Hi,

I am having a pool built and went through the exact same decision. We ended up buying 4 foot aluminium fence from a local supplier and my husband will be installing it himself. Although, my pool is toward the back of my property and I only need to install it to the property line fence (6 foot wood) rather than all they way around the pool.

I think the aluminium is nice looking especially when you mulch and garden around it.

The advantage of the removable fence is that you can easily open your yard back up for special kid free parties. However, I still decided to go for the permanent aluminium, I like the look better.

Hi ducter:

I put in 300' of Delgard 5' aluminum fence from fencecity at my current residence. So I totally have the fence installation technique down. I would most likely just order the fence from fencecity.com again as they were helpful and cheap. Although I'm unlikely to come in at their minimum order size for free shipping. I'm looking at their 4' Aero Sentry from Delgard which pencils out at around $20/ft when you are done with everything.

As for removing the fence. The panels would be totally re-usable. The posts would not be. You don't want to be digging them out of the ground, you just cut them off at the concrete with a cutting blade on your drill driver. So you want to make sure when you install the fence that the concrete is a couple inches below the ground level so you can throw a shovel full of dirt on top of the hole when the post is removed.

There is a point to ordering the BOCA compliant fence rather than just any old aluminum fence even if you are in a jurisdiction with no pool fence codes, because the BOCA fences are designed to be harder to climb. Something about a minimum of 4' between horizontal rails. Personally I would think that the picket style fences with points on the tips would be more difficult to climb than fences with a solid top rail but what do I know.

I did learn one neat fence installation trick from my brother who is a carpenter. Instead of using duct tape to attach the braces to the posts that are in wet concrete as is shown in the Delgard instructions, buy a bunch of cheap pistol grip clamps like the ones I link to below. Then buy a dozen cheap 1x2 furring strips for braces. Jam the bracing strips into the ground and then use the pistol grip clamps to attach the braces to the posts so you can then easily micro-adjust the post position with a level for plumbness using the clamps.

Last time I installed a fence I was diligent about mixing concrete in a wheelbarrow before pouring into the holes. This time I think I'll just dump the dry sacks of concrete into each hole and pour some water into it. The concrete work doesn't need to be perfect and the concrete will set up just fine.

Here is a link that might be useful: cheap pistol grip clamps

any more tips on installing? I am going to get started soon and I am wondering what is the best way. Start with the gate posts? Dig all holes at once and then install the fence and align everything, cement in and then tighten all screws? They didnt give me great install directions? Is there and easy way to make sure that all sections are level with each other and straight?

You had said that you wouldn't need the fence in a few years but I disagree. There are always going to be neighborhood kids and friends and family's friends. I have a friend whose kids are older. The youngest was a young teenager when they built the pool and some were at college. They didn't get a fence and she really regrets not having one. When her sisters come over with their kids, they can't just go out in the backyard and play. Someone has to watch them constantly because of the pool.

We were looking at a house that had a pool and it was right in the middle. Because of this, there really wasn't a yard to play in but if they had put it on the side there would have been a good size yard. I'm in AZ so the yards aren't that big to begin with so the pool being in the middle makes a huge difference. That was one reason we decided against that house because my kids like to play in the backyard. Unless you have a big yard, I don't understand why someone would put it smack dab in the middle. I don't get it.

Ducter:

If you are making a straight fence it is MUCH MUCH easier than trying to make a curved fence that follows a curving perimeter of a pool. The fence I built around my current yard is straight on all sides so it was easier. With a straight fence you can stand at one end and sight down the fence and see any posts that are out of alignment.

My advice?

First drill all the holes. Unless you have REALLY soft soil, rent an auger from a local rental place.

Second, cement your gate posts in place. You will really need to get the gate posts exactly alligned or the gate won't close properly. You can get a fence post level at any hardware store. It's a level that fits on the side of a fence post with a rubber band that measures plumbness in all directions. Or get a couple of carpenters levels and tape them to the posts so you can make the necessary micro-adjustments. The gate posts also have to be exactly the same height so put a board across the tops of the posts and make sure that is level too. When you are positive you have the gate posts properly positioned, cement them in place and let it harden for a day or two. While your gate posts are hardening you can dig the rest of your holes.

Best way to lay out the fence is with string stretched from guide posts.

When you have the posts all dug and the gate posts cemented in place the rest of the fence goes fast. Stretch a string along the ground about 6" high as your guide for the bottoms of the posts. I assembled a panel to a post and dropped it in the hole and then repeated for 5-6 sections so that each panel is attached to one post. You need 2 people to do this. Have someone standing down at the end of the row of posts sighting down your fenceline to make sure all the tops of the posts are perfectly aligned while the other person is adjusting each post up and down and side-to-side with the clamps and braces. If you have to raise one, drop a shovel of gravel into the hole and wiggle the post around to raise it up. Or pull some gravel out to lower it.

Get a bunch of braces. 6' 1x2 furring strips work well. You can nail them to a small stake and pound it into the ground to have a secure brace, then use clamps to position the post exactly level. When you get a row of posts that are all perfectly positioned and braced and you are sure that the panels are all inserted fully into the posts then you can pour the concrete. Once the concrete is poured make one final check for alignment. Check that the bottoms are all along your string, that the tops are all lined up to your eye, and that they are all plumb. The concrete will harden fast.

You don't have to worry so much about plumbness along the fence line, only side to side. The fence panels will level out the posts if they are all inserted properly. The pitfall is if you lay out a bunch of panels and posts and find later that the posts are spaced slightly too far apart so that the panels aren't inserted all the way. You can't scoot them closer together once you have the concrete in.

If your yard is perfectly level it is easy. If your yard has contours then allow the fence to gently follow the contours. Don't try to measure it out, just use your eye to generate a pleasing contour to the top rail. If you have plenty of braces, clamps, and stakes then you can lay out quite a bit of fence and align it before pouring concrete. Don't try to follow every dip and bump in your yard. Smooth them out with gentle long curves in your fence. That looks much better.

When you get to a corner post, make doubly certain that it is plumb in all directions. And let the cement harden on your corner post before continuing the next run. If your corner post is at all crooked it will mess up your entire run.

Oh, you absolutely need a cordless drill for driving all the screws. For a 3 rail fence you'll be driving 6 screws per post and they are self-tapping screws so they need a lot of force to drive in.

The last time I put in a fence I mixed up all the concrete diligently in a wheelbarrow and dumped it into each hole. This time I'm just going to dump the dry concrete into each hole, one bag per hole, pour some water in with a hose, and use a tamping rod like a 2x2 board to mix the water around and tamp down the concrete. That's what most fence builders do. The concrete job doesn't have to be pretty, it just has to anchor the post. Just make sure the top of the concrete is below the level of the ground so you can remove the fence later without needing to dig out the posts.

Thanks for all the tips on installing. I was thinking of using the quickset concrete that you just pour into the whole and then water. I would dig all the holes for one straight run put all the sections in and brace them to be level and plumb and then water all the holes. will that work OK? It seems that the holes must be dug exactly the same or I will have to adjust with gravel as you said. The directions say to get concrete under the post itself but I think if I try to lift the post while in the concrete it would ruin the setup.

I was also thinking about fully screwing the sections together to the posts and drop it all into the holes. All the holes are predrilled so I should be able to have them all straight before hand, but many have said to screw them to the posts after the concrete hardens. hmmm

ducter:

You won't be able to get all the holes dug perfectly. You will need some way to micro-adjust the height of the posts. Even a 1/2" difference in post height will be very obvious when you sight down the row of posts. When you are standing at the end and sighting down your fence line you'll be able to see a post that is even 1/4" out of alignment. Gravel works good for these adjustments. Dig all the holes slightly deeper than you need and then shovel a bit of gravel into each hole. The loose gravel will let you wiggle the post around to get it positioned properly. Your ground will not be that perfectly even. And the concrete will seep down into the gravel.

Once you pour the concrete you'll still be able to do some adjustment but you want to be pretty much perfect before because you'll not have as much room for adjustment. Posts that are low you can always pull out a bit when the concrete is wet and if they are high, you can always use a hammer and block of wood to drive them a bit deeper. But you want to be ready to do it fast because once the concrete starts to set, any adjustments you make are liable to just make things permanently loose.

You'll figure it out. It sounds more difficult in description than in practice. the one thing you'll not want to skimp on is braces. When you have a post to adjust and you are out of braces you are scrambling around to find something and its a mess.

I think the instructions are to insert the screws after the concrete hardens. That's probably to make the posts more solid because it takes quite a bit of force to drive in the screws. If you are driving the screws in when the concrete is wet you're going to be wiggling the posts around and that could let them harden up loose. You have to grab the post with one hand and lean hard on the cordless drill to drive in the screws because they are self-tapping. The posts are pre-drilled but the rails are not so you will be driving screws into the aluminum rails and making the holes as you go. I suppose you could do this before you even drop in the concrete but it would probably be more difficult because everything will be loose.

Thanks. What is your take on fast setting concrete vs standard? Or is the slow method better? How to you attach the posts to the braces?

I don't think it makes any difference what concrete you use. Whatever is cheapest.

For the bracing I get a bunch of 1' long stakes. You can buy them at Home Depot in bundles. Then get a stack of 6' long 1x2 furring strips. I think that's what they are called. Just cheap boards of whatever you can find. Nail a stake to the end of each brace at an angle so that you can hammer the stake into the ground and the brace angles up towards the upper part of the post.

To attach the braces to the posts, use pistol-grip clamps of the sort that I linked to above at the end of my second post. That way you can adjust them as much as necessary while aligning your fence. Someone can stand at the end of your fence row and sight down the posts and the second person loosens the clamp and adjusts the post back and forth (or up and down) until it is perfect then just clamps it in place to the brace.