Need help! Weird Kitchen layout

13 years ago

I'm purchasing this town house for myself (my first place!). It's charming and quirky and I love it. Although the tiny kitchen needs some love. There is an odd space in one corner where the stove, fridge and water heater cabinet meet. I need help figuring out a better layout for the space (if possible). There is barely enough room to open the oven door without hitting the front of the fridge. I should also note that there is no pantry in the kitchen. There are plenty of cabinets for my needs if I install open shelving where the mirror is. I've thought about replacing the giant water heater (in the cabinet to the left of the fridge and to the right of the oven) with a tankless water heater to free up some space. There is plenty of ventilation for a tankless water heater in the outdoor closet (next to the kitchen on the other side of the left wall of cabinets) that houses the washer and dryer. Is it even possible to move a tankless water heater there? Will it cost an exorbitant amount? I'm new to this and I don't really know what I'm doing yet. Keeping costs fairly minimal at first is ideal. I want to live with it a little while before I make any huge renovations. Thank you all for your help! I appreciate any bit of advice you can give!

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StudioMalo

13 years ago

there are some good thoughts here. i think purchasing a tankless water heater is a good investment, but the cost of moving it to an entirely new location is probably not warranted on a tight budget.

perhaps you can remove the existing water heater and framing, and place the fridge there beside the stove. then you should be able to mount the tankless (and ventless if necessary) water heater in a cabinet above the fridge, minimizing plumbing and electrical changes. this will open up the floor area of the kitchen for better function and flow. it will also allow you to enlarge the opening to the dining room if and when your budget permits.

unless you're ready for an entire kitchen re-do, i would try to find solutions that don't require removing other cabinets and counters, etc. good luck.

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Comments (37)

User
13 years ago
You do have to be careful when choosing a plumber if you need to move things. It may also require an electrician. I would get recommendations from friends and also big box stores like Lowes have plumbers available for installation; but I would question them about their reliability etc. I just always figure they surely will want the stores to keep recommending them so perhaps they will not do you wrong. A good rule of thumb before having any work done is to get 3 written estimates. Waterless heaters are more expensive than those with water; but if you are going to be there awhile and it frees up the space you need, it may be worth it. Also, water heaters can develop leaks.
PRO
Custom Home Planning Center
13 years ago
1st is there line gas for the tankless heater or is it elec. They don't take up very much space and can be mounted on there side over the washer dryer. You need to do this instalation this year as the federal tax credits for the switch currently run out at the end of the year. Check with the state energy office to see if there are also state credits available.
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charleee
13 years ago
I'm not saying this would be easy, but it might be easier to remove some of the cabinets to the left of the sink for the fridge. I can't see all the way to the end of the counter, tho.
Kelly Gerstle
13 years ago
Can you remove the wall and open up the kitchen more instead of the doorway? Then an island could be utilized to free up space.
PRO
Elise Moore Design
13 years ago
I like the idea of a tankless water heater if you can afford it. If you can do away with the water heater cabinet, you can extend the counter and cabinets to the end wall which will give you more space for food prep. I would also consider moving the refrigerator to the opposite wall and get a counter depth model so it doesn't stick out. I agree with the idea of removing some or all of the wall with the hooks to open the space up more. It looks like you have room for an island. You could start with a nice mobile cart with a butcher block top for an inexpensive island until you decide if you want to invest in a more permanent one. They have storage below and you can order them online. They run between $200-500.
mmonika
13 years ago
I vote for a tankless water heater. It is not a cheap fix, it is not an easy fix, but it is 200% worth it.
We went tankless to replace the massive tank sitting in our kitchen as well. In small spaces, a tankless is worth its weight in space savings. They are also economical and energy efficient so you benefit in more then just space. We installed ours in our very tiny crawlspace. Research the units and plumbers heavily!!!!
Another consideration you need to consider is whether you want to change your plumbing throughout the house to a home run system. This is where every fixture in your house has a direct line into the tankless. This equals faster delivery of your hot water and being able to close off water per fixture if necessary ( to replace, to fix...etc) . It is a powerful advantage for the tankless. We installed our home run system 1 year after we installed the tankless, so I wouldn't say you need to decide this instantly, but its something a plumber may ask.
mmonika
13 years ago
In regards to your kitchen layout, how about this...
Install a cooktop in the cabinets on the left of the sink. Center it within the floor space and get nice range hood and do some open shelving across that entire wall.
Keep the sink where it is.
install floor- ceiling cabinet where your stove is now. Install a wall oven there and use the rest for storage.
Move the fridge beside the wall oven. Get rid of those closets( are they closets?)
Install narrow shelving along the opposite wall from the wall oven & fridge for extra storage.
lionnessone
13 years ago
Can you turn your fridge to the wall beside the stove, or place it on the other wall, maybe on an angle in the opposite corner? I hope one of these ideas will help you to open your oven door without hitting the fridge door. Let me know how it turns out. :)
Elise
13 years ago
Move the stove and gas line to the left of the sink. Put refrig in stove location; you will need a 110 outlet. If you remove the tank WH then the cabinet could become the pantry.

A tankless WH is a great idea but expensive. Check into state and fed energy upgrades if you will get any rebates ( they come and go with the politics). For a gas tankless you need a one inch line coming into the house from your gas meter, then there has to be a solo line feeding directly to the tankless as it draws alot of gas.

Check into an electric tankless, as for a single person, that could be adequate for your needs.
andreayoungc
13 years ago
do not hire a plumber etc through the big box stores - you are paying for both of their services. also , I wasn't so thrilled with the tear out person and counter installers that were sent to my house;, but that was the ones I got.
Heather S
13 years ago
eventually it might be nice to move the appliances around. I might suggest moving the dishwasher to the left of the sink in that perpendicular run of cabinets. Then you could move the stove over a little closer to the sink and put some cabinets between the stove and the water heater closet. Then you would have better room for the fridge to open. The tankless water heater is a great idea to open up some more space in there, certainly. Then maybe you could align the fridge with the cabinets to the right of the stove (turning it 90 degrees from where it is currently sitting).
PRO
Cascade Cabinetry LLC
13 years ago
I will add a thought for your consideration should you decide not to move or change the water heater. Your gas stove is against your water heater partition, which from the photo looks to be made of combustible material. There should be separation between the two, but if it stays as it is now a noncombustible material should be placed on the water heater partition. Look in the closets, you may find some extra tile from the original installation.
Rio Brewster
13 years ago
Or if you can move the fridge to the opposite wall, and buy a rolling storage cart you can use as an island. When not needed, you can stash in that space where the fridge is now, and it would make up for some of the storage and counter space you'd lose.
guycaron
13 years ago
last modified: 13 years ago
Do not move your dishwasher or your fridge to the left of the sink. You won't be able to get to the sink with the dishwasher door open! And moving the fridge to the left of the sink will create a somewhat inaccessible corner. Replace hwt for tankless. Put it in the top cabinet to save on labour, put your fridge where your hwt is now. Seperate your gas stove from fridge by moving the bank of drawers from the left of stove to the right to minimize fre hazard, except this will cause a serious problem lining up with the upper cabinets. Open up arch if you want to show kitchen more and if it's feasible.
guycaron
13 years ago
Could you widen kitchen by 16 inches?
olldroo
13 years ago
Can you make another access to the hot water service via another wall (don't know what other rooms adjoin)? If that is possible I would then move the fridge to inside the kitchen door on the left and fill the fridge area in with a pantry, looks like it could be big enough for a partially walk in. The storage you would create would far offset any cupboards lost for the fridge.
laurielynne
13 years ago
I agree with Carpe Diem relocate the fridge to the opposite side of the room (removing the upper/lower cupboard area on the left side of the doorway) and in the space where the fridge was, install a large pantry with doors to match your cupoards or maybe a large bakers rack that you could move if you need to get into the water tank area. You would lose some counter space by doing this but you could make that up if you get a rolling cart and you would gain a lot of storage in the old fridge area.
maisondebois_56n
13 years ago
No need to go crazy moving appliances around, the refrigerator is really the issue. There are a couple of manufacturers of 24" wide refrigerators. Summit is one. They are taller, though, so a tankless heater may or may not fit above. A friend has a 24" refrigerator/freezer in his small loft kitchen and it is great. Your idea of open shelving instead of the mirror is also very good. I'd recommend installing some inexpensive lighting under the cabinets (Ikea) too.

As a serial renovator, my best advice is to do the minimum, so that you're not going crazy, and live in the space for a while. Your ideas will change and become refined over time.

Congratulations on your first place.
jacques976
13 years ago
if i was to do anything i would move the refrigerator to replace the cabinets by the doorway as you walk in that would make less cabinets but all you would have to do is get a 120 volt line added.after that you would have to work out a plan for a complete remodel for the furture.
Susan Lawson
13 years ago
Can you switch the refrigerator and the stove? Might require some rewiring/replumbing, but may not be as expensive as you think.
PRO
She Builds
13 years ago
I recommend a tankless water heater only if you have natural gas available. If you get an electric model, you will watch the dial spin on your electric meter. I had an electric tankless, and my bill did not improve whatsoever. The second consideration is do you have access under the floors (basement, crawlspace) and/or do you have attic access in the kitchen/laundry area? If you have access, it will be fairly easy/inexpensive to move the gas line to a nearby room/location/shared wall. The cost of a tankless HWH varies, but get a good one and take advantage of the tax credit this year, state credits and manufacturers rebates.

I have been a kitchen designer for over 11 years and would be happy to help you design your new kitchen and provide you with affordable, quality cabinetry. If you want to see some of my projects, visit my website at www.kitchenredesignonline.com or like my Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/KitchenRedesign?ref=hl.

Congrats on your new home. :)
mimc
13 years ago
last modified: 13 years ago
I'm curious about the fridge placement. It doesn't look like it should have ever been there in the first place and I wonder if the last owner might have moved it? Maybe once you've met some neighbors, you can have a look at their kitchens and see what they've done and what might have been the original plan. Other comments have pointed out issues with the stove being so close to the water heater etc...building codes are usually pretty strict about these things.
Good luck with your first place, you're starting on a very satisfying journey!
pamlazo
13 years ago
The simplest, low-cost solution is to move the fridge to the next room (the dining room, I assume) just outside the kitchen doorway. People who need to get food from the fridge can access the fridge but won't be in the way of the cook. There will be a better flow from the fridge to the prep area and sink to the stove as you cook. The vacated space could be used for much needed storage and/or counter space.
Peter Kirner
13 years ago
I think you are biting off more then you can chew out of the gate. Live with what you have for now. From my opinion it is not that bad. Once you live with it, then have some contractors out to give you suggestions and perspective. I imagine moving the water heater is TOO much work, and will cost too much. I would wait, then go from there.
kaz2
13 years ago
Can you knock out the wall between the kitchen and dining room? I assume its stairs above the fridge? Once the wall is gone can you push the fridge a little more under the stairs and then put a cupboard above the fridge. Have a moveable island / small table between the fridge and the hot water cupboard until you have enough money to change it to a tank less system. It'll be an open plan kitchen/dining, if there is enough room an island that would be great but that's money and as the others have said it's good to live there a bit before changing anything. If it is a small apartment and you do an island, you could build in a bench seat on the dining room side for the table to save space. Just a thought.
kaz2
13 years ago
I love the mirror. I thought it was a great idea there. When you are doing dishes it's nice to have the head space. You might want to think twice about sheves? Unless you really need them.
PRO
Marie Hebson's interiorsBYDESIGN Inc.
13 years ago
Yup - tankless water heater...go from there.
sunsneeker
13 years ago
If you want to keep costs down and live with it a while before doing any major renovations then to me this one is a no-brainer. You should either:
1. live with it - you said you can access everything as is, even if only just;
2. move the fridge to another room (my fridge is not in my kitchen as it doesn't fit through the door!); or
3. buy a smaller fridge.
Unless your hwu breaks down, save all of those other, quite possibly great ideas, until you are ready to do that major renovation.
sjmom
13 years ago
The easiest solution would be to move the refrigerator and I would do that right away to be able to clear the oven door and I would do this for safety purposes so as not to get burned when removing items. Then you can live with it and decide what to do with the water heater.
Amy Burke
13 years ago
Hi Colecidra! Although I normall read all comments before my 2 cents, I skipped for the fact that you have tons of tips etc. All I can say is IKEA. Your space is a challenge but the Euros have got it down pat when it comes to use of small spaces. Once you consult with a Contractor ref the things that can move get IKEA to design your layout. I know you may find an easy fix after your consult too which is ideal but should it be an option, go vertical. Best of luck!
PRO
Kathryn Tegreene
13 years ago
I think your idea of moving a water heater to the adjacent garage is a good one. I would ask your Realtor for who she uses and at least 2 other people. I would also ask your contractor if it would be possible to build a bump out in the garage for your refrigerator. It would still face the same direction but it would be 2 feet back. It might not be possible, but that would really change the usability of your kitchen. Good luck and congratulations on your new purchase.
elcieg
13 years ago
If you have another space to put a tankless water heater, investigate that. A friend has a Rinnai in her garage and it serves the upstairs guest quarters.
Elise
13 years ago
Hello again Colecidra!
Looking at your kitchen, my guesstimate is that your kitchen is 12 feet long by 6.5 feet wide. With the depth of the counters you are left with 4.5 feet of width to move around in. Before you go into the expense of moving into a tankless WH (great idea), consider purchasing a great slim refrigerator. Selling your current refrigerator could pay for the shipping cost of a new one.

Below are 3 different refrigerators in stainless steel that are 24 inches wide and taller than average. They are the slim Eurostyle seen on some remodeling television shows. For about $1500 plus shipping, you could have a new refrig, leaving the WH in place until you can afford to do a bigger remodel.

I am assuming you may not have beaucoup bucks left after purchasing your new place.
The bids I received to purchase and install a tankless gas WH were close to $5000. Food for thought?

https://www.houzz.com/discussions/slim-fridge-dsvw-vd~128901

http://www.ajmadison.com/cgi-bin/ajmadison/CP171SS.html

http://www.ajmadison.com/cgi-bin/ajmadison/CS131.html

http://www.ajmadison.com/cgi-bin/ajmadison/BRFB1040.html
PRO
LM Designers
13 years ago
It is nice to live in a new place for a year before making expensive changes. I agree with the others on getting a counter depth fridge which is taller than what you currently have but is 24" deep versus 29" deep as yours is. You can find mark downs at Lowes including floor models that are marked down to make room for new models. You will save money doing this, sometimes by half.
PRO
Linda
13 years ago
As you say there is plenty of space in the outdoor cabinet for a tankless waterheater, does that mean you have space above your washer and dryer? Can you replace the existing units with stackable front loaders? Not the single unit kind with a tiny top load machine but regular capacity units. Then, put the existing hot water heater into the vacated space. That should be close enough to current location that you can simply extend the current plumbing without major changes. You might even be able to use stainless steel flexible supply hoses for the hot water heater and use the existing piping without alterations.

Then you could get one of those 24" wide fridges mentioned above for the current water heater space. You might also find that switching to an 18" wide dishwasher would free up enough room so the water heater space would be wide enough for a small apartment size fridge.

How about reconfiguring the sink plumbing to put a single drawer dishwasher underneath the sink?
rambuskim
13 years ago
I love the idea do using under counter refrigerator and freezer in small spaces. It allows you to have more counter space and storage (perhaps shelves) above the counter. You could replace the existing refrigerator with undercounted models, add a counter, and create more space without an extensive remodel you are not ready for.

Need help! Weird Kitchen layout

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