I found S. oxyphora easy to self pollinate by hand in my greenhouse, and so I finally turned to trying crosses. So far I haven't had any seed set from those attempts but will keep crossing with whatever else is in bloom. I've got about 2-3 dozen seed from the initial hand (self) pollination I did, and the half dozen seed that I've planted germinated readily.

Correction to that, there are actually ~75 S. oxyphora seed in that baggie. Amazing how they add up. I wish it hybridized as easily.

I found a recent reference on crossing Salvia species but haven't been able to track down the full article yet. Has anyone read it?: Tychonievich J, Warner RM. Interspecific Crossability of Selected Salvia Species and Potential Use for Crop Improvement. J Am Soc Hort Sci. 136: 41-47, 2011.

I have it. Joseph Tychonievich sent me a copy, so I'll forward it to you.

He reported a cross of a Eurasian species with one of the Latin American ones. The hybrid looks mostly like the Eurasian one, with minor differences. It is proprietary, and won't be released.

Most of my oxyphora plants are still blooming. We are having a nice winter for a change. Even my S. lineata and S. stolonifera are forming very robust tubers and stolons on the small plants. It looks like I'll be able to put in some small raised beds next year, using some sand and expanded slate pellets for drainage and protection against voles.

I have several different cuttings inside under lights which I took late summer. One salvia oxyphora that seemed to survive just sat there doing nothing [when the other cuttings were growing] it seemed for the past couple of months but now it has finally sprouted some new leaves, a couple small stems. I was beginning to think it was dead. Im wondering if anyone else have experienced this kind of ,,, what shall I call it partial dormancy with this plant.

Rich, thanks for the article. I haven't had a chance yet to read it in depth but plan to do that this weekend. The degree of variability in chromosome number of different salvias is really fascinating.

My oxyphora cuttings, taken this fall, haven't slowed down, but the parent plant is 'resting'. I had to sow the rest of my seed this week because they were starting to germinate in the plastic baggie. If they germinate at the same rate as the first half dozen I planted I'm going to have quite the oxyphora forest. It'll be interesting to see how much variation there is, since it sounds like most of us are probably growing the same clone.

In case anyone is interested, I've got germination of my oxyphora 12 days after sowing. They've been in the greenhouse with temps ranging from 60-75 degrees and were sown soon after ripening, with the brief stay as noted in the plastic baggie.

Karen, I just read the article re crossing different species of salvias. Unfortunately, it only addresses crosses between a few species. Its main point seems to be that sometimes two Salvias with equal numbers of chromosomes will not produce viable seed. However, others with unequal chromosomes, notably S, transylvanica x S. nemorosa were very successful. I am raising seedlings of S. penstemonoides that I intend to try crossing with several other types and I had hoped to gleam some information that would suggest likely candidates. (I have enough to trade for some S. oxyphora if you are interested.) Rich, do you have any suggestions of which other Salvia would be more likely to produce viable seed when crossed with S. penstemonoides?

S. penstemonoides as well as S. roemeriana , S. lyrata, S. texana, and S. engelmannii are more closely related to Eurasian and S. African sages than they are to other American sages..

Ralph, I still need to get you over here to visit one of these days. I'm going to be swimming in oxyphora seedlings soon, but I've also got a few well rooted cuttings from last fall. You're welcome to either or both, and I'd love to get hold of S. penstemonoides again. I've also got fresh seed from S. squalens (selfed) and am trying to do some crosses with S. univerticillata and S. dorisiana.

Well I have this one cutting that I have nursed thru this winter [the only oxy to prevail] and I started with only two or three leaves and it pretty much remained that way to the point I was thinking it might be dead. I took this cutting in late summer. So after many months it seems finally its starting to grow some. Just recently it even has shot up a new lower stem. I now suspect it move into a better growing mode.

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As I did mention earlier in this thread I was able to collect 4 seeds from oxyphora and I have sown those inside under cover so far no results. Im guessing these will take their sweet time. I noticed that cuttings also grow much more slowly during winter than any other cuttings. It all seems to be a learning experience with these guys. This plant in my garden like everything else gets chopped to the ground then covered with tarp or heavy plastic. I get 100% return with this method "Dons Method".

Don't give up on those seeds. Mine pretty much all germinated and I've got about 75 seedlings at this point. The parent plant and cuttings are all starting to put on new growth now, too.

I've also got germination from my univerticillata-dorisiana cross, which produced seed both ways, although better using univerticillata as the seed parent.

I'll be building a totally screened in nursery table soon, so I can do hand pollination of potted plants during the growing season. I hope to get a lot of crosses done this year.

I hope to repair my old refrigerator and also build a storage case where I will store both pollen and seed.

I'm not too surprised to hear that dorisiana and univerticillata have crossed, If the hybrid is vigorous and takes to good summer growth, it might make a nice introduction as an herb, since the c=scents of both parents are similar. Be sure to select for a nice scent.

My seeds as of yet on oxyphora have not germinated but I did take a cutting from cutting and it rooted beautifully.

Rich-- Is there any chance for you to get any of the Salvia Amistad, hoping.

Everyone is still waiting on that one. There seems to be some sort of snag involving getting it listed as PPAF (plant patent applied for) either here or in Europe. I can't speak for the person who has the rights for this plant. No one in the US has a handle on the situatiion, as far as I know.

Everyone who has seen it wants it distributed.

Patent madness has set in on Amistad. It should become widely available later this season, and may be a Big Box store item.

Can someone tell me if this sage is very slow about returning. So far I have no signs of any foliage around or on the old wood. These were covered for the winter. At least I am glad I took cuttings that I can use.

Beautiful sage! Rich when do you start selling plants? We have similar
weather, and are there any in particular you would recommend? I just
recently received some plants I ordered online. This is what I ordered.
I will take cuttings of the salvia's that are not hardy here.

Salvia 'Peggy'
Purple Majesty
Purple Mexican Sage - This one had flowers when taken out of box. I
love it. Nice color and fuzzy.
Phillis Fancy
Wendy's Wish
Salvia Darcyi
Limelight

Hopefully Salvia Oxyohra, if I can buy one from you Rich.

I have found that this plant loves water and loves feeding. Im wondering how it gets fed in the andes mts of bolivia. Or does it not need to be fed like I feed mine.

hummersteve:

They can be slow coming back. It depends on how big they got, and the number of stolons and subdivisions that were produced underground. These will have active nodes that will produce axillary growth. The survival of these nodes mostly depends on frost penetration, and the robustness of the nodes and their connection to stored food sources like tubers and rhizomes. The slowness of soil temperatures to warm up is also a factor controlling the time of emergence.

When I propagate plants, I like to make sure I have at least one active node under the soil line; when I set them out, I like to plant them a few nodes deeper, again to increase the chances of forming a good underground system.

This sage is too new to make many claims right now, and your experiences and reporting are valuable.

I can say that it has come back for most everyone I've talked to in North Carolina in zone USDA Zone 7, which had a zone 8 winter. It's too early to make reliable hardiness claims colder than Zone 8.

Im sorry to say the ones I had inground did not survive nor the cuttings I took. So I start over.

I have some inground and some in pots. Anyway what I wanted to say was all are forming bulbs from which the flowers will come . Is anyone far enough ahead to have blooms/flowers from oxyphora?

Never assume that this Salvia is winter-hardy. It may come back in a warm area, but if so, will be very late to flower. I take cuttings in late summer, easy to root, and keep these fairly dry and frost-free in winter. By April/May they will take off, and flower from June onwards.....though they are sulking a bit in the current dreadful English summer! So much rain makes the buds abort.

I never assumed they were winter hardy, considering they were in my main garden bed the entire bed gets cut down then covered each winter with tarp, heavy plastic and/or bags of leaves/mulch and most everything returns when before I did this most did not return. Obviously I will once again take cuttings even though mine failed last winter.

With oxyphora, you will need medium-sized plants with some appreciable root stock to winter it over. I have gotten my best results with plants in 3.5 inch pots that have grown a main stem with at least eight nodes and several side shoots. The roots should at least reach all the faces of the pot, but need not cover the faces. In other words, the soil should not fall off the roots when the plant is lifted out the pot.

Oxyphora needs about 3 to 4 weeks of decent growth to get to this stage. When I tried to overwinter just potted rooted cuttings when growth had stopped I lost over 70% of the plants, and the remainder sputtered along.

This is optimal for almost all overwintered plants.

We are about through with a really long 100 degree spell, and some of my plants were blasted, primarily because of lousy timing on watering - some too soon or deeply, with resulting root rot, and some because I got to them too late. My nursery that holds my collection is a mile from my residence.

This season I have noticed good use of my oxyphora by hummingbirds compared to last year which had hardly had any use. This season is several times a day of use which I observe. Last season I didnt see any use untill peak migration and then very slight so Im very happy about that. No matter I had intended to keep growing oxyphora just for its uniqueness for myself at least as long as I can keep them going. They are going thru the torture test this summer along with everything else.

I visited both the JC Raulston Arboretum and Plant Delights this year, and oxyphora is in bloom. It looks to me that blooming was delayed for about a month because of heat. The plants were robust, though.

I'd really like to try this sage next year. It is very cool-looking. I may have a spot open in my garden. The spot gets afternoon and evening sun. It is against the garage and gets quite hot, likely the hottest spot in the entire yard. The sun reflects off the siding and the general area is pretty enclosed as well. The last two years I've had black & blue and schumannii in that spot and both have struggled if not watered daily. Would oxyphora be ok in such a hot location?

After just 2 years of growing this one I am still working out what it wants. Last year's plant was wintered over on my cold porch and planted this spring at the edge of the garden in rather sandy soil. It is now about 5 feet tall and 4 feet wide. Rich isn't the only one who suspected excessive heat may have delayed bloom because mine didn't really hits its stride until into August after the weather broke. My take is that it likes regular watering since other cuttings which didn't get regular water didn't grow particularly well. I am also concluding that you can only expect so much from a cutting in its first year and that two year or older plants are much much better.

Salvia oxyphora was rather late this year, and blooms appeared early August from large plants only. I'm just now seeing flowers on the medium sized ones. That's also true for most other salvias.

A lot of my sages were set back quite a bit by the ten day 100 degree hot spell. There were delayed effects that carried over through late August. For me, this means that I lose both small and stock plants. I'd taken cuttings from Tony Avent's trial garden early August, and most did not root (I don't have a misting system). When I went back mid-September for replacements, I found that some of the same trial plants I had lost in pots had also either died or weakened in Tony's beds during the mostly 90 degree August, which was not that unusual. The new batch of cuttings seemed to root much better.

The horticulture of these new sages needs investigation. Temperature range for optimal growth, watering frequency, soil types (especially humus and drainage), as well as exposure (full microclimate conditions included), and fertility needs are at the top of the list.

Last fall the cuttings rooted at 100%. If the new set roots I will try pinching back the leader a soon as possible and then pinch back the sets of side shoots too as winter progresses. Most of the last year's cutting wouldn't set side shoots in the summer until the first bloom was almost finished - it happened the year before too. Maybe the delayed first bloom will lead to bushier plants by August?

Rich, I have a S. puberula 'El Butano' that has grown to six feet tall and recently finally started blooming. My impression is that its flowers are very similar to those of the S. oxyphora growing at the nearby J C Raulston Arboretum. This similarity led me to wonder whether it might be possible to cross these two?

Ralph, that would be an interesting cross.

Beware, though - we are due for a killing frost Saturday night.

Im not exactly sure when I first took these cuttings maybe late august/sept but they are doing nicely compared to what I tried last season. Salvia Oxyphora

Photo at 12-20-12
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taken 1-21-13
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1-21-13
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Beautiful plants! You must have great light.

This year we are growing the bulk of our oxyphora from our own seed. We now have 2 selected varieties as well, after going through hundreds of seedlings to find ones that are compact, well branched, bloom early and have large floral displays. I'll post pics as soon as I can.

By the way, I have had zero success hybridixing with this species, which is a shame.

KermitC

Thanks- I grow mine under simple shoplights no gro-lights. I place them in front of this large window for photo taking. But later on they will need to be in front of this window as I will need the shoplights for seedlings. Winter light in front of this window is not acceptable for a long periods but for a short stay will be acceptable.

If Salvias bloom at inopportune times, there will be slight chance of success. Seed set will fail if the plant is stressed. I'm looking at a lot of blooms in my greenhouse now, and they all have pollen, but the flowers are falling out quickly and are about half normal size.

If I had a setup to catch and store pollen, I'd be doing that now.

Kermit, early flowering well branched plants are something we need if we're to get most from this species in temperate zones - great work.

Thanks! We hope to have these later in the 2013 season. Even for us, getting a good start outside is critical.

Kermit

In reference to the photos I posted above of the oxyphora of which Im quite proud they are really outgrowing the area under my shoplight even though I switch them around. BTW I dont feel photos do them justice. I will soon be moving them to in front of the slider in which you see them above. Im hoping they dont falter because of the move. Winter light where I live is not the best for growing cuttings but maybe it will suffice for a month or two.

Overwintering rooted oxyphora cuttings depends on their developing a good root structure with not too much soil moisture. Bright, cool sun helps.

My Salvia oxyphora survived this past winter. It is making nice growth from the crown. It was a very easy winter with no snow accumulation, an unusual event for northern Delaware.

My success for over wintering this plant outside has been nil over the past two years, but I did overwinter one in a pot in my garage with mulch this past winter. Also good success with the following cuttings kept inside over the winter.

This ambitious plant has jumped ahead of the others
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This one I call "twin turbos" havent had one split in quite this way before but should create quite a presentation when it starts flowering.

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Kermit C, which species did you try hybridizing with oxyphora? I struck out last year as well but am taking another stab at it now with S. urica and a S. mexicana that's blooming again in the cool spring that we've had. Last time I used oxyphora pollen so this time I'm trying it as the seed parent and I'm seeing some seed developing with the mexicana cross. Now I just need to be sure not to accidentally break that branch off...

Karen, thanks for that tip - I'm going to do some myself, especially after I've constructed a totally enclosed nursery table to keep out pesky carpenter bumblebees and other floral visitors.

We have tried all the "usual suspects" - mexicana, gesneriiflora, karwinskii, chiapensis. No luck.

Keep us posted on any progress. Any mixing of these genes has promise.

When I planted my oxyphora I sprinkled in some osmocote. I also gave it a shot of liquid fertilizer on June 3rd. If this plant is a heavy feeder, how often should I be giving it additional liquid fertilzer?

Sad to report that the seed didn't fully mature. Kermit, did you try your crosses both ways?

hawkeye, I'd feed it if it stops or slows down growing, especially if it still looks robust. There has been a lot of rain, and fertilizer will get leached out.

If the plant looks stressed, that may be a sign of root damage from excess moisture. Fertilizing may not be a good idea if the plant wilts while in wet soil.

Yes, we always do reciprocal crossing.

My one oxyphora did ok this year (my first year growing it). This photo was taken in mid October when it was blooming the best. It liked the cool late-season weather. It bloomed ok during summer, but intense heat caused young buds to die. Growth-wise, the plant grew more slowly and remained smaller than I expected. If I was going to keep it in that same spot, I'd plant two of them together to fill in the space better. However, I think that spot is too hot so the current plan for next year is to plant one oxyphora in a sunny, but less hot, spot about ten feet off the left edge of the photo and a second oxyphora in a shadier spot on the other side of the yard that gets only morning sun. It will be interesting to see which plant performs better. The two new locations are also easily viewable from the house so I'll finally be able to see if hummers here like oxyphora.

The cuttings I took in late September and early October all rooted quickly. I have three of them growing in 4" pots inside. They grow like weeds, especially under the shoplight(two of them are now in the cool window to keep their growth in check). I've already had to cut a couple of them back.

This post was edited by hawkeye_wx on Sat, Nov 9, 13 at 0:00