P.S. here is my prior thread to which majority felt spider mite damage was the cause. The pics in this thread are my other plant nearby.

Here is a link that might be useful: Germ Queen/CP leaves issue

Release green lacewing eggs for a permanent solution. The larva will take care of the mites. Way better, cheaper and easier than constantly spraying poisons and oils.

bigd, thanks for response....are you saying that this, too, looks like spider mite damage (vs mg deficiency or other issue)?

I don't have any lacewings eggs nor have I ever seen a full grown one around here...

Try this. Add 2 tablespoons of seaweed + 1 tablespoon of molasses to a gallon of water. Spray this twice a week until the mites are gone. A pump sprayer lets you get both the top and bottom of the leaves. You can also stick the nozzel inside the plant and spray the inside leaves and stems as well. After they are gone, spray with this mix every two weeks and they will not come back. I wish I had a two gallon sprayer instead of a one gallon sprayer. I spray every two weeks starting two weeks after transplant to the end of the season.

Now, I want to qualify this here: spider mites and aphids likr to attack weak or stressed plants. Problems with these two critters often increase toward the end of the season, as the plants are coming to the end of their life cycle. Make sure your plants are not stressed by being watered too much or too little. I water once a week really well - water really well, just do not water often.

Tom

Yes, looks like mites from previous pics. For the price of a single bottle of poison, about $10, you can order green lacewings by mail. I buy mine from Garden's Alive but there are other sellers cheaper but I have no experience with any other seller other than GA.

You'll always find mites on the UNDERSIDES of leaves. It is impossible to spray every leaf underside if you have tens of thousands of leaves in your garden! That's why contact sprays like Kelthane, oils and other miticides never work, they just cut back the infestation. If you miss just ONE leaf underside with your spray they will return within a week or two in biblical proportions. Sprays are temporay. Beneficial insects work the whole season. A mite can produce a new generation every 5 days in hot weather. Some sprays, like Sevin, actually increase the number of mites! Now systemic poisons will kill mites that's true but you really don't want to use systemics on food crops I would hope.

Let nature take care of your problem and say goodbye to your mites.

"does this, too, from my MLs look like spider mites?"

Why do you believe that it is appropriate to take an opinion poll instead of examine the leaf undersides for mites with magnifying glass?

ditnc: take a white paper plate/or just white paper to your garden. Hold it underneath one of the infected leaves and tap on leaf. If you have mites you'll see small dots running across the paper.

Hey bigdaddy: I have mites for the first time ever this year. Big time. Questions: My garden season will be ending mid-Oct. so is it too late this year to order the lacewings? And, I'm assuming they'll survive the winter?? (the lacewings) if not, when in the spring of 2110 should they be ordered? And....if I don't have mites next year, what are they (lacewings) to eat?
Thanks for putting up with silly questions. Money, for me is very tight, and has to be well spent.
Thanks so much,
Sudzy

Sudzy, Green lacewings are best utilized at the first sign of infestation. The larva will eat any soft bodied insects. They will eat aphids and whiteflies as well as spider mites.

But even at this late stage they would cut back your spider mites in significant numbers. My lacewings don't over winter here very well. I know the mites and aphids usually show up here in mid June when the days start getting really warm. I order my egg cases to arrive first week of June. Mail order places like Garden's Alive will let YOU pick the week they ship. I scatter the eggs throught my garden on wet leaves and I haven't had a mite, aphid or whitefly problem in many years now. TRy and remember when you first detected your mites and place an order to arrive a week or two before that.

To keep the adult lacewings around all season to produce future generations of larve plant a little dill, sweet alyssum or members of the daisy family. Or you can buy organic bug foods that beneficials love. I plant dill and see the adults there alot.

It's also important to control ants if you have lots of ant nests. Ants will eat green lacewing eggs.

Best of Luck

bigdaddyj:

Thanks so much for the valuable information regarding lacewings. Taking all your replies in this thread amounts to a treatise on lacewing management for mite, aphid and white fly control.

I'm forunate to have an indigenous green lacewing population in my small backyard orchard/garden. Someone must have released them in the neighborhood years ago. I have no problems with mites, aphids, (one exception) or white fly. The exception is the plum leaf curl aphid. When these little ^$#@ feed on plum or pluot leaves, the leaves curl up into a tight cylinder creating an impenetrable safehouse for them inside. Neither human sprays nor, apparently, lacewings can get at them or their eggs.

But I found that Dr. Bonner's liquid soap sprayed during the dormant season gets their over-wintering eggs on the twigs and branches. (All leaves have fallen). This year, for the first time I have no problems with plum leaf curl aphid. The picture is from last year's attack.

I'm in So. Calif. so the lacewings can manage the mild winter I suppose. I can handle the tradeoff: indigenous lacewings for indigenous earthquakes. There still is no such thing as a free lunch.

Tony

Tony, Congrats on your discovery that dormant oil treatments can whack your special aphids to hades! LOL It's special when we can balance the frustrations in our lives with the positives. OK, now my turn, I'll just be happy that I don't have to deal with earthquakes here and I'll accept my winter vacioning lacewings. For all I know mine are winter sunning themselves at your place...:)

"For the price of a single bottle of poison, about $10, you can order green lacewings by mail."

What prevents them from flying away?

"You'll always find mites on the UNDERSIDES of leaves. It is impossible to spray every leaf underside if you have tens of thousands of leaves in your garden!"

There is a pheromone additive, Stirrup M, which when added to miticide sprays, attracts mites to the residue on plants.

"What prevents them from flying away?"

Eggs and larva can't fly. They are happy to be born into a world where there are aphids/mites etc already there for them to munch on. If you meant, what keeps the eventual adults around I already posted a number of plants that make great hosts and there are also many beneficial bug food/lures that will keep the adults around to make more generations of larve. A quick Google will display many beneficial bug lures/foods but I haven't needed anything besides the dill and a few flowers. I know that lacewings have worked here for many years.

Does this stirrup m product actually work? Have you tested it yourself? What does it cost? And how much for the poison, I mean miticide, that you are adding the Stirrup to?

I have seen a huge amount of mites and egg masses on just a single tomato leaf under a magnifying glass. Your spray with the added stirrup m better get those guys too.

The point is, it's so much easier and cheaper to get rid of these pests the natural way without spraying poisons every couple weeks. At least it seems that way to me.

bigdaddyj et al, thanks for the advice. I have tried murphy's oil soap, seaweed with molasses, espsom salts diluted (in case it's a magnesium deficiency) and finally yesterday Safer Insectisidal Soap.

But I lost my GQ (couldn't find lacewings locally, have to mail order). I can't see mites with a 5x magnifier (too distorted) nor with a 2x. Nothing falls off when I shake leaves over white paper. But I think it is mites, as I have seen a little webbing, and I do see a few minutely tiny red spots. (Can all of you see these mites except me? What magnification strength do you use?)

I don't think I have time to save my cherokee purple either, but have enough healthy foliage on my ML and think if it's mites i can save it if mail order is fast. I will order them tomorrow at my local nursery ($19.99 icluding shipping) and hope they ship quickly.

Can I assume the mites will die if in the soil, in other words, can I reuse the container soil or is it contaminated for the next season?

Thanks again for the help!
Diane

Does this stirrup m product actually work? Have you tested it yourself? What does it cost? And how much for the poison, I mean miticide, that you are adding the Stirrup to?

I have just received my first order of Stirrup M and have not tested it yet. It cost me $23.95 plus $5.95 P&H for 8 oz. The dilution rate is 6 oz/100 gal or 0.36 tsp/gal. I won't tell you the name of the miticide that I add it to because I am using it illegally and have so for many years without problem. I bet a lot of other people do the same.

I can't see mites with a 5x magnifier (too distorted) nor with a 2x.

When I was young with 20-20 vision, I could easily see mites without a magnifying glass. Now, I need a magnifying glass.

And how much for the poison, I mean miticide, that you are adding the Stirrup to?

About $90/8 oz, which, at a dilution rate of 0.25 tsp/gal, is enough to last me for over 10 years.

struwwelpeter I know Avid is used a great deal on farms but it's really expensive for home use. The home gardeners I know used Kelthane but I think it is banned now unless it contains less than 0.1% DDT. Avid is mucho money and Kelthane fairly cheap. The ortho miticides (Orthotox)I believe are all systemic. These are the ones I'm familiar with.

Diane, I can see mites with the naked eye. A magnifying class is beneficial to see their eggs. The tiny red dots may be the two spotted mite. It is strange that after you tap some infected leaves under a white paper you see no little specs moving around? I'd look at some mite webbing pics online to see if they match yours.

I never use the same potting soil again. If you insist on reusing yours I would suggest a Safer's hort oil drench to kill any possible eggs.

struwwelpeter I know Avid is used a great deal on farms but it's really expensive for home use.

No, Agri-Mek, which has exactly the same ingredients as Avid, is used on farms and a license is needed. It is illegal to use Avid on food crops. (I suspect that Liberals and Conservatives may have a different take on that.)

In my experience, Avid has a shelf life of over 10 years and it is a good investment for a gardener that has a mite problem every year.