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jackfre

mini-split Achilles heel

12 years ago

Anyone who has read any of my posts knows what a fan I am of mini-splits. I heat and cool my home with them and recommend them to everyone. BUT! I have had one system in the living room doing heating and cooling for 3+ years. I have been steady in cleaning the filters and vacuuming the face of the coil. At least the part i can reach, which isn't much of it. In our ongoing remodel my GC accidentally cut one of the refrigerant lines on this system. As the charge was dumped and with the opening of the floor plan I wanted to re-locate the interior unit anyway, so I pulled the evaporator off the wall. I'm in the business and am embarrassed to say it but I could not believe how dirty the unit was, once I could get at it to see. I had recognized that the systems performance was falling off over the last year or so. Slightly, but declining none the less.

I broke the unit down and thoroughly cleaned the fan and coil. I used some a pump sprayer with NuCalgon Evap Power C coil cleaner. It did a good job on the coils. The evaporator is in pieces,but it is as clan as a whistle. Once I get this one re-installed, which will be a few weeks as we are residing/windows on the side of the house the condensers are located on, I will then go after the other three evaps in place. That is going to require some heavy plastic on the walls running into a trash can. I will spray the coil cleaner and then spray water on it. The water will either go down the units drain or down the plastic into the can. Cleaning the fan will be tedious, but very necessary.

My point is that you do not want to delay cleanings on these units. They are great equipment but must be maintained...just like all equipment!

Comments (19)

  • 12 years ago

    40 lashes on your back with 5/8ths line insulation for not having better filters. Since central systems out number minis , for now my comments are related to central. AC filters are not well enough understood or made provisions for in the trade. You might have noticed how much I stress attention to filteration when discussing poor preformance or giving tips on new installs. Three elements must be addressed and overlooking one will cost owner in comfort and $$$ for the intire life of the unit. Ample size,perfect fit and quility filters. Any property I own plus clients who ask my advice have the largest filter housing installed that space allows. I insist the filter fits tight, be easily accessiable and simple to change. I have asked many factory reps why they desighn air handlers that require custom sized filters and a mechanical engineer to change them. Not one has offered a reasonable explaination. If technicians and manufactures were doing their job,woven polyester filters would displace fiberglass at little increase in cost. I advocate pleated filters but if one choses to buy the cheapest available,it needs to be at minium poly.
    Well I could go on and on but getting back to the mini-splits.
    I am in full agreement,mini-splits ROCK. I havn't settled on best pratice for minis yet but due to price of replacements and difficulty of cleaning ,I am working on it.

  • 12 years ago

    Jackfre, what brand do you run? I've seen a complaint about a problem with Mitsubishis of that vintage having air bypassing the filter.

  • 12 years ago

    Klem, I was the Purolator rep for 25 yrs. With the move to the MERV ratings a consumer, or contractor, can make an informed decision, If they understand the system and all the parts are clean. If I was in the contracting business today I would make a mini-split division, get really good at them and market the heck out of them. Small trucks, small tools, small crews. There is money to be made there.

    Ionized, I represented Fujitsu and have stuck with that brand. Really, the filters on all mini-splits are a joke. In order to get a quiet unit they have very low static fans and cannot pull or push through a heavier filter. I called my friends at Fujitsu Tech and they said clean the units thoroughly twice a year. I'm going to get a program going on mine. Should all ready have had it, but...

  • 12 years ago

    Jackfre, My Mitsubishi manuals do not have any cleaning schedule in the owner or service manuals that goes beyond cleaning the filters. They should.

    How do you plan to handle your assemblies still on the walls to get to the blowers and whatnot? Will you partially disassemble or are you going to try to reach past what ever is in the way?

    Can you suggest some good vacuum attachments? I have not found anything that I like for the indoor coils. I've tried to find a Mitsubishi item, MAC-093SS-E with no success. It seems that they have it everywhere but in North America. I've thought about ordering it from an offshore distributor.

  • 12 years ago

    ionized,I think you could cobble up a better kit than that. The real solution is to prevent dirt entering the coils. There must be an hvac industry conspiracy to desighn units so that poor filteration limits the life of equipment. Good filteration for central and pak units is simple and cheap to retrofit but mini-splits are limited by lack space to work with.
    IMO,increasing physical size to accomendate additional sq inches of media would go a long way. A larger filter could be more effecient without restricting air flow. The evap doesn't use floor space and front panels ready to paint or switch like dishwashers would make them less noticable. If gearheads have a problem with this emagine what the general comsumer is up against.

  • 12 years ago

    "ionized,I think you could cobble up a better kit than that."

    So far, no. High quality brushes that don't leave more debris than they pick up are scarce. In order to get over the top of the coil that is close to the ceiling, you need a low-profile, flat brush.

  • 12 years ago

    Recommendations from Gree for their ductless splits:

    1) Clean primary air filter every 3 months.
    2) Clean photocatalytic filter every 2 weeks. (Seems like a lot!)

    There's more details here on page 23: http://www.greecomfort.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Terra-HP-Owners-Manual.pdf

  • 12 years ago

    Apparently, they are supposed to stay clean except for the filters.

  • 12 years ago

    It is unrealistic to expect them to stay clean. I have been living in a total re-model for the past 15 mos, with 6 mos off over the winter, so my ambient conditions are substantially worse than most. As well, we are about a dust bowl here.

    I am going to use some 5-6 mil plastic sheeting all around the evaporator.. I will remove the plastic cover on the unit. I will spray the coil with the 3:1 dilute NuCalgon evaporator coil cleaner. They say it doesn't require water washing down. On the next one I will try their method. To clean the back (wall side) of the coil, I'll spray the heck out of it and use an inspection mirror and a fiber optic scope I have to observe. I will likely wash it to make sure the drain is not plugged up. Excess water will be caught by the plastic and run into the trash can down below. The fan will be tedious. A combination of small stiff and soft thin paint brushes and long q-tips. I will probably use some of the metal handles "flux brushes" plumbers use. I think they will work well. The fan has to be really clean on the curved fin portion as well as the lip. It has to be uniformly clean or it will become out of balance and need a new fan. I may pick up a new fan and simply figure out how to change the fan out and clean the dirty one while it is in hand. It may do a better job and save time and money. I'm going to do my own, but this would probably be a good idea if paying someone to do it.

    I made much of the fact, while Fujitsu's rep, that the Evaps could be placed within 2" of the ceiling. That is all good on the sale and install, but could be a real pitn on service.

    Having a "better" filter would make the units really announce their presence. They are small, quiet and efficient. We...I, need to take better care of my equipment.

    Ion, it is going to take me a while to get this done, but I'll keep you posted.

  • 12 years ago

    Lots of videos on youtube with some showing a bib to catch the solvent/cleaner.

  • 12 years ago

    an alternative to the spray solution/plastic bag method

    1. purchase a hepa filter machine for the home. The air you breathe will be healthier and the mini split stays cleaner for longer

    2. use an air compressor and long nozzle attachment to service the blower wheel and evaporator

    nozzle attachment:

    http://www.amazon.com/Air-Blow-Gun-Kit/dp/B000FVUO4G/ref=sr_1_5/177-4881377-8262245?ie=UTF8&qid=1410384754&sr=8-5&keywords=Air+Compressor+Nozzle

    Here is a link that might be useful: Nozzle kit

  • 12 years ago

    I have watched all of those youtube videos--found them this spring. Apparently in other countries (Asian ones, primarily), it is very common to do routine spray with water cleaning of these ductless units... So, why don't they tell us how?!

    I've had a dual-ductless system for about 6 yrs and never cleaned it (just filters). I *want* to clean it, but am too chicken. I've watched those youtubes, and say to myself, self, you can do that! But, then, when I get to trying to find a product, I am not sure how to pick one (will it be safe with the electronic components? What about the aluminum fins? What if I don't get it all the way washed off? Will it continue to corrode the fins until some future cleaning?

    And, so, I still haven't cleaned them. Add that I am chicken about ruining my drywall walls, and it hasn't happened.

    I, for one, would be truly grateful to see an "expert" do this on GW, and post up step by step instructions. There are no professionals in my area who do mini-split maintenance of the fins/cleaning...

  • 12 years ago

    I went back to the HVAC supply house the other day to talk "coil cleaners". The NuCalgon cleaner I referenced above is the one to use. They also have one that is listed with "Bright" in the name. Stay away from those as they are etching coils and with the micro fins we have on these units that would not be good. The NuC material I used did an excellent job on the coil but I did use water to wash it down. The directions say that is not necessary. I ran the water more to ensure the drain was clean as anything else.

  • 12 years ago

    Lots of wisdom in that post jackfire. Millions in damage is done(most of it by service techs) to evap coils using condenser cleaners. Rinsing coils with water is also wise eventhough the instructions say it's unnessary. Besides the drain issue,mini split air velocity isn't high enough to do a good job dislodging lint stuck between fins.
    brice,stand alone filtering would be a good investment for average homeowners. You can buy a nice one for less than jackfire has to charge to send a small tech with small tools in a small truck for annual cleaning. (jack I'm not sure if that's a plug for your business or an attempt to undermine it).
    All this is good to know but imo what jack said at the begaining about need for specialized service is profound. If one of the mfgrs sent their experts to the USA to get out front orginizing a network,the possibilities are limitless. Not to chase rabbits but to make a point about product success. There has never been a remarkably successful product or service where the employees manufacturing and selling it wasn't convinced it was the very best available. Harley Davidson comes to mind. Were it not for employee dedication there is little reason why they wern't belly up years ago. How did that happen? Simple,the investors LISTENED to the consumer then went to the employee for answers and advice. Where does your employeer turn to for advise,consultants and survey takers? I put it to you,who in their right mind is going to buy a mini splt from contractors that don't even like them? (Present company excepted). For your rainy day reading pleasure I suggest the thread here intitled "Why is split ductless so expensive when installed") More than 2 years with over 100 replies and not dead yet. There is plenty interest despite the surly attitude of most contractors which is evidenced in the responses.

  • 12 years ago

    Klem1, thanks for trying to boost the business, but I sold my rep business 3 years ago and am out of the mini split business other than a promoter of the technology and a user of same. I was the Fujitsu rep in the 6 New England States for 12 years and really enjoyed growing the market. When the crash hit in '08 mini splits were the only category of products in the whole industry that grew through out the crisis.

    I put this thread out there as an "eyes open" type thing so people are aware going in that service will be required. I think my units were beaten on pretty well as we have been living through a remodel for pastt 15 months.

  • 12 years ago

    glad you took the time to post & share the details.
    thanks!

    that thread referenced above is a gas!

  • 10 years ago

    I bought a SpeedClean bag. I am reasonably happy with it so far. I took apart one of my Mitsubishi high wall appliances. Off came the main cover and louvers. Removing three screws on the left and the set screw on the squirrel cage allowed pretty easy removal of the cage just like in the vid. There are three tabs and some tugging and pulling to remove the condensate tray. I removed the horizontal vane motor as well as it looked like it would be easier to get it out of the way than to maneuver around it. Two little screws and it can be pulled out of the say and taped to the side of the unit to preclude undue stress on the wire bundle.

    The tray and cage were pretty nasty as were the surfaces around the cage where soggy stuff was flung. That includes the safety cages around the vertical louvers. As Jackfree noted, it is pretty groady in there. I knew it would be because I had looked at the blower cage with a flashlight.

    Cleaning the cage was super easy and much more thorough out in the driveway. I vacuumed it off. Still looked bad. I don't know if that step was worth the trouble. I soaked everything in neutral detergent after hosing off with a typical garden hose-end sprayer. After spraying, soaking and spraying, the cage looked like new. I cleaned the main case, louvers and condensate tray with a soft brush in the same detergent. I gave everything a 10-minute treatment in diluted bleach, rinsed, dried them off with a soft rag and left them in the sun for an hour while I made and had lunch.

    Indoors, on went the bag. I cleaned the coil with $self rinsing foaming spray cleaner$ where stuff was visibly stuck between the fins. It took repeated applications. Some gunk came out but some never came out. Rinse and rinse. I cleaned the rest with Evap Power C that was the choice at the local supplier that sells to the public. Rinse and rinse. Why cut corners when I've gotten this far into it!

    Reinstallation of the blower cage was easy. Reinstallation of the condensate tray took a while. Lining the ends up to the shallow grooves to its sides that they fit into was not easy to figure out and it was not obvious what I should have checked in the fit of before I wiggled it out. The angle of attack on snapping it in is not obvious either. I must have spent a half hour at it, but it seems like hours, of course. The rest was a snap.

    Looking to the future, I have a couple of high wall appliances that are close to the wall on the left so I might not be able to pull the cage out as easily. I think that they will come out underneath and one of them has a big exhaust fan in that wall close to where the trajectory of the cage would naturally go when pulling it out the side. We'll see. Installation location choice should be made with attention to this maneuver. Give 'er about 26 inches on the left if you can!

    Back to the newly cleaned appliance. Now I have to re-set that appliance on the wall because I found that the drain pigtail goes from the right side all the way to the left side within the unit before it enters the wall. Poor drainage plan, I think. Ironically, the day I got everything assembled and ready to start, the appliance to be attended to suddenly started to rain copiously all over the floor underneath it.

    I got into the wall to reroute the pigtail and the hose, but the hole in the wall does not line up perfectly so the pigtail has a fraction of an inch climb before it enters the wall. I want to raise the appliance a little, shift it to the left a little. I have to straighten the mounting plate a little. Due to my ham-fisted handling of it, i bent it a little. I also need to give the whole thing a slight lean to the left so it will drain more completely. Now it has a slight lean to the right. I'll have to figure out how to support it with a ladder, or install some temporary "hooks" in the wall while that is going on. The way the tubing in the wall is chosen and arranged is also suspect and I have not been into the open crawlspace yet to check the hard pipe collectors that lead to surface drains.

  • 10 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Update after cleaning another one over the weekend:

    Getting the squirrel cage out with little clearance to the left is really no problem. The cage can drop down after pulling it to the left just enough to clear the motor shaft. I now believe that the installation instructions cover the required clearance. I really have very little material on the fins. There are little areas, very small, that have some clogging that foaming cleaner will not remove. (Most of the buildup problems are on the blower cage.) With the one that I worked on this weekend, I tried rubbing the bits a little with a q-tip. That seemed to help, but I was far along in the process when I decided to tray that (last rinse. I think that in the next one I tackle, I will try that earlier and work at it a bit.