickly (something I don't like). Sweet Revenge rated a very good 8.1, but RIR said that it was a little slow on the repeat. But it's maintained a very good rating since 1995 so that usually means it has some definite merit to it (I stress the word usually).

Why not try a new Hot Tamale?

Mike, do you have Autumn Splendor? I got it last year. It's a producer!

I had Rainbow's End years ago, but it was a blackspot magnet for me. Maybe now with the Bayer and Banner Max I use it might not be as big a problem.
I had Autumn Splendor, too. I can't really say why I gave it away. There's nothing wrong with it. But I am looking for something with some blending of colors and some orange effect. AS is Red and Deep Yellow to me, 2 distinct colors. But it IS a good rose. Maybe I'll reconsider.
Maryl, I have had any number of roses that did great for me that were not highly rated by the ARS, so I take that rating with a grain of salt. It's something to look at, but personal reports, especially from growers in similar growing conditions, means more to me. I also think perhaps exhibition quality if often weighted more heavily than garden performance.
Evie, Hot Tamale has had a few years with me. If I had all the space I wanted, then I'd get another. But given that others report some of the same problems, I'd rather try something new at this point.

You are so right about regionalism. I spray on a somewhat regular schedule with either Banner Maxx or Fungunex and I've never had BS on my Rainbows End. Even if I miss a few sprayings it has stayed clean for me. But I've heard others say they have had problems so I'm guessing that either I'm more on schedule during prime infection time then they are or their strain of BS is different then mine. I do use the ARS ratings as a guide as I've never had a lower rated rose (7.0 and under) perform other then poorly for me. But it is just a guide and others mileage may very..BTW did you get Leading Lady this year?

Maryl, YEEESSSS to Leading Lady. I just got her last November, so she's really just getting started, but already blooming impressively. I just had 4 blooms at once this week. What a Beauty!! It hardly seems like a mini; I'd say barely small enough in bloom size to call even a mini flora. I have some hybrid teas with blooms no bigger. Great form and color, and very nice staying power. I've already had numerous admiring comments from neighbors.

I didn't mean to sound as dismissive of the ARS rating as I probably sounded, but I do look at it as just one factor. I'm greedy when it comes to wanting lots of blooms and good repeat, but if a rose is otherwise exceptional enough, sometimes it's worth it. Sweet Revenge may be worth a second look. It certainly looks beautiful from the photos and definitely has actual orange in it, not just red and yellow. Oh, and I agree with you about waiting for buds to come, only to see them pop open too quickly; rather disappointing; so thanks for the heads-up about Palmetto Sunrise.

One of the factors befuddling my brain as far as choosing color combinations, is that my roses almost all are grown in one small area, so close together, and I already have a pink edged yellow "Bees Knees" (definitely a keeper) and a baby "Dancing Flame" that hasn't bloomed yet but should be a red-edged yellow. Incidentally, I also used to have bright yellow "Y2K", which had hints of red edges, but it was a victim of Hurricane Katrina in 2005--baked and dried out while I was evacuated 6 weeks. :( So Autumn Splendor, Rainbow's End, etc, as good as they are, may be a little less distinctive in color for me than something else. Oh I almost forgot; I also have "Absolutely," which is soft yellow, white, apricot and pink all blended subtly together. And for soft Apricot, I have a young "Double Gold" (unfortunately short-stemmed and growing soooo slowly, but gorgeous bloom color and form and fragrant to boot) plus I'm planning to get Apricot Twist. So Something clearly in the orange-blend range would add some diversity.

(Boy! what a rambler I am on the weekends! lol)

Mike

You know Mike they crank out minis like animal crackers so that if an older mini holds its rating for years I figure it may have something going for it. But there are some very highly rated minis (ie: Snow Bride-8.7) that have been complete flops for me.....My Leading Lady arrived with 2 blooms on it and they opened, held for maybe a day and 1/2 and then lost form. I was hoping for better staying power (especially since it's not even hot yet), but I'll give it some more time to develop....I've asked about Bee's Knee's over the years was told that the bush form isn't very attractive. Something else I really must have.....Have you asked about Glowing Amber (8.0)? I've seen it around on the tables and it certainly was a bright little pup.

I hold 'Dee Bennett' in the highest regard for all she has done for the miniature rose. In the PNW, Dee Bennett's namesake, grows well and the blooms are to die for. Although classed as an orange blend, in my climate, to my eye's it is a clear orange with wonderful form and holding power. Oh, and it blooms like crazy too! It may be not be so in a different climate.

I don't know if John's carries this rose, but every nursery should. It's an oldie but goodie!

Maryl, I hope your Leading Lady disappointment was just a product of a baby plant. I've had numerous roses under-perform the first and sometimes second time they bloomed. My LL has been terrific so far; exceptional form and respectable holding power. The only thing to "flop" somewhat have been the stems, which are a little thin, but I'm chaulking that up to an immature plant. As for Glowing Amber, I've seen some beautiful specimens locally. I Tried growing it last year and unfortunately did my best to butcher it, badly chemically burning it TWICE. The tiny stem of a plant that remained was then sat upon by a stray cat just as it was trying valliantly to eek out another fresh stem. It still refused to die but was growing very slowly. I am sure it normally does much much better. I may have made a mistake in giving it away, as I decided to buy it's larger cousin, Ingrid, a mini flora with the same coloring. That rose so far has been OK for me (brilliant and intense coloring) but has had fewer petals and disappointing re-bloom, so far. I'm still giving it at least another year, but it has already lost its prominent placement in my little yard. Maybe I should have kept Glowing Amber?

Kayli-gardener, I looked up Dee Bennett on Helpmefind, and it looks pretty, so thanks for the tip. I don't see it listed at John's, though, unfortunately. Incidentally, I've been comparing the website rose list for 2008 with my printed catalog from 2007, and MANY 2007 offerings are simply MIA from the current list. I wonder why. Need to economize? lack of sales? I was kind of curious about the little orange and yellow striped "Fall Festival," though I don't know how prolific it would be. "Lavender Crystal," "Lavender Jewel," "Miss Pearl," "Autumn Splendor," "Glowing Amber," "Trickster," "Amy Grant," "Ingrid," "Ricky Hendrick,", "Sassy Cindy," "Dancing Flame," "Incognito," and "Snow Ruby," just to name some of the missing.

You know that John Clements(of the John's miniature roses) died very suddenly last year? Originally I think he bought out someone else's mini supply (Tiny Petals?? can't remember) and therefore started to sell more minis. His wife was a big part of the operation at Heirloom, but who knows what the future of the company is without his driving force. There have been rumblings this year that raise my antenna a bit. They missed sending me a catalog even though I bought from them last year. When I called them to request one I asked whether the separate "John's miniatures" would continue and they said no. They always had a few minis in the main catalog, so maybe that is what they will go back to......I'd definitely get another Glowing Amber. You report of it's survival instinct impresses me enough to put it on my wish list for later.....I gave away Leading Lady already. Another rose person who had grown it for a year also didn't care for it, so when my neighbor expressed an interest at trying her hand with minis I gave it to her. I was at a local rose nursery yesterday when I spotted "Chattooga" from across the way and fell in instant love. A hot deep pink mini that was loaded with blooms and despite neglect had perfectly healthy looking foliage. It Wowed me (unlike LL). Look it up in the Nor' East catalog. The picture does not convey it's lovely color. I checked out the old RIR's on it after I got home and it did very well with no real faults (7.8). We will see about that of course. My neighbor actually wanted that one, but no deal.

Soroptimist International. Another one that I have more than one of.

I've got a few kind of newbies that I can't really comment on 'cause I need to find larger pots for them. My "workhorses" are SI, Incognito, Dr. John Dickman (not the right color, but finally coming along), Olympic Gold, Breath of Spring, Ty, Bee's Knees, Erin Alonzo, Jilly Jewel and Leading Lady. Vista is hanging in there, Marie Jeannette is gone (I think, there is a stub of something there).

I know its not on your list but have you thought of Crackling Fire? It is a copper orange which ages to yellowish orange and then to pink. Deep green foliage and the new growth is a lovely burgandy colour.
I love my Flower Power too. An orange/peach blend. Flowers like crazy.

Mike---Tangerine Twist is a GREAT mini. Nice size bush packed full of foliage and long stem blooms. When I downsized my garden it was the last mini I gave away. Now that Olympic Gold has been moved into the mini-flora class I'll be moving her into the mini-flora section of my garden and I'll be getting another Tangerine Twist. That will give me 12 minis again.

Oh, I loved my TT. I lost it after it was crowded out by some HTs, but it was a fine little mini, excellent form and rebloom and bright, bright color.

Mike,

What did you decide on t oreplace Hot Tamale with?

Why Evie! That great photo wouldn't be an effort on your part to campaign for a reprieve for Hot Tamale, would it be? Well, maybe it's working. lol

Actually, I haven't made a decision except that I'm not ordering anything more until this fall. I have decided to put the baby plant I have of Dancing Flame in HT's place once it grows up a little bit, because HT is in a prominent place on my front steps with about 8 other exhibition style minis and mini floras. I am not executing HT. I'll be moving it to another spot. It still produces beautiful blooms. I've just been frustrated by the periodic sudden die-off of whole branches, --makes it hard to have a shapely potted plant.

I'm still considering possible replacements or even additions in that general color range. Dancing flame really isn't the same; more buttery yellow with pink or light red edges. I'm definitely considering Tangerine Twist. Also curious about Best Friends and the new Edisto, even though there's no pink in there. It's the orange element that I don't really have any of in any of my other roses right now. Does anyone have any knowledge of Best Friends? I think it was an award-winning rose that came out just a few years back. Wondering about it's merits--productivity, staying power of the blooms, general health, etc.

i just picked up a mini today called "miss melanie" it is the offspring of hot tamale and kristin. nice flower

I've got two Dancing Flame, opposite sides of the yard, and it didn't really bloom at all right after I planted it. They've been in-ground for over one year now and the blooms range from exhibition to downright plug-ugly. The plant is tall with one already at 3ft and the other well over 2ft. Plenty of DF make it to the show tables so my few uglies can certainly be overlooked.

I gave my Hot Tamale away after growing it for five years. Was a good rose but I've got Rose Window, which looks nearly identical.

Tangerine Twist was also a beauty but prefer Andie MacDowell's coloring so TT went into a raffle, too. I did grow Glowing Amber several years ago and always meant to replace it. My love is Autumn Splendor! Drop-dead gorgeous blooms throughout the year, no pests or disease, fast-growing, good on the show table when I feel like entering something. No, it doesn't go into raffles, lol.

I saw Trickster and Ricky Hendrick on a list earlier in this post and cannot say enough great things about Trickster. Ricky is no slouch but he's right next to Shenandoah, a very similar bloomer on most days.

I second Autumn Splendor! It was one of my favorite new bushes last year, if not the favorite!