I just want to dig a hole and put a handful of cow manure in it. With this allow a decent yield. I have never grown like this before. I have read that cow manure has a rough npk of .5-.5-.5...is this right? I will be planting in a new area. No till style. Can I just dig a hole and put some compost in it? Will this produce a healthy crop? I mean will it take my tomato plant through season and survive inevitable blights?

The simple answer - no way. There are so many things wrong with this approach I'm not even sure where to begin. Sorry.

Dave

Please elaborate. I read that cow manure has beneficial bacteria that prevents e coli etc or something.

A guy that gave me beautiful giant tomatoes wrote that he only grows with a shovel full of cow compost. Is this impossible?

Have you used Bat Guano? I am thinking about using fruit eating bat guano. HELP.

This might work if the soil into which you are planting has been previously amended and worked so that it already has good tilth, reasonably good fertility, good drainage, etc. But to just dig a hole in native soil and add a shovelfull of manure is highly unlikely to produce the results you want.

That being said, I use alot of cow and horse manure in my garden. It is an excellent soil conditioner and adds some fertility. But I also add Blood Meal since my soil is very low in nitrogen.

The only way to know what your soil needs in the way of nutrients is to have it tested. Without a test you can do more harm than good.

Thanks for the replies. Normally I just barely dig a hole and put in 1/2 a cup of tomato tone and tbsp of lime and I have a good crop of tomatoes. I don't till b/c I don't want to do anything I don't have to...the reason about the whole cow manure question is b/c I am a vegetarian. I didn't know that tomato tone had bone meal and feather meal in it. I didn't even know that gardeners used bone meal and blood meal for gardening until a few months ago. I have always heard of using cow turd and horse turd. Dirt is dirt. But this whole bone meal thing is new to me. I am a new gardener.

It has been a sad and weary search trying to find the right vegetarian fertilizer for my soil. I guess just straw and leaves and some kind of manure compost.

To Chuggerguy in Florida:

I suck at growing tomato plants in containers...I can't imagine what kind of hell your in...:(((

I will send you dirt.:))))

Only one way to find out. Never underestimate the power of experimentation. Just be ready for the results. I started many seed this year from compost laying on top of a fallen ash tree(very old). Laying on the ground,split in half.

Take care,
Travis

IF you want to see someone grow tomatoes in cowmanure only go to the blackcow website and watch the video. They take a bag of cowmanure put holes in the bottom for drainage and turn it over and cut 2 4" holes in it , one for each plant . Then they ad a tablespoom of ebsom salts add two cages... Yes it can be done.

I read that cow manure has beneficial bacteria that prevents e coli ...

Uncomposted cow manure is a source of e coli, so I doubt that. Composted manure sold in stores is very low in nutrients. It can be a good soil conditioner in your garden, but I wouldn't count on it to feed my tomatoes for a full season. There are many organic fertilizers that don't contain animal products, like cottonseed meal for nitrogen, rock phosphate for phosphorous and greensand for potassium.

I would just try it. I have read many places that you should not grow in 100% compost so last year I planted several extra tomato plants in compost. There was no discernible difference between those plants and the ones in my garden.

I just want to add something that should hopefully help this discussion along:

1.) Manure = Fertilizer
2.) Compost = Soil conditioner

If you till in dried or aged manure into your garden (a little while before planting, preferably), you've added fertilizer which will help feed your soil, and subsequently, your plants. If you mix in compost, you are adding a soil conditioner than helps add organic matter, improve drainage, improves nutrient retention and benefits your soils microorganisms.

Both things are good, both things serve slightly different purposes.

Adding composted manure to the planting hole isn't a bad idea, per say, but it wont' do all that much by itself. As you stated, it doesn't have much in the way of measurable nutrients. If you add fresh manure (in the fall) or aged manure in the spring (before planting), then you've added something to feed the plants. Once manure has been "fully composted", there is not much left nutrient-wise.

Either way, I find it hard to believe that the manure added just at the time of planting is enough for the whole season. You would need to add something later on to help keep things going.

In my experience, tomatoes are not really that fussy at all when it comes to soil. Give them enough sun and the right amount of water (usually less than you think) and they do just fine. Some of my most productive plants were put in rocky soil that I did nothing at all to amend.

The story behind the pic

I recieved these AGG seeds years ago from a nice guy in Ohio. My first year planting was not very good- very few tomatoes- and the plants were on the small side. He advised me to use at least 75 - 90 percent cow manure.. so I did 90.. the next season. The 3 plants grew to 7-8 feet and I got 2 tomatoes from them.

We both got a good laugh and tend to plant with less
MUCH less.

I am hardly squeemish (look up "mouse" and "sautesmom" on this board, LOL) but even I wouldn't grow tomatoes in fresh manure, or even old manure. Corn, yes---pole green beans, yes---but tomatoes are too close to the ground, and all cows have e. coli in their digestive systems. If you really want to try it, dig a deep hole for the manure and cover it with a foot of soil as a "shield" for the tomatoes.

Carla in Sac

Hmmm, humans also have e. coli in their digestive tracts.

YES which is why we don't eat our own poop! (Well, that's not why, of course, but it is one reason why human waste is never used for fertilizer!)

Carla in Sac

My experience is that tomatoes are tough plants that are easy to grow. Thats why they are popular and widespread. I would not hesitate to try what you are talking about. I used lightly composted horse manure in my garden last year. It worked great, plants were healthy and productive. I knew a guy in AR who had a very productive garden in raised beds. The only two ingredients he used each year for his garden soil was a 50% mixture of dried cowpies and peat moss. He had no mineral soil in his boxes at all. The soil would decompose each year and he would just top his box off the next spring with that mix.

I have grown tomatoes in clay, silt, sand and loam. I have used cow manure, horse manure, rabbit manure, compost and commercial fertilizer. I have neglected the plants with water, and over watered them. They all grew tomatoes.

I've only been gardening for 2 years, this year being my 3rd. The 2 years I did have a garden I mixed Miracle Grow Moisture Control soil with Dehydrated Cow Manure and it worked great. I've also used regular Miracle grow with peat moss the second year. This year I will renew with Moisture Control and dehydrated Cow Manure by mixing it in a cement mixing tray but only for the top 2 or 3" of the garden where the plants will be sitting in the soil. The rest will be the older soil from previous years. I believe if I use fresh on top it should work OK.

Cow/ horse manures are very good soil amendments. So they need to be tilled in in order amend the soil. Plus they are Nitrogen rich and poor in P and K, I think.

I buy and use a lot of steer manure (from HD, $1.47/cubic ft.) compost. But its mostly non-manure compost. Even then I till it in and mix with planting hole soil to fluff it up.

Sey

Remember, there is a fair amount of weed seed in manure. Including some stuff you just do not want to get started in your garden.

Nothing HAS to be tilled if one has live soil which has worms, centipeds, nematods, slugs etc. of course tilling has been a very common practice and possibly helpful at some situations. It is preferable to compost manure first and using too much of it can lead to excess potassium in the soil.

Bryand, there is nothing like experimenting what works for you and what not.

There are two thoughts on gardening currently exist to my knowledge- one that we have to add fertilizers to the soil otherwise plants won't grow. Second thought- soil and I mean live soil with microbes in it has everything plant needs. Soil is different from dirt which is dead particles left after you take life- microbes, worms out of soil. I belong to second group of thought- I care about life in my soil and adjust elements in it based on soil test. Compost, mineral foliar sprays, microbes, green cover crops and mulch do the rest.

Happy gardening!

If you are a vegetarian and concerned about what you put in the soil then I think horse manure would be more ideal since you know they are grass eating. It's really just digested grasses. Cow is a different story depend on the source.

I personally like to have all the manure composted or at least somewhat composted before using them, because of potential diseases that could come in the manure.

Since you're a vegetarian looking at making your own compost from leaves and food scraps is worthwhile.

Years ago, I just plated my tomatoes in the ground and they grew and produced. I suppose I probably used some liquid Miracle Grow once in a while. Looking back, that house had some great dirt...=)

I have planted tomatoes in the back yard when out of space. Just dig a hole through the sod. I use a post hole digger, to dig the hole. The depth is judge by the size of the plant. Put the plant in fill it up with dirt Miracle grow it really good. About 2 weeks later put cardboard around them for weed control. Every two weeks spray them down with Miracle grow, an something for blossom end rot. It has work for me.

When people say "It worked for me" I don't know what that means. I watched my neighbor fill a 10 by 10 raised bed with not completely composted horse manure and then grow 6 tomato plants, 10 corn plants and a handful of other things. The tomatoes grew about 8 feet tall but produced only one or two fruits per plant. The corn hardly produced at all. He seemed satisfied. But to me, that's a failure.

Ohiofem, it gets rather philosophical... to me I know I will fail. Here or there will be something...

Question is- did your neighbor learn to not do it again? LOL

This is from my favorite garden guru Phil Nauta "If you garden to learn, you'll succeed every day."

The answer to the original OP: "Growing with just cow manure?"
in my opinion is : It is not the right thing to do.
PURE well composted manure does NOT have the essential nutrients that tomato plants need. Cow manure is very rich in Nitrogen, that can give probably a lush green foliage. But how about P , K , Mg, Ca , Fe, ...????
So, my opinion is to work it into topsoil, whatever you currently have in your garden. Yo can work it just into several inches on the top or MIX it in the planting hole to get a big bang for the buck.
In the end of the day ; IT IS YOUR GARDEN

Sey

Actually, in this climate, manure is not very rich in anything at all other than OM. Because time does such a good job of reducing the drug and bacterial dangers, I let the stuff sit for perhaps five or so months before using it. At that point there's very little N; most of it has gone off into the atmosphere. If I do use any of the un-aged stuff, it's for flowers, not edibles.

Two yards twice a year seems to work for keeping the beds full. I go through roughly four inches of it yearly and use it only as a top dressing. I don't till, but that doesn't mean the growing layer is pure manure. Pulling mixes things somewhat, and there's also trowel work wherever any plant gets put into the ground, but it's definitely a thick smothering cover. Not quite as lazy as Ruth Stout, but getting there...

There are NO weeds when you smother like that and are stingy with the watering, both drip and rainfall. Again that's local conditions. YMMV

Well, when you dig a hole to plant the layers of soil get mixed, and thats what the roots are in then , which is very good.
Eventually even composted manure will be disintegrated , becoming a kind of topsoil with less micro air pockets.. If I get a lot of organic matter, including manures, I till and mix everything together. I am a "DO TILL !" gardener.

Sey