Wildcat, I think there is a composting forum. There's one for everything else! :) However, I'm composting in a garbage can with holes drilled for drainage. I had an old one with handles that lock on top and I roll it around my SFG (to keep this on topic) a couple of times a week. So far, I'm getting decent results. Everything is breaking down fairly quickly and should be ready before I want to use it (September).

Those composters are for people who have money to burn. A fool & his money are soon parted.

I use wire fence someone threw out. 3ft. high is just about right. Make a circle 3.14 x desired diameter (ex. 3.14 x 4 = 12.56ft) so 12 1/2 ft is close enuff. Just to give an idea how much fence you need. Cut fence using wire cutters just leave tangs on one side to loop around the other side - holding it together.

Fill with composting materials as usual. If you have rodents come by cut a piece of fence to cover the top, too. I also put raspberry canes around it & on top. One thing rodents aren't into it's pain. Works in the SFG to keep squirrel damage to a minimum too.

Another advantage of the fence is air circulation. Can't get much better. I build the pile then leave til next year. If you don't have more fence - just remove this one to start your next pile.

I had pics on here somewhere of my compost pile, last yr I think. Oh maybe at the soil forum. You'll get all kinds of ideas there but for my money - the wire fence is tops - even if you have to buy the fence.

Gumby_CT who thinks "If you need compost in 2 weeks - go to the store."

Here is a link that might be useful: Soil, Compost and Mulch

I built a three sided box out of used pallets and it's 5x5x3. I have it mostly full and it keeps dropping by a half in height every week. I can't wait to need more compost after paying $30 for 5 bags last week. Grrr. Check out my blog for some pics of my bin.

It would be "cool" to have a fancy one, but who needs to spend $100s to get one.

Here is a link that might be useful: Sinfonian's garden adventure

I have four of them so I guess that makes me a fool. Actually, I purchased two of them and later the company sent me two more because of a design flaw in the originals. I never saw anything wrong with the originals so continued to use them.

When I lived in Moab the bins were a godsend to deal with all of the leaves from the ancient cottonwood trees in my yard and along the creek that flowed behind the house. I used a leaf chipper on the leaves and added garden and kitchen waste to the leaves in the bins. I paid close attention to keeping the composting material moist and had wonderful compost coming from each bin about every 6-8 weeks. Moab is very hot and sunny so the bins heated up well every day.

Now that I'm in Colorado living at 7800 feet my success with quick composting in the bins is significantly less. Even though the bins received a significant amount of sun they don't seem to heat up as well as they did in Moab. Also, I don't have the massive quantities of shredded leaves to use as a base for the compost. The bins are farther away from the house than in Moab so they don't get the attention they did there. Still, I get nice compost at least once a year from three of the four bins.

The fourth bin was torn from its rotating base by a very hungry bear who caused havoc all across the mesa last summer. He never managed to get the bin open and it has been laying on its side like a wounded soldier since. One of these days I'll get up the strength and courage to open that bin and see what waits inside.

Gail

Thanks for the post. I live in a "new-urban" development and the neighbors would not like compost bins nor would my wife. These seem like a reasonable alternative. Yes they are expensive and I guess I could be called a fool, but I have been called worse.

Thanks again.

I use a garbage can that dh drilled lots of 1/4" holes in for air circulation. I use a bungy cord to keep the lid on. I roll it around on it's side about once a week to turn it. I add to it every couple of days from kitchen and garden waste. It was mostly leaves to start though. It is half the size of originally and that was a month ago. It seems to be breaking down quickly.

I just saw some plastic black pallets behind my grocery store, I am going to snag some... if they work, they would be sweet....

I purchased an Envirocycler Compost Tumbler last year through the website link below. I've been very happy with it. I got my first finished compost after about eight weeks. Although I quickly learned that it would be beneficial to have more than one to continue to have one to place my kitchen waste in once the other was full. We have problems with raccoons, so just creating an open pile was not an option for me. Not wanting to spend more $$$ on another one I bought a 32 gallon Rubbermaid trash can and just drilled holes in it as some of the others here have done. It seems to be working better than my tumbler. I've only had it for about a month and the contents have already reduced in size by half.

Here is a link that might be useful: Dirt Works

Notice I said Cool not fool. I see nothing wrong with them. If I had the money I'd love one or more. Do whatever works for you.

Wilkili: I too have raccoon problems and they haven't touched my bin (I don't compost animal products). I also had a stinky bin ONCE. Even my eldest asked me to make the smell go away or move the compost. Hehe some quick research and I added some shredded paper and aerated it and presto, no more smell (I wasn't sure how to characterize the smell so I tried both solutions).

MoabGail: As for not heating up, are you hot composting or cold composting? The proper amounts of "green" and "brown" material (roughly 50/50) will heat up to 140 to 160 degrees within 24 hours at 50 degrees in the shade and it will stay that temp until it's done with the middle of the pile. I use a food digital thermometer to test the temp every few days. When it drops below 140 I turn and fluff it. Hope that helps someone.

Here is a link that might be useful: Sinfonian's garden adventure

And that is the wonderful thing about gardening - you can do whatever you want and spend as much as you want. After all, it IS your garden.

Gumby is forever aware of the "Cost of Gardening" or COG and thinks for what you will spend for some of those tumblers you can buy several years worth of veggies $200, $300, or $400 yikes?

If you are living in a condo maybe buying veggies at the farmers market is a wiser choice or even trying out a community garden plot.

Good Luck with whatever you choose,
Gumby_CT

I am not into gardening to save money. I love playing in the dirt and seeing how much I can grow in my 4X15 space. I am also more and more conscious of the quality of food in my home. Why do people spend 1000's on golf clubs but think it is silly to spend a couple hundred on their gardening hobby. You can't eat a golf ball! I appreciate the advise, especially those about the garbage containers and the commercial composters. I can do without the advise on how to spend my money. The govenment is trying to do that to me.

Gumby will tell you the truth until it hurts.
Some can't stand the pain.

I bought a Tumbleweed last year, but got it assembled only a couple months back :-) So far, I am very unimpressed with it, thought it could be because I did not get the mix of brown to green right. Thinking of building a wire-fence one or the one made of pallets.

Wildcat, I darn sure sympathize with you about wanting to grow the most food in the least space...and I hope you didn't think I was giving you a hard time about how you spend your money. That wasn't my intention at all! :)

You really made me think with your response about comparing gardening to golfing. At least with gardening, you get something back besides chasing a little white ball all day. Before the golfers beat me up, I play too!

I found some great PLASTIC pallets behind my grocery store, as I said...

today I went and got em... they are for beer... so really heavy duty, they have one flat side, and one side has "feet" of plastic, like as thick as a regular pallet... I plan to sawzall off the feet for the ones I am using as uprights, and just have flat plastic... when it is done, I will post....

I for one don't play golf but did spend close to $2k on my garden so far. I'd do it again on a heartbeat. It's brought my family so much enjoyment and a relief of stress, even if the pest win and I don't harvest anything more.

Not all the opinions here were advising you how to spend your money. I just go for the best, least expensive option myself. Thus my pallets. My brother went a tumbler and loves it. I'm jealous. Hehe

Here is a link that might be useful: Ft2Garden.com

so in short a newbie post a question in the wrong forum doesnt mention any restrictions or that he only wants to know the postive things so when someone tries to help by giving him info he hasnt considered he throws a hissy fit &thinks people are telling him what to do
me thinks its strange among other things
be cool get two that'll show him

Sorry I caused such a ruckus darkcloud! But if you will read my original post: 1. I asked specifically about purchased composters 2. I asked specifically about the rotating kind 3. I was looking for both positive and negative feedback on reliability and how quickly they get the job done 4. I have been square foot gardining since 1991 (but I didn't know it was square foot gardening then). I am new to this forum, sorry to bust in.

try the search button
gumby was the only one who took the time to show you the right place where you could read the 10000's of post giving you all your answers to your specific questions many times over & over

Here is a link that might be useful: search here

wildcat123 wrote: Thanks for the post. I live in a "new-urban" development and the neighbors would not like compost bins nor would my wife. These seem like a reasonable alternative. Yes they are expensive and I guess I could be called a fool, but I have been called worse.

----------------------------------------------
I'm actually about to strike out on my own and start a little sideline business of helping people get started on composting and creating rainbarrels for their homes, seems to be the hip thing to do these days and after you get into it you'd be amazed how much of what you're currently putting into a landfill can be used in your composter instead.

Now for some specifics...

First I'd like to say that urban or rural isn't a consideration for the type of composter you have. My house is on a 0.15 acre (6536 sq. ft.) lot and I have two compost piles going at all times and the neighbors neither think it's unsightly or smelly - although the later can happen if you don't understand what and when to add to your compost pile. Think Sinfonian ran into that issue once when he dumped nearly a cubic yard's worth of fresh-cut grass into his pile with no carbon sources to balance it out.

----
OK. Most prefab composters that you'd by from the store are marginally effective at best. There are some larger composters that you can order online for a hefty premium that do meet the minimum criteria for aerobic decomposition to take place but they also have their short-comings and people typically give them a bad rep because of it...aside from user-error, the most common being that they fall apart within a couple years.

When you're looking for one, try to find one that can hold at least 1/4 of a cubic yard's worth of material. That's roughly 55-gallons or 6 cubic feet worth of material. Try to shy away from units that have a lot of metal parts because they will rust out within a few years of being exposed to the elements and whatnot. Also, look for something that is going to allow the compost pile to drain freely or you'll end up with an smelly, anaerobic mess on your hands.

----
Aerobic composting has three basic requirements; Oxygen, Moisture and Mass.

- Oxygen is required for the thermophilic bacteria that do the work to survive. In bin based systems this is accomplished by fluffing or flipping the pile, in rotary drum style systems - assuming it has lots and lots of breathing holes and is not overfilled - this is done simply by rolling the drum around for a bit.

- Moisture is supplied primarily through the moisture content of the materials you put into the compost but also through supplemental watering if it gets too dry. In layman's terms you're looking for a dampness consistent with that of a wrung out sponge. The technical term for this level of moisture is called "field capacity" and literally means that the materials should be dry enough that if you were to grab a handful of it no water would be dripping out of your hand and if you were to squeeze it lightly a drop or two might come out but if you were to squeeze it tightly you should see a small "rivulet" (technical term again, heh) of water stream down the side of your hand for a second or two and then stop. I think a "wrung out sponge" is much more understandable for most people...

- Mass is the part where most prefab composters fail. I see several models at home depot, lowes and various other "big box store" and I wonder how they could sell them as composters. They're too small. Ideally composting works best under the weight and pressure provided when you have a cubic yard's worth of material. At a minimum it can still take place with only 1/4 of that mass but it will go much more slowly and get as hot. What actually goes into the compost in terms of "greens" and "browns" and at what ratios is out of scope for this question, although I'm already as off topic as I could get at this point, lol...

side note - Aerobic decomposition is primarily accomplished by thermophilic (high heat loving/generating) bacteria. These bacteria produce temperatures between 140-160(F) when they are most active and have the right types and amounts of food, oxygen and moisture to work on. Coincidentally, pasteurization takes place within the same temperature range so a well managed and maintained compost pile is self-pasteurizing.

----------------
Lastly, when I mentioned that most pre-fab composters fail from user-error, here's what I meant...

Compost needs to "finish" to be complete. You can't just keep throwing new stuff into your pile for months and months and get finished compost. There needs to be a point in which you stop adding new materials and only keep adding more oxygen and more moisture. However in most pre-fab systems they make no mention of this fact and people just keep loading them up - and typically not with balanced greens and browns - until they're completely full and then wonder why they never actually get compost, only decayed remains of what they've tossed in there. Then they lose interest and the thing just sits there until it rusts away.

If you're going to buy a rotary drum based composter you have to realize that once it reaches about 2/3rds full you're going to need to stop adding new materials until that "batch" is done and pull it all out and put it somewhere while you start a new batch. It'll still need to be rotated daily (for quickest processing) once it's full, but in the mean time you're piling up new materials waiting for the next batch.

Also, watch where you put that thing. The leachate that comes out of a compost bin will smell horrific and will stain almost any surface if allowed to pool/gather on patios or concrete. Leachate IS NOT compost tea, so don't attempt to save it as such either. Technically it's the anaerobic slop of excess moisture that is draining out of the bin. OK for incorporation into ground soil, not ok to put directly onto plants.

---
I might have forgotten a couple key points here and there but I think I got the basics down to help you make a more informed purchasing decision if you're going to continue down the pre-fab route.

Oh, and don't buy any "accelerator or starter" formulas. You can get the same net results by stealing two or three shovels full of dirt from any of the garden beds in your yard. :rolls eyes: Once you've finished a batch, just throwing a couple shovel fulls of the finished stuff in with the new batch also accomplishes the same process. In ground based bin systems you technically don't even need to do that, the right microbes will work their way up from the soil itself. :shrug:

Very helpful Arjo. I used to have compost bins prior to moving. I can no longer do this because of restrictions (wife not neighborhood). I think you convinced me that I should by my organic material and not buy a composter. I have learned more from you in 5 minutes than I have over years of reading. Thanks again.

wildcat123 said: ...because of restrictions (wife not neighborhood)....
I think you convinced me that I should by my organic material and not buy a composter.
roflmao the truth will set you free
now you know why he picks on people on the internet

i think i remember reading those words somehwere before
funny how life will bring you full circle

guess he wasn't so far off the mark after all
Gumby_CT who thinks "If you need compost in 2 weeks - go to the store."
--you can do whatever you want and spend as much as you want. After all, it IS your garden.

lol....somebody help me off the floor

Erin:

That video is great...You wonder how people have time to come up with this stuff. Thanks for your comments.

Just a little follow-up on my previous post of June 17th. After emptying beautiful compost from another bin, I got brave enough to check out the bin that had been torn from it's base by the bear last fall.

I hadn't done anything with it because I was expecting it to be too heavy for me to move into an upright position. Much to my surprise it was as light as a feather and I was, at that point, very confused.

When I opened the bin I found very nice almost finished compost that had dried out due to the finally warm weather here and my neglect. The contents of that bin had composted even though the bin had been left laying on it's side all winter without being rotated even once.

In contacting the company I purchased the bins from for replacement parts for the bear beaten bin, I saw that each bin will hold 9.5 cubic feet of material; more than enough to get good composting action.

As I was spreading the black gold on my raised beds, I was left thinking the folks who show such disdain for these compost bins probably have never used them.

I am more than happy with mine.

Gail

Living proof & Perfect example that compost will just happen - you don't have to turn anything or pay anyone. Mother Nature has done this each year since the beginning of time.

Makes me wonder if the people that buy these high priced composters haven't quite grasped the fact that Mother Nature does this FREE, NO turning, NO money down. FREE just add water. What could be easier?

You can mess it up if you don't do it right but how hard is piling some leaves or grass clippings - Compost Just Happens.

So what's the problem then? We have become an instant gratification society - wanting satisfaction immediately and not wanting to wait for next year to use my compost. Too bad.

But what is worse are the people who want to paint you as the bad guy for explaining this to them. It seems they were much happier before they found out they have been ripped off.

Just like the fruitcake theory - I have a theory that there is only one compost tumbler which keeps getting passed around, ha!

Happy Composting