It sounds like you want a more functional kitchen with more work space. But, you cannot make the kitchen bigger and cannot move the sink. So, some questions...

• Can you move the range?

• Are you willing to switch to a MW or MW drawer instead of an OTR MW? (allows more people to work in the kitchen if you separate them...plus it's safer)

• Check your local Code, I'm not sure 9" b/w a doorway & range will meet Code. You may need a minimum of 12"

• Do you need the peninsula?

• Why does the sink stay where it is? Cost? Prefer a window over the sink? I'm asking b/c one of the things that makes your kitchen crowded is the proximity of the sink and cooktop...they're too close.

  So, if cost, do you have a basement under the kitchen? If so, it's not that expensive to move plumbing. If you're on a slab, it does cost more.

  If it's b/c you want it under a window, why? View while working? If so, studies have shown that 70% of the work done in the kitchen is prep, 20% cleaning up, and 10% cooking. So if you want a "view" while

  working, it makes more sense to have your Prep Zone under the sink than the sink.

It sounds like you want a more functional kitchen with more work space. But, you cannot make the kitchen bigger and cannot move the sink. So, some questions...

• Can you move the range?

• Are you willing to switch to a MW or MW drawer instead of an OTR MW? (allows more people to work in the kitchen if you separate them...plus it's safer)

• Check your local Code, I'm not sure 9" b/w a doorway & range will meet Code. You may need a minimum of 12"

• Do you need the peninsula?

• Why does the sink stay where it is? Cost? Prefer a window over the sink? I'm asking b/c one of the things that makes your kitchen crowded is the proximity of the sink and cooktop...they're too close.

  So, if cost, do you have a basement under the kitchen? If so, it's not that expensive to move plumbing. If you're on a slab, it does cost more.

  If it's b/c you want it under a window, why? View while working? If so, studies have shown that 70% of the work done in the kitchen is prep, 20% cleaning up, and 10% cooking. So if you want a "view" while

  working, it makes more sense to have your Prep Zone under the sink than the sink.

It sounds like you want a more functional kitchen with more work space. But, you cannot make the kitchen bigger and cannot move the sink. So, some questions...

• Can you move the range?

• Are you willing to switch to a MW or MW drawer instead of an OTR MW? (allows more people to work in the kitchen if you separate them...plus it's safer)

• Check your local Code, I'm not sure 9" b/w a doorway & range will meet Code. You may need a minimum of 12"

• Do you need the peninsula?

• Why does the sink stay where it is? Cost? Prefer a window over the sink? I'm asking b/c one of the things that makes your kitchen crowded is the proximity of the sink and cooktop...they're too close.

  So, if cost, do you have a basement under the kitchen? If so, it's not that expensive to move plumbing. If you're on a slab, it does cost more.

  If it's b/c you want it under a window, why? View while working? If so, studies have shown that 70% of the work done in the kitchen is prep, 20% cleaning up, and 10% cooking. So if you want a "view" while

  working, it makes more sense to have your Prep Zone under the sink than the sink.

It sounds like you want a more functional kitchen with more work space. But, you cannot make the kitchen bigger and cannot move the sink. So, some questions...

• Can you move the range?

• Are you willing to switch to a MW or MW drawer instead of an OTR MW? (allows more people to work in the kitchen if you separate them...plus it's safer)

• Check your local Code, I'm not sure 9" b/w a doorway & range will meet Code. You may need a minimum of 12"

• Do you need the peninsula?

• Why does the sink stay where it is? Cost? Prefer a window over the sink? I'm asking b/c one of the things that makes your kitchen crowded is the proximity of the sink and cooktop...they're too close.

  So, if cost, do you have a basement under the kitchen? If so, it's not that expensive to move plumbing. If you're on a slab, it does cost more.

  If it's b/c you want it under a window, why? View while working? If so, studies have shown that 70% of the work done in the kitchen is prep, 20% cleaning up, and 10% cooking. So if you want a "view" while

  working, it makes more sense to have your Prep Zone under the sink than the sink.

It might be helpful if you let everyone know the reasons you want to make changes.

Oh, and BTW, you probably will not get copies of follow-ups emailed to you b/c you have the email option turned off in your profile. See the "Read Me" thread and look for the post titled "Getting Emails Sent To You...3-step Process".

Here is a link that might be useful: Read Me If You're New To GW Kitchens!

No possibility of moving the sink?

Will the additional workspace by the fridge be that advantageous to you? You gain 15" there, but lose the convenience of wall ovens and the storage under your cooktop. Doesn't seem to be a great trade to me, but I'm not trying to be negative, just wondering how you're seeing this.

I have a couple ideas to try and will get back here later if they prove to have any promise.

Thanks for your responses! I'll try to answer all your questions:

Can you move the range? Yes

Are you willing to switch to a MW or MW drawer instead of an OTR MW? Yes! My older kids do use the microwave a lot!

Check your local Code, I'm not sure 9" b/w a doorway & range will meet Code. You may need a minimum of 12" Not sure about the code. Will have to check on this. Thanks for the heads up!

Do you need the peninsula? I don't necessarily need a peninsula, but I do need the counter space. I do spend a lot of time at the peninsula.

Why does the sink stay where it is? My reasons were for cost. We do have a basement so if it's not too expensive it could be moved. I'd love to do my prep in front of a window!

Will the additional workspace by the fridge be that advantageous to you? I guess it's more than just getting more workspace. I don't like the current area between the fridge and ovens. It's too confining and winds up being a dumping ground! I also don't like where the fridge is. It completely blocks traffic when someone's accessing it. If it's moved down like in the proposed layout you could at least get around it while someone's accessing it.

One other thing - we're planning on enlarging the window in the eating area.

Hi Jan, I have a similar layout except it's smaller, 10 x 18. Your family of 6 likely uses the refrigerator a lot. Mine is a bottleneck. One thing I am planning is for an undercounter refrig, not beverage center or wine chiller or dorm frig, but a small keep cold frg. I am putting it under the counter, under the peninsula, in the corner. It will face the eating area so drinks, soda, juice boxes, yogurts, overflow from main, can be here---and traffic to it will not disturb the cook/sink area.

You could also put an undercounter frig in the pantry area. They are not too bad on the budget and can be a great supplement to the 'always too small' main fridge.

I am a real zealot about layout, and I like yours. I would like to cook in this kitchen. The only exception is that I would urge you to move the microwave to somewhere safer and more convenient. I know it's hard to give up countertop space, but that level is the best. Make sure there is some landing space next to or right across from it.

I have to disagree with Buehl regarding the proximity of the sink and the stove. I think it's essential that they be close, for both safety and convenience. Other than unnecessary eating bars (don't get me started on those!), too much distance between the stove and the sink is my main complaint about bad layouts.

This is different than you have in mind, but the above plans seem pretty tight to accommodate the traffic and number of kitchen workers you must have in your kitchen, and the problems of which will increase as the kids get older and bodies get bigger and there are bigger friends around. :-)

This plan tucks the stove back out of the traffic and gives it its own work area. The cleanup area is separate and close to the eating areas. The ample dish storage is handy to the eating areas and not blocked by the dishwasher. The fridge is handy to everyone. The area by the fridge can be a snack zone, baking area, etc. You lose the pantry, but gain lots of uppers and more workspace and more walking space.

Mostly, just room for all of those bodies to be around each other without being on top of each other:

Gellchom...It depends on

(1) The "type" of sink (prep-only or prep + cleanup)
.... and
(2) Is it a one-person kitchen and always will be (that same one person does all the prepping, cooking, and cleaning up) . OR . is it a multi-person kitchen.

In the proposed layout, the OP only has one sink for both prep & cleanup and has only 21" of prep space b/w the range & sink. That space is the most useful and logical place for the prep zone...near a water source + near the range. It's really too small for a one- or multi-person kitchen.

I had 24" b/w my sink & range in my old kitchen and it drove me absolutely crazy!!!! It was one of the two top reasons for remodeling (cabinets falling apart...other #1 reason). It was so frustrating that I avoided cooking as much as possible. And that was before my children started helping in the kitchen!

I now have approx 42" b/w my prep sink and cooktop and it is absolutely heaven! I enjoy working in the kitchen now and sometimes look for something to make! My children can help me make dinner or cleanup the kitchen and there's plenty of room for all of us (2 adults + 2 kids). The main part of my kitchen is approx 15'x10'6" and b/c of the setup I can have 16 people working in it (I know, I had 16 12-year old Girl Scouts working in it at one time while working on their Cooking badge!)

If you check the NKBA, they recommend
Minimum of 36" for prep space
Minimum of 24" on one side, 18" on the other side for a sink
Minimum of 12" on one side & 15" on other side of a range/cooktop
When combining spaces, they recommend you take the longest and add 12"

So, even if you take the minimums, combining the sink + range (not even counting prep space), you need a minimum of 12" + 18" = 30" and the 21" doesn't meet that (or take 12" + 24" = 36"). Now add to it the fact that the prep space is b/w them and that there's no landing/work space on one side of the range (9" isn't enough for either), and more is needed. That 21" isn't going to cut it.

I only have two things to add:

A range is deeper than a cooktop. A range is usually 28-30" deep. If you change to a range, the corner cabinet will be inacessible.

I like rhome's, except I'd move the oven underneath the micro so it didn't block the kid flight-path.

Good point, Bmore. I didn't think to move the oven from its original spot (which I wasn't crazy about), but I agree that under the microwave would be much better. That's why it so often takes a forum full of brains to make layouts work just right! ;-)

Thanks for all the input!
Rhome - I like your layout and thanks for putting it together. Unfortunately, there's not enough room to put the table in that corner. It's less than 5x5.

bmore - The corner cabinet would be a blind corner cabinet with pull outs. Here's a link to a kitchen that has the range in the same place as my proposed layout.
98% finished non-white kitchen

I'm all for a better layout if it can be done! It's a tough kitchen with all the different doorways to other rooms!

Just to clarify: I understood that corner was approx 5 ft in each direction, and didn't intend that you could fit the table you're using now...Instead I drew a built-in banquette that would fit easier than a table with chairs all the way around. Probably wouldn't want to seat 6 for dinner, but could be useful casual seating for the kids, and even provides an additional work surface for your helpers.