I got them from TomatoFest. Dang. Well, we'll just see what happens.

I read another post back a few weeks ago and can't remember which board that was asking the same thing. The only thing I can say is Gary says on his site it is wispy. I have the seed I bought from him but don't think I started any. Will check my notes. So if it is wispy that is the way Gary says it should be. Sorry I can't be of more help. Jay

I got them from TomatoFest

****

I did not buy my seeds for Rostova from Tomatofest; they were sent to me in the original Tomatofest pack from someone else who did buy them there and had used a few seeds and sent me the rest.

Perhaps we have different views of what wispy might mean.

Many paste tomato varieties, a few others, and certainly most heart varieties have wispy, droopy, finely dissected foliage, and that's not what I saw with Rostova. The fruits were as originally described by the place from which Gary got the seeds and renamed the variety from Rostova to Sunset's Red Horizon and as Gary also described the fruits in the blurb written for this variety at Tomatofest.

So I had no doubt that I was growing what I should be growing.

Carolyn

My Sunset Red Horizon is doing the same thing, and has all along. I kept thinking it was dying, but it's actually crowded it's neighbors (Cherokee Purple and Pineapple) off the fence.

Carolyn, I'm using the name SSRH, as that is what it was sent to me as :). I was curious when I read some of your posts that it was actually Rostova, and found this;

On the website; Seedfest UK
"Sunset's Red Horizon Tomato
Origin: United States
Item #: TOM092
In 2001, we introduced our famous Rostova Tomato to gardeners worldwide. On Ebay.com, prices as high $50 per packet were paid for Rostova seed by tomato enthusiasts who knew an excellent tomato when they saw one. In 2003, in conjunction with Sunset Magazine, Tomatofest of California re-introduced this variety (with our blessing) under the name Sunset's Red Horizon. The variety received loads of national press and became very much in demand. In 2005, we were able to trial seed bred down from Tomatofest offerings and were immediately struck by the fact that the resulting plants and tomatoes were not identical to the original Rostova variety. Though they had many of the excellent qualities of the original, the fruits were somewhat smaller, tended to be more heart-shaped and there was also more of a tendency toward a more upright, strurdier vine. The tomatoes were also faster maturing. Starting in late 2005, we split the variety into two breeding programs - Rostova Extra Special Selection (which were bred down exclusively from the few remnants of the original imported seed collected in Russia in 1999) and Sunset's Red Horizon (exclusively down from Tomatofest stock). Our intention is to eventually offer Sunset's Red Horizon and Rostova Extra Special Selection side by side. (Note: Rostova Extra Special Selection is due to be available again in the Fall of 2007).

Sunset's Red Horizon is an excellent red-pink variety of an old fashioned Oxheart shape that is borne on sturdy, disease resistant vines. The fruits are medium sized and are incredibly dense, thick meated and possess an honest old fashioned tomato taste that beats store bought tomatoes hands down. Highly recommended for cool and wet northern climates. 80 days."

Anyway, just wanted to say that I'm not trying to be obnoxious and ignoring your request to use the correct name, just not sure it is? Any input?
Margo

Here is a link that might be useful: seedfest UK

Interesting stuff. Whatever tomatoes I get, at least I'm no longer feeling as if there's something wrong with my tomato plant. It's taller than the others, flowered earlier.... it would just prefer to tat doilies than join the football team.

Any input?

*****

Only to say that while it was said above that Rostova was renamed by Tomatofest with the **blessing" of Seedfest that isn't the way it was said in an earlier version of the Seedfest blurb for Rostova.

I never asked Gary what went on and I don't want to and will not.

All you need to do is to read the SSRH blurb at Tomatofest and the original blurb for Rostova at Seedfest and you'll see that they are practically identical.

That it now says that the seeds sent out by Tomatofest are not what they should be is news to me. Apparently or possibly a problem with seed production/

I think it would be great for someone to grow SSRH and compare with Seedfest Rostova to see what the difference really is.

My comments were based on my growing what was sent to me as SSRH and knowing that originally SSRH was Rostova.

I am one who does not like to see variety names changed or altered.

So let's see how this all sorts itself out.

Carolyn, whose plants were not wilty or droopy or finely dissected but then this was maybe three years ago and perhaps what I was growing then was the true Rostova since no timeline for the altered Rostova was given above.

It's true that my idea of what wilty looks like may be different. I just don't have enough experience to have a sense of perspective. Here's a picture of my SSRH (on the right) with Earl Of Edgecombe next to it.

It's true that my idea of what wilty looks like may be different. I just don't have enough experience to have a sense of perspective. Here's a picture of my SSRH (on the right) with Earl Of Edgecombe next to it.

*****

I agree that the one on the right, supposedly SSRH, nee Rostova, looks wilty and droopy and my Rostova looked nothing like that.

So it looks like what was written at the Seedfest site appears to be true and it isn't SSRH, nee Rostova.

Can you see any fruits yet? As I recall the Seedfest blurb said that the fruits on the not SSRH, not Rostova plant would have heart shaped fruits, but I didn't take the time to go back up and reread b'c I'm just too darn lazy today. LOL

And as I had said above, most varieties with wispy, droopy foliage are the heart shaped varieties with a few others others as well, and some paste types So it makes sense.

Carolyn, who likes the look of your Earl of Edgecombe plant; one of my fave varieties that I introduced to the US now many many years ago. ( smile)

I hadn't seen the TomatoFest description in a while, but here's what it says:

This outstanding heirloom, named by tomato grower, Gary Ibsen, for Sunset magazine in 2003, is a native to Southern Russia. Huge, red, 4 to 6-inch, meaty, heart-shaped fruits are borne from a big leafy plant with wispy vines. Introduced to the west by Nik Peplenov who immigrated to the US in 1999 and brought with him his favorite heirloom seeds from the Rostov Don region of Russia. They are not only one of the first varieties to produce but produce fruit well into November (in Oregon and in California). Proven resistant to frost, blossom end rot and cracking. Delicious fruit with huge tomatoey flavors.

So far, it describes the tomato I've got to a tee (no fruits yet). How very interesting that your Rostov seems to be a different variety altogether! I mean, I could understand a slight variation of the same variety, but a completely different fruit and completely different growth pattern is very puzzling. Who knew there would be mystery and intrigue in the tomato world? By the way, that's exciting that you were the one who introduced Earl Of Edgecombe here.... it's one of the ones I've been most looking forward to.

hi lelia.....i had the same concern.

this plant is my tallest but looks like it's weak and frail.

my other plants are deep green , leafy and appear very sturdy and thick stemmed.

i have 12 different types and the SRH and ANNNA RUSSIAN both appear fragile.

apparently this might be normal (hopefully) :)

wish u much success!

mike

(Starting in late 2005, we split the variety into two breeding programs - Rostova Extra Special Selection (which were bred down exclusively from the few remnants of the original imported seed collected in Russia in 1999) and Sunset's Red Horizon (exclusively down from Tomatofest stock). Our intention is to eventually offer Sunset's Red Horizon and Rostova Extra Special Selection side by side. (Note: Rostova Extra Special Selection is due to be available again in the Fall of 2007).)

If Seedfest didn't feel there was a significant difference between what they knew as Rostova, and what Tomatofest is sending out these days as SSRH they wouldn't have started a breeding program to recapture the real Rostova, which they indicate was from 1999.

Again, it's my belief that Tomatofest was sending out authentic Rostova for a while, and that's what I grew, and that the current problem arose in some manner either from crossed seed or whatever. No way for us to know.

Going from memory now, the blurb for Rostova at Seedfest I saw several years ago and the blurb for SSRH was almost identical, but the latter seems to have changed now. Again, from memory which isn't always perfect. ( smile)

Carolyn

I'm growing 7 different varieties this year, and one of them is Sunset's Red Horizon from Tomatofest. My plant looks exactly like lelia's. It's the tallest tomato I have and the leaves are very lacey, droopy and even curled up at first. The older leaves near the bottom have expanded and are not so wispy now. I do not have any fruit set on it yet (Moskovich is winning the early fruit race).

Mine looks the same, also. It's large, and green, but was slow to flower.I think there is one fruit, but it (and Pineapple) are way behind everyone else at fruit set. I'll checkand see if I can figure out the shape, etc.
Margo

The leaves are almost lacy and delicate, and the newer leaves are always soft and droopy like the plant needs water...

Yeah lelia, I have a Rostova (aka SRH) and it has droopy and curled leaves. But a very strong plant be it. It has sufficient water. So I will just let it go and see what happens.

Reg

Does anyone have any production data on the "wilty" version of "Sunset Red Horizon" from TomatoFest? Is it worth growing?

Reg, was your Rostova seed labeled as such? And where did you get it? I would definitely not call my plant strong, so we may be growing different varieties, even though they shouldn't be different. By the end of the season I'm going to be an expert on this tomato, so I hope it's worth growing again!

Reg, was your Rostova seed labeled as such? And where did you get it?...

Hi lelia,

Yes and I purchased seed from TGS. I have two of them in patch. One is a very strong plant, the other is, so far, not. Knowingly and intentionally changing names on any cultivar may help with mercantile-ship, but is deceitful to me.

Reg

"Knowingly and intentionally changing names on any cultivar may help with mercantile-ship, but is deceitful to me." [Reg]

Reg,

I understand your sentiment. But I think it's really a matter of intent and extent of the name change.

After all, I don't see anyone much raising a holler about Red Ponderosa, Crimson Cushion, Beefsteak ... three names for the same tomato.

Then there are all the tomatoes identified only by numbers and upper case letters that subsequently needed some kind of marketable name. Oh ... and how about good tomatoes that have the misfortune of having a not so appetizing or marketable name? Don't they deserve the same opportunity to a legal name change as some human named ... oh say ... Richard Head or Ima Hogg?

Then of course there's the situations where someone grows a particular known and named cultivar for a few generations, selects for some minor characteristic tweeks, and renames the selection to suit his or her fancy ... happens all the time.

So ... now we have Wilty Rostova! Kinda cute, but not the most marketable name for a tomato you must admit :::grin:::

Bill

After all, I don't see anyone much raising a holler about Red Ponderosa, Crimson Cushion, Beefsteak ... three names for the same tomato.

*****

Ja, but that's b'c back in the early 1900's different seed companies would offer many of the same varieties and sometimes change a name to indicate possible exclusivity and while Beefsteak was more of an adjective, certainly Crimson Cushion and Red Ponderosa were about the same.

Heck, if that occurred back then, over a hundred years ago, I accept it b'c it happened. LOL And it happened back then to lots of varieties.

I can't remember which one it is in my MI State Bulletin but I think there were close to 20 names for a single variety and it was indicated that they were the same, or similar.

But this isn't the early 1900's and I guess, as i said above, I just don't like to see a variety have its name changed. Just my own personal opinion.

Carolyn

Okay, the fruits I have found are rather odd *S*. They seem to be significantly ribbed, and pointed on the blossom end. There are only two, and less than an inch is size, so all this may change. I'll keep an eye on them...
Margo

All the fruits have looked the same, ribbed and pointed on the blossom end. Every one has had BER, and the plant is looking worse. I don't think I'll actually get a tomato from this. It gets another week, and then it's history.
Margo

Bill,
I tend to agree with you. The three Red Brandywine varieties offered by one vendor is another. When as I understand it there is really only one. JMO. I know which is the true one now. But can see why some are concerned about name changes. Just don't bother me like seeds not growing true to described descriptions. Jay

I'm just looking at tiny fruits, but a couple of them are quite ribbed, with a definite thinning at the blossom end that's not a point per se, but more like a sharp ridge.... definitely not round. And then I've got one that's not ribbed, but has a crease that bisects two smooth sides, and comes to a definite point. It's putting out flowers on even the lowest stems, and is just as wilty as ever. If this variety is common enough that many of us are growing it from commercial sources, whatever happened to the Rostova beefsteak? I checked the TGS website and they do indeed offer "Rostova", but as an oxheart.

(If this variety is common enough that many of us are growing it from commercial sources, whatever happened to the Rostova beefsteak? I checked the TGS website and they do indeed offer "Rostova", but as an oxheart.)

Cut and Pasted from the JUne 17th post above:
Starting in late 2005, we split the variety into two breeding programs - Rostova Extra Special Selection (which were bred down exclusively from the few remnants of the original imported seed collected in Russia in 1999) and Sunset's Red Horizon (exclusively down from Tomatofest stock). Our intention is to eventually offer Sunset's Red Horizon and Rostova Extra Special Selection side by side. (Note: Rostova Extra Special Selection is due to be available again in the Fall of 2007).

Lelia,

We know that the original Rostova was a beefsteak and that's b'c thjat's how it was described and that's how many of us grew it who got seeds early on.

You see above that the original supplier is going to go back and try and capture that original beefsteak version.

You ask what happened.

Tomatofest would have started out, and did, woith the correct version as recieved. There rpobably was a cross -pollination somewhere b'c both fruit shape and foliage are different from the original. And that's probably how this wilty oxheart came to be.

There's also the possibility that b/c of the genetic diversity found within a variety that the plants used for seed production were a bit off. Stray seeds of another variety used for seed production would be so remote as to not be a viable option. Especially since TGS would have had their seeds produced and came uip with about the same phenotype for Rostova as Tomatofest now offers.

TGS would have gotten their seeds, more recently, either from Tomatofest or perhaps from someone who listed Sunset Red Horizon in the SSE Yearbook. I didn't take the time to go back and look at back SSE Yearbooks but in the 2007 Yearbook it's not listed by anyone as Rostova and just one person lists it as Sunset Red Horizon and the description sounds like the original Rostova, that is, just regular leaf foliage and no mention of any heart shaped fruits.

YOu mentioned commercial sources ( plural). Other than TOmatofest and TGS where else is it being offered? Again, this AM I didn't take the time to Google it.

Carolyn

Well there's a company called Roguelands Heirloom Vegetable Seeds Company that offers one tomato as both Rostova and Sunset's Red Horizon. It says "The Rostova (Sunset's Red Horizon), like many other Russian tomatoes, produces both beefsteak and oxheart shaped tomatoes of an enormous size and is blessed with an enormous size, excellent taste, thick flesh and it excels in cool climates."

And here is their photo:
{{gwi:1351688}}

Imagine that!

Leila,

Rouguelands is Anioleka is Seedfest.....all the same company/

And at the time they wrote what they did about Rostova in the link you gave they were confused as well since they said that many Russian varieties give both beefsteak and heart shaped fruits on the same plant.

That's not been my experience at all.

The information cut and pasted from their other website, and in this thread, is more up to date where they and others are now finding that the original Rostova is a beefsteak, as was known, and the imposter is a droopy, wilty oxheart, and they told of how they're going to go back and clean this whole mess up, if they can.

They operate under many different names, the most common being Seedfest and Anioleka and they told in your link why they want to now want to add yet another name to Rougelands.

Carolyn

Then I guess Seedfest is the one to look to in the future for the real Rostova tomato seeds, assuming they really do breed true to the original type. In the meantime, maybe the Imposter will turn out to be a fabulous tomato!

I have been growing Sunset's Red Horizon since about 1994/5,,saving seed as they are amongst the best tasting tomato to my taste ever!! BUT - MY PLANTS ARE POTATO LEAFED and the fruits are rounded ribbed beefsteaks. They do not even have a hint of a point or heart shape. If I ever run out of seed I will be heartily disappointed as these are my favorite tomato. The taste is sublime. The best tomato sammich ever! This one is not as ripe as it will get in a couple of days but I ate the ripe one!! I have never purchased any of the seed available today because of the controversy of it not being this Sunset's Red Horizon. I am not sure where I got them originally, could have been from Sunset Magazine. I will be guarding my seeds for sure as no one seems to have this original beefsteak, potato leaf variety that I love. I have no problem with disease and we are in a short season here 5b/6a NW Montana.

Valerie, maybe you should name it Rostova PL.

Good Idea!

Mine is not but mine is potato leafed and a round beefsteak tomato, not pointy like an oxheart.