Two things come to mind. First off, they may be overcrowded and some are following their instinct to seek fresh pastures. This is one of the survival techniques of the species. The other is that they may well be hungry. A large bin like you describe can eat 100 to 150 pounds of food a week. I have a large bin going right now (about a meter in diameter and a meter high) and it can easily go through 100 pounds a week in warm weather. If you want to, you can set up new bins and divide up the worms, or just let some of them go. They may or may not survive for long out of the bin, but either way they will help the environment. Good luck

Dick

Thanks for your reply. The bin is not that large, about the size of a standard rubbish bin in Australia (if you know what that is). I've never put any bedding in the bin, so yesterday put some torn up wet newspaper in and it seems to me there are less climbing up the sides. I'm reluctant to let any go if that will kill them. Would they survive if dug into a garden bed?

All depends on what species of worm you have, but if they are doing very well in a bin, chances are they would not survive for long in a garden bed. Most bin worms are natural compost or manure worms and don't live in soil.

Dick

Julia, don,t know why worms climb up bin ..love to know but putting worms in garden has worked for me although a lot of my worms have come from my mums compost heap which I make sure is healthy with heaps of manure and grass clippings and her vegie scrapes and no bin ... just pure compost. The worms just keep breeding and every time I mow her lawns my payment is a bag of compost and I select my beautiful worms

hi Julia, it sounds like youve inherited some old compost in your bin, and chances are youve got your regular earthworm variety in there. because of the open bottom earthworms in the soil will find the compost and move in to enjoy the lovely smorgasbord and if its been in the bin for a long time the numbers may have built up. keep composting in the bin, and when you move that compost into the garden the worms will go with it to improve the garden. I find good numbers in my compost bins all the time, and the regular earthworms will be fine in your soil.

I think they may be compost worms. They're thinner than earthworms and a duller red colour.

How often should I turn the compost. I've heard that worms don't like to be disturbed too much. Also what about garlic and onions and citrus peelings? I've heard conflicting reports about that. And garden lime? Pros and cons??

I turn my compost weekly (in summer I only need to turn 3 times before its cooked), but I only start turning once the bin is full. I also add onion and citrus to the compost bin. my worm farm on the other hand I dont add those things because its much smaller

I dont use lime at all because I have read that it reduces the amount of nitrogen in the finished compost, but if your compost goes sour then you can add more high carbon items like shredded paper or dried leaves and mix it in to balance it out. Ive never needed to use it in the worm bin

Ok, let's back up a moment. First, Julia, what you're describing is a very healthy bin! The bin is open to the soil, thus, were there a problem, the worms could easily leave the system, but they remain in massive numbers, clearly indicating that there is no problem from the worm perspective. Worms do not mass populate under stress conditions. That the level of material in the system is not increasing means that it is being processed as one would hope, and that there are no odors means the system is not anaerobic. Your system sounds outstanding and I see nothing that indicates any problem at all!

Earthworms will never overcrowd their environment. Once their population reaches the maximum that can be supported by the amount of available food and space, their breeding and mortality rates even out, and the population stabilizes. Worms do not climb bin walls due to overcrowding. When the majority of the worms in a bin climb the walls this is usually indicative of a need for more air in the sytem, usually brought on by excessively wet conditions. It does not sound as though this describes your system however, as you indicate that the vast majority of worms are still in the OM. Another reason for wall climbing is that some of the worms are simply looking for "resting zones". I'd lay odds that a small portion of your worm population are simply taking a break from their active environment for a bit of peace and quiet.

The bottom line, Julia, is that nothing in what you've described is indicating a problem. It sounds as though you've done an excellent job creating an environment that allows a masive worm population to work efficiently on your behalf. Since there are no red flags in what you've descibed, your best bet is to do nothing. Simply continue operating the system as you have been and enjoy the process.

Congratulations on a well run system!

Kelly S

That's a relief! Nice to hear that the ones on the sides of the bin are just taking a meditation break! I'm off to give the compost a bit of a turn with the trusty compost screw.

Kelly
Thanks for the info you gave to Julia. I!m very new at vermicomposting. I have three worm bins set up. Two in pollystirene bins with drainage, air and started with a thousand worms each which I bought...trying not to feed them too much. On the other hand .. in my compost bin, the normal size, I put my Mums compost in, worms and all, this bin is open at the base and I just throw everything in, except onion, citrus, meat scraps ect. The worms are breeding very well and the bin does not smell, But my question is .. are they the same sort of worms I bought , are composting worms which look the same, doing just the same thing? Only one is in a bin and one is found in a compost heap, At the moment the compost bin is breeding like crazy and I keep putting all the extra scraps in, also straw, newspaper and horse manure. Don!T have as many as Julia but it seems to be working.

Welcome, Cath!

It is likely that many of the worms in your compost pile are the same species as those purchased for your worm bin, yes, but not all. A compost pile will become populated by any worm species suited to such an environment, but will also play host to worm species that visit the compost for a meal or two, but do not choose this location as a home.

The compost may be more densely populated with worms because of the number of worms with access to the system, but what is more likely the reason is because you are not hesitating to feed the compost pile. We want folks to be mindful of feeding rates to avoid adding so much energy that the system generates heat or becomes saturated from the high moisture associated with food scraps, but UNDERfeeding a bin is as problematic as is overfeeding. Take a cue from that compost pile; the system needs to be fed if you want to maximize the worm population and activity level.

We usually suggest to folks that they feed based on worm activity. Consider feeding the two dedicated worm bins about half a kg of food scraps and check on this pocket of food each day. As soon as you see worm move into this feedstock, feed another half kg of feedstock. The previous feedstock addition does not need to be fully processed, worms simply need to be actively working in it. Each time you find worms active in the previous feedstock addition, add another. Feeding in this way ensures you are not exceeding the worms' ability to stay up with the food, but also that you are adding sufficient amount to maximize system processing and worm activity.

You also mentioned that you are avoiding onion and citrus in your worm bin. Know that there is no problem with adding these material to the system. Cautions against citrus usually either erroneously warn of problems with either acidity or damage to the worms from a naturally occuring solvent, d-limonene, associated with citrus oils. These worms are incredibly tolerant of a wide pH range, working equally well across a pH range from 4 to 9. Citrus is, first, within this range, and second, is buffered by the castings and other feedstocks, thus the pH of a system that includes citrus is not overly acidic. Further, worms do NOT prefer a neutral pH, rather, when given a choice, actually show a preference for an acidic pH of roughly 5, thus, the inclusion of citrus will often be making the worms even more comfortable rather than inhibiting their activity.

As to the d-limonen associated with citrus oil, while it is legitimately found in citrus, it is not generally at sufficient concentration to show any measurable impact in a worm bin, unless the system is being fed LARGE volumes of citrus exclusively.

Folks have often been warned off from using onion because of erroneous fears that the pungent oil will irritate the worms skin and/or because onion is sometimes believed to reduce the microbial activity on which worms rely. There is no evidence whatsoever that either of these concerns are valid, however, particularly since many, many worm bins thrive with the use of onion.

So, don't be concerned about the use of virtually any veggie wastes, and let the worms tell you how much food to add. As you've seen when comparing your worm bin and compost pile, worms thrive on "neglect" and do not need a great deal of management in order to thrive.

Kelly S

Kelly S

Your response to my question is much appreciated. Feel like the worm farms are treated like the China Doll and the compost is treated like the rag doll. The rag doll is happier.

I have two more questions ( at this time ) First ... what kind of bin do you suggest for a worm farm, I live in a block of flats but that should not make a difference.

Second .. the worms I collect from my Mums compost, should they go to the worm farm, to build up supplies or go back into my compost?

A little bit of background, My Mum is 76, lives on a large block, for the suburbs anyway, has a beautiful garden and if I didn,t look after her garden she would be in a UNIT BY NOW. The family Home. So I do look after her compost heap.

With her vegie scraps, lawn clippings and the manure I get, somehow the worms are invited without the invitation.

Mum,s Good Old Compost Heap.

Thanks again Kelly. S.

Cath.

I can say that both onion and orange peels will be processed normally by a healthy bin. I did find that after adding a large onion that had gone bad, the bin did stink for a while although I think if you cut it up a bit it will be processed much faster. I had an outdoor bin that has tons of soldier fly larvae and I threw in a huge chunk of red onion that I had not used and the BSF still tackled it mightily and produced a truly rank bin (for a few days), but highly decomposed.