The only source I know of is from PA and goes by Camo on several of the forums. He has sent me seeds to try this year. The Pink Brandywine PL strains don't seem to do well here so waiting to see how these do. Brandywine Glick's from Amishland seeds has been the best producer so far. Know Camo sent out a lot of seeds for the Cowlick's this last summer and fall so there should be seeds available after this season. JD

Thanks - I had no idea they were so limited in availability. Assuming the Cowlicks aren't available this year, which Brandywine that's more available would you suggest?

Thanks - I had no idea they were so limited in availability. Assuming the Cowlicks aren't available this year, which Brandywine that's more available would you suggest?

*****

I know JD will answer as well, but Brandywine ( Sudduth) is the one I think most folks grow and it's widely available at Sandhill, TGS and more.

Camo named his Brandywine Cowlick b'c it did especially well for him in PA and I don't know which Brandywine he was growing that he named Cowlick.

I can say that there are a few different Brandywines listed in the SSE YEarbooks, there used to be more years ago, and there are those who have grown many of them out in the same season and find very little difference, whether it be Glicks or Pawers ( which was a typo that's been perpetuated and not even a strain/version), Joyce's, and there used to be several more listed but they've disappeared over time.

I had grown many of them myself and saw nothing special about any of them until I was sent Brandywine (Sudduth/Quisenberry) which many have found to be good relative to smoothness and taste, and was the one passed on by Doris Sudduth Hill to Ben Quisenberry, now deceased, who made it widely available.

I know that many folks think that Brandywine is nirvana when it comes to taste, but I've grown one heck of a lot of varieties and I find there are others that have what I call a unique taste, so I'm not one who says that Brandywine is the most unique greatest tasting variety out there.

Since the performance of any variety can change from season to season, based on just weather conditions alone, if it were me I'd start with the Sudduth strain, which really is a strain, as opposed to those such as GLick's or Joyce's, or Pawers, or whatever, which just have a person's name attached to them and there's no way of knowing what they really are in terms of being related to any other generic Brandywine. And for sure some just called Brandywine could well be the Sudduth strain as well.

If a seed source lists just Brandywine, that's fine, but it means they don't know if it's the Sudduth one, which is the most prevalent one of the strain/versions out there.

A strain of a variety means that there are subtle changes in a variety yet it can be IDed as being the orif=gianl variety. And there are very few varieties that have strains. A variety that just has a person's name attached to it, as do several of the Mortgage Lifter ones for instance, are not all that different based on same season growouts for that one. I think Mortgage Lifter ( Estler) is the best of the lot re taste and performance, but of course opinions will vary.

And vary they do for almost anytthing grown by any of us b'c taste is individual and perceptual and no two persons grow their tomatoes the same, and weather is never the same from summer to summer either.

Just my opinion.

Carolyn

Queuetue,
i just stumbled onto this thread. I'm the one responsible for naming "Cowlick's Brandywine". I bought it as a plant from a local Nursury, a few years back. It was labeled simply Brandywine or Pink Brandywine. I had others from maybe a half dozen nursuries that year. This one outperformed them all. It produced more tomatoes, ripened earlier, produced much longer, tasted much better, and on a whole they were larger and prettier.
I kept the seeds separate and assumed it must have been the legendary Sudduth's strain! I also ordered seeds for every type of brandywine I could find from many different sources. Even though it was late in the year I planted one or two of each and grew them out. They all produced except the Yellow Brandywine and the Brandywine OTV. None of them were anything like the Cowlick's.
Meanwhile as the next season began, I was able to get in touch with the owner of the nursury from which I had purchased the "WONDERFUL PLANT" He had no idea what strain it was. He had bought seed from a local company and grew about a dozen of three different varieties. I just kept the name of his nursury so I could tell the difference.
The following year I went on a Brandywine crusade. I bought every imaginable type of Brandywine from every imaginable source. I grew them all. Sudduths Strain, Glicks, Stumps, Pink Brandywines, Black Brandywines, Purple Brandywines, Yellow Brandywines, Plattsfoot strain, OTV, Nothing compared.
Again it was the first to produce ripe tomatoes, they were larger, tastier, and produced longer and much more than any other Brandywine. I had twenty plants of Cowlicks out this year, so I had enough seed to send them all over the U.S. and to Canada and even to the Phillipines and Europe. I even sent some members of other tomato forums enough for them to do their entire gardening clubs. I gave bags full to local nursuries. After this season, they should be available just about everywhere if others have anywhere near the success I've had with them.
I have very few left now as I gave away almost all I had from a couple years, I still have some but I also have a few more SASE 's coming yet. I'd say to PM at a different forum, but I've already gotten grief on here for doing that in the past. So if you can figure out a way to to PM me elsewhere, please do!
Camo

I'd say to PM at a different forum, but I've already gotten grief on here for doing that in the past. So if you can figure out a way to to PM me elsewhere, please do!

*****

Camo, I knew you'd come along eventually and explain the origin of Cowlick.

And it's not just grief that one gets here if they mention another nessage site, it can lead to being banned.

It's the only message site where I read/sometimes post where that is true.

If you try to send a message via the GW message system and mention another place the software catches it and it won't send.

That's been true since I started posting here about 10 years ago when Spike owned GW and there were some hard feelings between this site and another one.

When ivillage bought it they just kept the same policies and guidelines in place.

I'd like to see open and respectful communication be allowed between all sites b/c what I think is important is the fact that we're all gardeners and being in this Tomato Forum, all interested in tomato information.

But that's a wish and a hope.

Carolyn

Okay, let me see if I understand this straight.

In 2006, I grew some Brandywine from seed purchased at a local farm supply store. The seed was packaged by Livingston Seed Company, Columbus, Ohio. The package simply called it Brandywine. The vines were potato leaf. The fruit were pink and plentiful.

Everyone says Brandywine is stingy. These plants produced between 30 - 36 large, fine tasting tomatoes in the month of August. They were heavily loaded with fruit.

I also grew Earl's Faux the same year and in the same bed. The Brandywine slightly outperformed the Earl's Faux. Not by much but still more tomatoes per vine.

Now, if I continue to grow out this "strain" of Brandywine, and it continues to perform well each year, can I simply name it whatever I wish??? Is that the standard protocol? Just wondering.

Also wondering if everyone who runs across a particularly prolific "strain" of Brandywine regardless of the seed source and then names it serendipitously whatever they wish, and then distributes the seeds with the new name attached, hmmmm. SSE Yearbook already is fairly thick.

Oh, and what about other varieties of tomato. Say I find a Delicious that actually is. Or ...

Well, just wondering. And since the principle grower/namer is here, maybe he can give me some guidance in this regard.

Carolyn,
I thought I had posted the origin on here last year or the year before. I know its been posted numerous times on the other forums.
I didn't mention any names, about who or where the "Grief" or perhaps I should have said warning came from, as I don't like to cause problems or hard feelings with others. I'm simply trying to help those that are interested in growing tasty tomatoes, and I owe no alligence to any particular forum, nor do I engage in the politics that's associated with some.
I could just as easily disappear and not spend the time pecking away at the keyboard, but then lots of people wouldn't have recieved all those different tomato seeds either. I don't have an ego to feed, I just enjoy eating tasty tomatoes and sharing the information and seeds with others.
I have no ax to grind, so to speak, and I admit that I don't spend as much time on this forum or some of the others as I do on the one where I'm more comfortable, and do most of my posting.
I try to be as honest as possible, in relating the background and details, as best as I can recall. And I seek no compensation for sharing with others. Initally, I didn't even ask for SASE's and ate the cost of sending seeds and buying envelopes and little plastic bags and labels for them. I didn't limit sending seeds of just one variety either. I would send bags of 10-20 or more different varieties in one mailing, so others could compare similar types of tomatoes and sometimes, something totally different too!
I also don't want you to feel that this is directed at you, but it's a forum to allow me to state why I've sent so many seeds to so many people the past few years.
Cowlick's stood out from all the other Brandywines in taste, production, and even appearences. That first plant produced well over 100 lbs of tasty, pink, thin skinned tomatoes with virtually no core, very meaty and delicious. None of the other Brandywines at that time or since then have come close in production, and very few in taste. Sudduths strain and Glick's are closest in taste, not quite as good, but close. And in production there has been no comparasion in any of the pinks, Red Brandywine has produced better but still not the numbers or the size that Cowlick's put out! It's also a regular leafed plant.
I offered seed to you in the past, but you didn't seem interested enough to send me your address, so I didn't push. Afterall there were many others that wanted seed from them as word spread about them. Although I would have looked forward to having an expert's opinon as to what they really are. To me they have simply become Cowlick's Brandywine, Maybe I should drop the Brandywine from the description altogether and just call them by the nursury name. Whatever they are, they are the best tomatoes I've grown for a number of years now. I can only hope they do as well for others that I've sent them to. If so, they should become a household name within the year. If not, there's going to be an awful lot of disappointed people out there as I told everyone, how great they were here!
Sorry for rambling on so.
Respectfully,
Camo

Pennyrile,
I guess I'm the culprit to whom your refering. I named this particular tomato Cowlick's (the nursury where I bought it) just to differentiate from others. At that time I also had Dana's Brandywine, Ashcombe's Brandywine, Country Market Brandywine, etc. I keep very accurite records of what plants come from where etc, etc.
Well, right from the start, the Cowlick plant grew taller, was greener, fruits ripened much earlier, they tasted better, they looked better, were larger, smoother. entirely different. It became the plant I went to for a tomato to eat. It reached a point where it was the the only tomato I wanted to eat that first season. It produced months after the others died off, right up to the last day of October when I finally pulled it so I could till, and even then it was full of tomatoes.
The next season those Cowlick seeds produced earlier, and lasted longer, again I compared them to every Brandywine I could find. No comparison! Like I had stated previously, Sudduths and Glicks were the closest in taste, but didn't even come close in production. Cowlicks ripened earlier, lasted longer and was producing well after the others were done!
On top of that, if you cut similar sized tomates at the equater, between Cowlicks and the other two, they were completely different looking tomatoes on the inside. The Cowlicks were meatier, different looking gel pockets different sized seeds. etc.
Did that give me the right to rename it Cowlick's Brandywine, perhaps not, but I had to diferentiate it somehow and that was the method I chose! It truly was a "WONDERFUL TOMATO" and it became the most requested of the hundreds of tomato plants I grew last year. Everytime it comes up I get more requests for it because it sounds so great, which it is, at least here in south central Pa.
Let me also state here now, that for all purposes, I have no more seed to give away this year! This past season I had 20 Cowlick's out of the 256 tmato plants that I grew. So I had lots of seed to give out. This coming season I'm cutting back tremendously on the amount of tomatoes I'm planting. I don't want to have anymore than 114-115. Therefore the number of Cowlick's are decreasing also. So next year I will not have the amount of seed I had this year and last year!!! I'm only going to plant 3-5 Cowlick's this coming season. I want to be able to try a lot of "new to me" varieties that many have sent me in appreaciation of recieving Cowlicks.
Camo

Carolyn,
I thought I had posted the origin on here last year or the year before. I know its been posted numerous times on the other forums.
I didn't mention any names, about who or where the "Grief" or perhaps I should have said warning came from, as I don't like to cause problems or hard feelings with others. I'm simply trying to help those that are interested in growing tasty tomatoes, and I owe no alligence to any particular forum, nor do I engage in the politics that's associated with some.

*****

Camo, all I said in my above post was that I didn't know what Brandywine you were growing that you named Cowlick and then I said down below in a following post that I knew you'd come by eventually and I said that b'c you have been posting here.

Camo, I know you don't engage in politics or anything like that so I'm not sure why you brought that up at all.

And the only reason I spoke to your comment about getting grief here at GW was to indicate , using other words, that I know several people who have been banned from here b'c they did specifically mention another message site and I didn't want that to happen to you or others.

If you did discuss the Brandywine you were using that you named Cowlick before I didn't see it. And it's better that you mention the origin anyway, as I see it.

I read/post at five different sites and have no allegience to any one but I find that the folks at different sites are, well different, in terms of backgrounds, enthusiasm, politeness, tomato knowledge, etc., and that's what I find so interesting. And I tend to post more at a couple of sites than I do at others primarily b'c some sites have more traffic and thus more threads to look at.

As for Brandywine, well, I think the naming is a big problem and very confusing and always has been. I was at a commercial site this AM where they were offering Red Brandywine PL and of course it's not Red Brandywine at all and is probably one of the two RB's at TGS that are not RB.

But I do think that your responses were best directed to pennyrile about the Cowlick Brandywine where he had asked some larger general questions about naming of varieties.

Carolyn, and yes, you did offer me seeds and no I didn't take you up on it b'c these days, being in a walker I can't grow tomatoes myself and have Freda , who does my gardening for me, tend to only about 30 plants and I concentrate on growing varieties new to all or most and was pretty sure that I had all the slots filled for this summer. I'm so far behind in even growing for fresh stock of some varieties and I hadn't intended on growing any Brandywine this summer anyway. ( smile)

Carolyn,
I apoligize if I came on a little strong, it's not my usual demeaner. I had read both your post and pennyrile before starting to answer yours, and I guess my emotions were, shall we say, stimulated! I read that post over twice before submitting it as I was afraid I might have been a little harsh, then read it to mrs Camo, (without all the background) and she said it didn't sound nasty.
So if I came across wrong, I do apoligize once more. sometimes my blood sugars tweak my emotions more than they should and I get a little emotional. And once I get rolling, I'm like a freighttrain, a little hard to get stopped.
Respectfully.
Camo

Camo:

In your 12:26, Feb. 10 reply to Carolyn, you mention that your "Cowlick's" is regular leaf vine. Interesting, and the first time I've seen that particular piece of info mentioned.

Have you considered that Cowlick's may have been a hybrid (accidental or otherwise) when you acquired it? Did any potato leaf vines appear in subsequent generations of saved seed? If not, have you considered that it may be something other than Brandywine altogether? Since your replies all imply that Cowlick's has many attributes differenciating it from Brandywine, I wonder, and without criticism, why you would even call it a Brandywine other than it came with that name tag from a commercial nursery.

In 2007, I acquired a "Brandywine" from Hirt's Nursery by mail. The reason I ordered it is that in the picture online, the tomato fruit looked identical to the picture Ken Ettlinger publishes of Sudduth at his Long Island Seed Project website in his article about Ben Quisenberry's gift of original Sudduth seeds back around 1980 or 1978, whenever it was.

Anyway, those plants from Hirt's Nursery produced many beautiful deep dark pink delicious beefsteak tomatoes also ON A REGULAR LEAF vine. So, I knew it wasn't Brandywine either the Sudduth derivative or the Landis type.

So, like you, I carefully noted on the package containing saved seeds where I got the original plants and what they were sold as; hence, "Hirt's Brandywine." BUT, I have to tell you, Camo, I have never or would never distribute them with that moniker, and surely not let them get into the SSE Yearbook with the Brandywine name appended.

Sorry if my original message was phrased a bit sarcastically. However, my point remains the same.

Pennyrile,
If you go back and read that posting again you will see that I'm refering to the Red Brandywine being regular leafed not the Cowlick's.
I also have nothing to do with SSE or their yearbook!

Camo,

Just a friendly and non-critical observation regarding English is that when you write something like "It's regular leaf too," the "it" at the beginning of the sentence (and subject of the sentence) is a pronoun referring back to the closest antecedent which, in the case of your response to Carolyn about which we are speaking, is "Cowlick's."

And when writing in huge long paragraphs with minimal spacing between them, the reader can use all the help he, or at least a semi-ADD guy like me, can get in keeping up with which whatever is what. Okay?

So, once again. Sorry for any misunderstanding. And why you're getting all exclamation point worked up over this is a little baffling, to me at least.

Whether you have anything to do with SSE or its yearbook is of little consequence when nearly every dadburned tomato that gains any notariety at all in all these garden boards seems to end up in the Yearbook under a plague of misspelled or otherwise altered misrepresentations of factual background. And that especially seems to be the case with anything "Brandywine."

Camo,

Is Cowlick's Brandywine potato leaf or regular leaf?

John

Cowlick's stood out from all the other Brandywines in taste, production, and even appearences. That first plant produced well over 100 lbs of tasty, pink, thin skinned
tomatoes with virtually no core, very meaty and delicious. None of the other Brandywines at that time or since then have come close in production, and very few in taste. Sudduths strain and Glick's are closest in taste, not quite as good, but close. And in production there has been no comparasion in any of the pinks, Red Brandywine has produced better but still not the numbers or the size that Cowlick's put out! It's also a regular leafed plant.

****

John, I think Camo already answered your question per what I cut and pasted above where he distinguihed the RL Red Brandywine from all the other PL Brandywines he mentioned in several posts that are known to be PL Brandywine versions/strains.

So Cowlicks is PL

Carolyn

Thanks Carolyn,

I was unsure after reading the thread.

I plan to grow Cowlick's Brandywine and want to know the proper characteristics.

John

Just checked back on this thread. If you haven't found any Cowlick's pm me and I'll send you a few to try. Like stated above my seeds came from Camo. Won't be many but enough you can get a few plants and save your own if you like them. This is not a general offer to everyone. Jay

Camochef,Can i get 3-6 cowlick brandywine seeds from you?
2320 Richards Lane
Springfield,Illinois 62702

Penny
I don't think you should be knocking Camo's efforts to share seeds especially considering he has been so forthright with the information about the plant. He even specifically said "Maybe I should drop the Brandywine from the description altogether and just call them by the nursury name" which to me clearly indicates that he is not trying to pass it off as another Brandywine. Distributing seeds is not a bad thing, if you are honest about what the seeds are. And it's not like he was trying to get personal gain from it. Furthermore, if someone else decides to list it in SSE yearbook (without providing all the background), than that's not really his fault, is it. Just MHO.

Sounds to me like Camo got a "Pruden's Purple"

Personally I think all tomatoes should just be named '___________ Brandywine' or 'Brandywine ___________' from here on out.

It would be far less confusing.

Here is a link that might be useful: Thats gonna cause some confusion

Camo, I have grown every variety of brandywine as have you and found suddiths to be the best. I have never heard of cowlicks, but if is better than suddiths it must be truly amazing. I have won taste tests with cherokee purple and sungold with the judges not picking suddiths?? I would really appreciate 3 seeds if you could spare them? I can send you some of my seeds but most of them are from tg.
Pete Linko
5990 st. rt. 128
Cleves OH 45002

Camo,

I too have grown the various Brandywine varieties over the years, and only now have heard of the cowlick. If you could spare a few seeds, it would be greatly appreciated. I would also be more than glad to pay you.
Gerry Cooper
4636 Anderson Mtn Road
Maiden, NC 28650