Only 7, you're doing well.

Could you post a more detailed layout with a grid for measurements etc. From the diagram, your sink looks long and skinny and I'm sure it isn't in reality. Looks like the island layout wasn't done right with the software.

i have attached the floor plan with the grid for better view of things. Yes the island is bit stretched for illustration purposes, there was an island in the software that was only 24 inch deep and I just made id double wide so it stretched the sink.

Where do the doors go at the bottom left and right?

Is the side entry in a vestibule or does it go directly outside? I see you have bumped a pantry out into that area.

If it is a vestibule area I am wondering if the powder room door could be moved into that location.

Not enough room in this kitchen to put everything in there that you want with all of those doors. Something is going to have to give and you're not going to be able to have it all without some significant structural alterations or additions. Are you ready to go there financially vs. giving up some of your wants to better work with the existing space?

We need a better diagram of the whole house to understand traffic flow and where all of the doors go.

Can any of the doors be closed off or relocated?

Can any of the walls come down?

Does it have to be a 36" range?

Where is the dining room in relation to the kitchen and is there any other eating area? 5 seats at an island that isn't big enough to even serve well as the cleanup zone with no seating is beyond pushing the limits.

There may be some solutions that you haven't thought of, but give us a better diagram in order to understand the whole situation.

Just a quick overview. The house is a center colonial.
The bottom right door leads to formal dining room. The bottom left door leads to a hallway. Between the hallway and the dining rooms is the staircase to the top floor. In front of the stair case is the entry to the house.

I will draw the entire first floor so that they flow of the house is layed out. Thank you so much for trying to help!

I have uploaded my whole first floor plan. WE are already moving walls so open to any suggestions on major remodeling. The bathroom in the design is where I envision to be in the new design. Right now it is inside the kitchen, in the corner to the outside wall and the deck.

would appreciate any thoughts that you may have.

Incorporate the post into an overhang for eating. Tweak the entry to the room by shifting it down and use the space that was devoted to it to recess a corner cabinet and a to the counter dish storage "hutch". The fridge's depth is partially hidden by the recess of the fireplace and a floor to ceiling shallow pantry is next to it. The range is on teh back wall as a nice focal point to the family room.

OK.. looking at this I had an idea.It was along with a glass or so of wine so please take this in stride. Take GD's layout except...steal a little space from the bathroom and recess the frig there.I'd put the MW there too. Then put in a corner prep sink where the SS is. Move the range by where you now show the sink. Put the cleanup sink Dw on the bottom run, I really hope this makes sense. I don't have a good program to draw easily. I'd have to see it on paper...but it seems as if it would really give you separate zones lots of function. OH! STORAGE!!Oh the left where the 12" pantry is... do it the entire wall floor to ceiling. Several of our posters did that and have spectacular kitchens. Especially when they painted them a different color. If I could have that, all small appliances would be off the counter. I'd even have outlets builted in to some could be used in place or on litte pullout boards. The more I"m typing the more I"m loving this idea so I'll stop now.

Thank you for your ideas redmodelfla and Green designs. I like what you have done but not sure I can close off my side entry and expand on the outside because that would make me enter inside the family room and also decrease the driveway space I have in that area where the new side entry will be.

Can you look at the designs below and let me know what you think. Which one creates good flow? Anything you can suggest changing on either one? I like the second design because sitting is inside the kitchen, whereas wife likes the first design since she would be looking at the family room and outside when being by the sink.

On the first design I am wondering if making the overhang a curve throughout it that would add some more sitting space for comfort.
In design 2 I may have to put the trash facing the family room which is not ideal. I would also love to put the microwave in the island in either design but does not look like there is any space. May have to go on the bottom on one side of the range.

Design 1

Here is a clean layout of my kitchen.

Twix, getting enough work counter in the right place is a problem however I approach this. Nothing is satisfying, especially considering the large investment.

How about considering this: Close off the front hall door to the kitchen AND create a new doorway from the back of the living room to the kitchen/FRM area. The front hall opens to the dining room and living room, so this would create a nice circular flow around your home and probably significantly enhance the use of your living room. If no pipes were in the way, you'd have a tremendous return for very little money. Among the gains would be:

Enhanced privacy for the family spaces in the back of the house from the front door.

Another closet and enhanced identity for your foyer (no longer mainly the beginning of a conduit back).

Again, a nice circular flow through your living room, no longer a dead end, but connecting directly with the family/kitchen area.

Finally, and not least of course, this'd give you a whole new ball game in the kitchen area, with that whole side of the current fridge wall available, almost 4' extra to work with where you need it, and no traffic concerns.

As a basic design consideration, the range doesn't belong in the alcove. It belongs on the back wall as a focal point and the fridge belongs in the alcove. It hides it's depth, and it places it on the perimeter of the kitchen so that it can be accessed by others without routing them straight through your prep zone. Placing the fridge on the back wall and the range on the alcove keeps every bit of traffic in and out of the kitchen right in your way.

That only leaves the sink to be able to fuss around with placement, and that too is confined by the location of the plumbing chase.

Have you considered flipping the family room with the kitchen and make it an eat-in kitchen with the current kitchen serving as dining, and moving the family space to the current dining room?

rosie

interesting thoughts on opening to the living room. We have thought about that configuration. We are worried that that configuration will affect the typical layout of our colonial house. The formality of the living room would be lost. Plus, there is a chase on that wall :). If the fireplace was not there then it would have been a nice L area.

GReenDesign

I agree that the natural place for the fridge is in the alcove. That is where it is now. here are few thoughts why we are thinking the current configuration is better.

1.Venting. If the range is in the alcove then only 3 ft away is the external wall where the range can be vented.
2. Natural light. There will be a window where the run on cabinets ends. IT might be a small 20 inch one, but still will provide some natural light to cooking during daylight.
3. Having the fridge where it is in the layout would also have us put the beverage center near the formal dinning room, so for entertaining it would be very close by.

If we switch the fridge and the range then can the range be vented in a chimney flue that is not used?

At this point we are considering moving the chase so that there will be a wide opening, and then maybe the sitting can be on both sides of the island [to the family room and to the side entry].

Thoughts?

I agree with Rosie. Closing off the hall door would give you an L-shaped space, with the island and less traffic, through your work area. If you put a doorway into the living room, put it at the end or the L-shape perimeter, in the kitchen.

Then, I'd put fridge and microwave in the alcove, with the range on the back wall (as suggested by GreenDesigns) and I'd add a prep sink, in the new corner (where the hall door used to be). Then, your main sink, dishwasher and trash can go on the island with your seating area. Can you arrange the stools so that they're not backing up into your work area? That would be better, too, IMHO :)

As for the formality of the living room, I don't think that will be a problem, if you put the doorway at the end of the fireplace wall. Don't you have a doorway, from the entry, on the other end of the fireplace wall, as well?

OK, coming to this thread from the other one where you ask about how to get cabinet pricing.

Don't like the range in the alcove at all. That puts a main traffic path right through the danger zone of hot food. Agree with GD that the fridge belongs there and the range on the back wall.

What to do with the sink....hmmmm... I don't like the smaller island with the cleanup sink on it. There's not enough room for a good prep zone and it lacks a good separation between prep and cleanup that more room would give you. I like the peninsula that GD did, but if you can't rework the side entry, then I agree with possibly closing off the doorway.

Have you investigated moving the plumbing chase? Have some master plumbers come in and give you an estimate. Even if you have to enclose it in a bit of a chase by the entry there, just getting it out of the middle of the room would free up some possibilities. I'd say maybe 2-3K for moving it around here would be a going rate. But, that could make all of the difference in how you lay the space out.

Thank you guys for your feedback. I am scratching my head, staring at these drawings, re-measuring things on a daily basis. Just can not come up with the right layout.

Few comments:

1. If I move the entry to incorporate the chase in the peninsula then on a daily basis I would be coming in straight into the family room. Also, the side entry is not full heigh because at one point there was a second staircase going upstairs from the bathroom area on the first floor. So by closing in the entry I can not get a good L shape corner there.

2. I am considering moving the chase. I am also estimating the cost to be $2-3k so it is not a problem. The bigger problem is if the chase is also a support column to two load bearing walls that intersect at that point. In the current layout, which you can not see form these drawings, there is a hallway from the side entry (wall is paralle to the wall of the door on the bathroom.

3. Assuming the chase can not be moved then moving the fridge to the alcove makes sence. I like that idea. Few questions. If it is where GreenDesign put it then how would the doors open? The side wall is 40 inches deep. Would I have to pull the fridge up forward in order to be able to open it (it is french door style). Maybe keep it in the alcove, but next to the fireplace (that is where it is today) since that recess is 21 inches.

So if I keep design 1 layout of the island, then I would switch the DW to to be on the right side of the sink and then the sitting of the chairs would be paralle to the alcove and to the family room. More than 4 people can sit in that area. May have to redesign this layout and post if it is had to follow.

In this layout the range will be closer to the pantry. Yey!

I did a quick cut and paste with the idea of reversing the function of the two rooms. I do think it could work, but the biggest sticking point in the your whole space is the sticking point here. You just aren't going to be able to get seating for 4 into it without giving up some of your other wants. If you did manage to move the plumbing chase into the wall on the right here, that would give you the room to pull the peninsula back enough to be able to get your seats in. But without moving the chase, you might as well give up seating at all. It's just too crowded to the door and passageway no matter how you work an island or peninsula.

Reversing the function of the two rooms would solve some of the layout problems. Given that my family room is 20x15 I can have small breakfast table in the kitchen next to the sliding doors and decrease the peninsula length to avoid bit of congestion going in and out of the kitchen. But few questions I have with that layout.

1. Would in it be weird to go through the family room to get to the kitchen?
2. The kitchen now is so far from the formal dining, so for entertaining it would be challenging bringing food back and forth.

Based on all the feedback received I have revised the ayout and put the fridge in the alcove and the range as a focal point to the family room.

The only thing I need to find place for is the microwave.

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