"And one by one dropped the revellers in the blood-bedewed halls of their revel, and died each in the despairing posture of his fall. And the life of the ebony clock went out with that of the last of the gay. And the flames of the tripods expired. And Darkness and Decay and the Red Death held illimitable dominion over all."

I haven't been here in a long time and my reply is not as eloquent as eric's unattributed quote, but I agree this forum is dead. I remember years back when I said the same thing, that we should hold a funeral service for this forum, I was surprised that posters and lurkers alike came out of the woodwork to somehow say that what I posted was negative and also that it was MY fault for not posting interesting topics frequently. (Yeah, and I suppose I could have provided the replies to my own posts too, which I have done).

'The Masque of the Red Death' Edgar Allan Poe. That's my final guess.

Two weeks and no response and then some Metallica lyrics. sheesh. Glad you are alive and kicking Eric, well, not glad exactly but you know what I mean.

I have often wondered why this forum is so slow--putting it politely. I have thought perhaps it is because garden writers are in competition with each other for fewer and fewer publishing markets as garden books and magazines with actual text, as opposed to photographs, seek writers. There are so many writers' groups, but not among gardeners it seems.

There have been times when this forum was very much alive. What's funny is the Garden Writers Association had their own forum for a while but dropped it. I know the Georgia Native Plant Society dropped their forum due to bickering. I never saw so many argumentive people in all my life. I was afraid to log on to their forum because the sharks might get me. Ah, but this forum is different. There have been times when we had some good running topics. Then there have been times when you couldn't buy a response.
Let's all brainstorm here: what would be some good topics to start a discussion?
On a different forum some dummy posted a topic and signed it Martha Stewart. You would be surprised how many people fell for that without looking above the post to see the real posters name. Hmmm?

I noticed your name on that post immediately, Eddie. Martha's posting here was too unlikely to consider for a second.

A topic I'd like to see discussed is: Do you have to be a gardener to be a garden writer? There are a lot of people out there actually making money because they are good photographers, or they have names in some other field, or they just plain know how to market themselves--but they don't know squat about gardening. That has long been one of my serious peeves.

Here's another: Is there gender bias in favor of men in hiring garden writers or buying their material? I notice far more women than men engaged in ornamental gardening but newspapers and magazines seem to prefer men as editors and writers for their garden material. Anyone care to comment?

There you go, Eddie. That will keep you busy for a minute or two.

ginny12,
Tell you what, you respond to that Martha post
(anything at all) and I will address the topics you proposed. Deal or no deal?

Deal.

ginny12,
The entire world, not just garden media, is biased in favor of men being the "experts". TV, radio, print - ALL of it is male dominated. But despite all of that, you just have to plug ahead and do what you love and work for what you want and believe in.
CLF

You have to be kidding CLF. the entire world is male dominated, you say. I think we can bring this closer to home and run a poll on who controls the TV remote in your house.

Gardening books are amongst the dullest to read because garden writers are not prepared to take risks. Certain plants favour acidic soil OK? we got it. Then they cling to this amazingly banal knowledge as if someone is going to steal it from them and make 25 bucks. Oh, and they are so busy earning this money that they cannot find the time to connect with other purveyors of the same old stuff in the hope that it can be improved. Pathetic. I wish that I was not so passionate otherwise I would leave you dullards that read this to whimper in silence.

Garden writing is almost impossible in a vacuum.
Even assuming you could write something that was 100 percent correct and covered 100 percent of the variables for one situation (impossible), go a few miles away and it's a totally different story. Or someone who lives in a different area with a different situation gets a hold of it but doesn't know enough to know it's different, or why you've simplified/generalized, and says "what an idiot". You really can't win.

Anyone can talk about the pretty flowers. The happy happy trees. Meaningful garden writing is hard. I really admire people who can do it well.

As for male vs. female writers: I'm a woman. And no stranger to subtle and unsubtle sexism. I get pitches from both men and women all the time. And most of the ones from women make my flesh crawl. (We read the worst of them aloud and gag. I'm NOT saying where I work. But I'm not in book publishing. And yes, I also write.)

Any two may know the same amount about gardening -- or not. But too many of the ones from women are overwritten, loaded with emotional crap -- "calms my senses and nourishes my soul" stuff, or the new trend for "gardening with attitude!!!" (for the record, one exclamation point is always enough, usually more than enough). Then they tell me their (whatever) is "very unique". (My eyes are crossed. If you need to ask why, break all your typing fingers NOW!)

They seem to want me to know them. I don't want to. I want to know their work.
They make the galling presumption that they know me and understand my needs. (Because I'm a woman! And all women are alike!)

They go too far.

The men just say what they planted. It's SUCH a relief. They're good or they're not. They may try to spin me, or they may think I'm an idiot, but overall, it's a simpler relationship.

True. Every man who ever dug a hole feels he's an expert.

But sometimes when people tell you "you should write," they're just being polite.

I'm not saying don't write. Lots of people work as writers. In many fields. Just read a ton of great writing, of all kinds, before you do.

Or at least do a better job of matching your pitch to the publication.

Fair? Maybe yes, maybe no. But it's the job of people like me to reject the vast majority of pitches. And did you notice my screen name? Do I sound like a "people person"?

So at least be judged on your knowledge and the stuff you INTEND to be judged on. At least that you can control.

Oh growlery: I think I love you.

Growlery, I like your no-nonsense approach. I would enjoy sitting down to a cup of coffee with you at a Garden Writer's convention and listen to you rant about what you have to endure from submissions. I think it would be funny and interesting.

It's not only true in writing that there is a natural bias toward men. I was a geek 'debator' in my school years and public speaking has been a big part of my career ever since.

In competitive public speaking, men almost always occupied the top slots. Not because they were better or smarter but because their voices were, generally speaking, easier to listen to. The higher-pitched voices of women tended to turn off listeners if they had to listen for any length of time. Women who did well in competition almost always had a lower-pitched voice. And yes, I have lower pitched voice. I would not be surprised at all to discover that men are also more sought after as speakers on gardening topics for the same reason.

Oh- and I'm not a garden writer nor did I edit my post so if my grammar, spelling or puctuation are off, so be it. Ah, the freedom that comes with being a gardener rather than garden writer! I'm free to mispell misspell without any reprocussions!

Most boards go thru cycles of ups and downs, but that does not mean they are dead. They need a jump start and sometimes new members do that.
I have been absent for a while, dealing with real life - nothing serious just a very busy job or two. Boards need input, and as this thread shows, there are people who pop by every now and then.

As for gender bias - that would make a great topic for another thread.