Yeah! What igloochic said. No negotiation. Backs. Now! I've lived with the no backs kind, built before fitted kitchens. Never again. Never.
I learned not to be "nice". It doesn't resolve the issue for anyone but the other person who will run right over you.
I hope you are near me. Heh, heh, heh....;-)
Are you up for a road trip igloochic?

As others have said, your cabinets should have backs but they will still function without them. In our last kitchen, our super susan didn't have a back and that was the only cabinet that the mice could get into. I trapped 4 in one night in it. Ewww!

I appreciate the support I'm getting from all of you!
Igloochic: I would not have thought of a way to fix the problem if you hadn't suggested what you did. Read the comments I made to circuspeanut and you will see why I don't think I will need to suggest to my contractor to fix it that way.

circuspeanut: "I'm curious - how are the cabinets attached to the wall if there are no backs? I know that was the way they were hand-built for generations, but can't figure out how they did it!"

Guess what I found out this morning! The base cabinets are not even attached to the wall! They have merely been placed up against the wall. I can hardly believe it!

I was hating to tell him to remove the cabinets and install backs, but now, that won't be a problem! I was going to have him do what you recommended, but now it is new backs or else!

sombreuil_mongrel: None of the base cabinets have backs on them.

desertsteph: My contractor had someone make them to the specifications I gave him. He said he would oversee the construction and have him make corrections if not up to the specifications. I can't understand how he let the backless cabinets get by him. He had him redo the soft close doors and drawers because they were poor quality. He made him put Blum closers on them.

I am going to contact my contractor Monday in order to see if we can work things out. I'll get back with all of you to let you know how things work out.

I'll post some pics of the cabinets soon.

UPDATE: DH just spoke with our contractor about the issues we are having, and the contractor is going to make it right and at his expense! Not sure what can be done about the MW. The MW is installed and is sort of tilted to the front. Have to wait and see what he can do about that.

Hopefully, this will be resolved to our satisfaction.

All of you have been so helpful. I really appreciate all of you.

The inside was not touched up yet when the pic was taken.

isn't that particle board, or are your walls that speckled? I mean, I expected to see wallboard and that doesn't look like wallboard to me.

Weedmeister: I'm not sure what it is, but it may be the backs of old cabinets. The ugly cabinets we had did have particle board sides and backs. Surprised they lasted over 30 years, but they did.

In any case the new cabs are not attached to it. The cabs are just up against the wall. The contractor said he would be over Friday to take care of the issues we have.

Oh holy cow...they need to be attached to the walls. For gads sake. honey I'm getting in a car...I'm sorry but you'll need to keep my son entertained while I beat the crap out of your contractors...but he LOVES wheelchairs (If I find you on a sofa having given up your chair to him it won't be the first time...he was always jealous of the kids in hospital with cool chairs LOL).

Easy fix...backs or take the crap out. Now on to the microwave. Kindly ask (in your nicest voice) your contractor how high his liability insurance is just in case you spill a bowl of hot soup coming out of the microwave (given the forward slant). See if he straightens it up. And on a side note...I'm just a chick, and I can level a microwave. It can be leveled in the cabinet and a bead placed in front to frame it and hide it...or here's a funny one..most come with adjustable legs or pegs if they're to sit on a shelf...if it's a hanging one, it must come down right now and be rehung safely (which is level) or refer to my suggested question and I'd do that daily. Tilted forward is a danger. It's more of a danger for you because frankly in the chair you can't get out of the way in a spill situation as fast as someone on two legs. Honestly that needs to be fixed immediately.

Someone pick me up...I'll be in the back shed getting baseball bats...this is peeving me off.

"Someone pick me up...I'll be in the back shed getting baseball bats...this is peeving me off. "

me too! I'm thinking we need to make our own version of 'Angie's' list (whatever it's called) for contractors! ugh!

I'm so happy to hear he'll be having the cabs fixed. DO NOT let him wiggle out of it or say it is the way it should be. it is not! show him these posts if he thinks so...

I'm very disturbed (ok, friends and relatives would agree to that!) about this MW also. that is very, very dangerous!
if it's slanted forward not only can it be dangerous opening and getting something out, stuff in there will be on a slant, cook on a slant and probably not have even distribution of heat.

no one who doesn't cook should be allowed to design or remodel a kitchen! geeze. (oh wait... I don't cook anymore. I'm in trouble - lol!) - but I'm not actually doing the work here myself! i don't think...

I'd certainly go igloochic's route regarding ins*urance to cover any lawsuit resulting from injury from use of it.

if he poo-poos that, tell him you'll be calling your own ins*urance company to see if you'll need extra coverage...

he did pull permits for this job didn't he? is one posted in a window? front door? if not there - ask him.

I haven't ever had cupboards without a back. Or never thought about it through my many years. Glad the contractor is going to make this right.

There should be a back and solid wood on each side to attach to the sides. Squeeze yourself into the kitchen with him and have him show you what he going to do. If you have a chance to drop by a kitchen design place, get ahead of him with knowledge of proper installation and try to look at a base cabinet.

Not only without backs, but a space too? How the heck would anyone clean this area.

I think the wall may be wall board with a prespray texture coat. If it is, wouldn't the wall need a final paint too? Any spills or dampness would love to seep into the wall without a finish. If this is the case, ask to have the areas painted.

My daughter is visually impared and am forever irked at those who walk off without finishing anything right. Simple things like cable install. Until I dropped by to see her, she really didn't know how bad the picture was. The cause of not having wiring tightened down among some other cable routing issues. She is extremely independant and will hound anyone to get the job done right. But always hard for her to know unless someone else double checks.

With our economy as it is, you would think anyone working would do their top job. I hate it when one has to go through followup and hope you get all resolved.

My goodness. Trying to figure out where to put everyone up for the night who may come and beat the "crap" outta our contractor..lol Can I sell tickets for the show..lol
All of you are just wonderful. You're helping me to keep calm about the calamity in the kitchen.
The base cabinets should be fairly easy for him to correct,but I'm not sure what he can do about the MW.
Below are a couple of pictures showing how it looks now.
You can see in the first picture that it is tilted. DH used a level this morning and found out it isn't even level.

The kitchen is a total mess! Of course, I know that all kitchen remodels are that way. I'm so disappointed in our contractor. He came recommended by a friend from our church who is in real estate. She said she had used him for many projects , and said he did good work. Her recommendation is the reason we went with him. He was raised in a neighborhood with Amish people and used to go out with them on their projects. He seems like a good Christian person, so, we are hoping he will make good on all of this.

I will continue to keep you updated on this as it goes along. We have a long way to go in the kitchen remodel. Still need to paint the walls, new floor,granite, backsplash etc.

The MW needs to be redone, what I see is that the wall bracket should to be shifted down a bit and then pulled back up in the front for a levelled install. Is the cabinet bottom level?

The back bracket have many holes, and then the toggle bolt anchors can be shifted also up to almost 1/4" inch.

It helps to have 2 people.

poorowner: I will give the contractor your install directions when he comes over on Friday. Thank you so much!!

He has done such sloppy work so far.

" Trying to figure out where to put everyone up for the night who may come and beat the "crap" outta our contractor..lol Can I sell tickets for the show..lol "

lol! throw a few bl*ankets on the floor...we'll be fine!

yeah - sell tickets! to anyone thinking of remodeling soon to see what they don't want in theirs! lol!

I'm glad poorowner could post what needs done to fix the mw. from the side it looks terrible! I really couldn't tell that much from the front tho. could be my bad eyes too.

what goes on the shelf above it?

it should all be so beautiful when it's done - properly. just tell your contractor we're on the case!

and just gently remind dh that you're paying good hard earned money for this work and it needs to be done correctly. for value and safety.

desertsteph: You're so funny..lol Maybe I should start printing tickets..lol I'll share my profit with those who show up to beat the fellow up..lol

Now, to find some blankets! Oh, I intend to use the shelves for decorations.

If all of you think the MW and base cabs are bad, take a look at the following pictures. Top shelf is not painted, spot of paint on it and the back wall is not painted correctly.

We can't blame our contractor for the outlet. I've heard others on the forum talk about what they found when their cabinets were torn out. Well, this is what we found. The outlet was behind our exhaust fan. I think it should be a pretty easy fix...hope so. Going to have the contractor put a wall behind the shelves and paint them. What he did was not prepare the drywall for painting,he just painted the wall.

Oh horrors, and to think. We are just getting started..... :(

Hope I can soon start showing better pics!

yikes! that socket is scary! is your mw plugged into that?

have him fix it before using it!

and yes, you need backs on those shelves too.

putting some pretty things up there will be nice.

I can't reach up high and I'm gonna put some pretty things on higher shelves also.

I correct this 1 picture post for you.

Why would any contractor leave an outlet looking like that and walk away, it can't be good on their portfolio. Ask him to patch up the bottom and put a bigger cover plate on it.

desertsteph & poorowner: We have a list a mile long for the contractor to take care of.
We intend to look for another contractor to work on the rest of the house. Finding one who is worth his salt is not going to be easy. Can't even take the word of a church friend who is a real estate agent.

It looks like your walls are plaster and not drywall. What year was your house built?

Sorry about all your frustrations with this remodel. I just bet your contractor is sad that you discovered this forum! He probably thought he could get away with such shoddy work - huh. We'll show him. :-)

That MW is about to fall down. The REQUIRED front mounting bolts are not there at all. It's only being held in by a prayer.

MWs have a rear mounting plate that attaches to the wall. This holds the back of the MW. Then there are two bolts used to attach the front of the MW to the cabinet above it. This holds the front of the MW. You do not have these installed.

Think of is as trying to hold up a 20lb box by the back edge only.

Normally, you'd try to make the outlet 'invisible' by putting it in the cabinet to the right.

jenswrens: The walls are drywall. The house was built in 1977.

weedmeister: The MW is downright scary! Not sure whether to let this bozo try and fix it or hire someone else. And would the person we hired would he do the job correctly.

I'm going to contact the manufacturer tomorrow to see if they can recommend something.

I decided to join Angie's List to see if I can locate reputable workers. Would like to know others experience with Angie's List.

Seeing the full collection of pictures/horrors, I am now angry and outraged for you. The MW is way too low, close to the cooking surface, to be remotely safe. It needs to be 18" to 24" higher than the cook top. The installation of the cabinets looks bad, seeing as how the entire (backless) MW cabinet only attaches to its neighbors. I wish I could advocate for you to that dimbulb GC and installer.
casey

sombreuil_mongrel: I asked DH to take a measure of the distance between the top of the range to the bottom of the MW.
He said it barely measured to 14 inches.
There are times I feel like screaming,yelling and crying all at the same time..in other words. throw a tantrum.

But, I'm too heartsick to do much of anything.

For those of you who believe in prayers, please offer a prayer for us.

I am concerned about your safety,
I only thought it had to be this low because you have to accomodate for the wheelchair.

Please feel free to post pictures of anything you are unsure of.
Is it still possible find someone else to continue your kitchen?

So... as far as your microwave... is it possible it's supposed to go ON that shelf space? Or above it anyway? That would put it at a much more realistic install height and stuff.

It it a microwave hood? ???

Back-less custom base cabinets seems to be pretty common in my experience. I've lived in two homes that were so fitted. Especially common where a long stretch of cabinetry is built to fit a given space, say 8 to 10 feet wide, that would be filled with several stock cabinets that are typically only about 30" wide.

Custom cabinetry is used by builders because if you're putting up 25 houses or 150 condos whose kitchens are identically sized, the cost of custom-built and custom-sized cabinetry is more than offset by the far lower labor costs of installing them. It's much faster to install one really long cabinet that fits perfectly than to install five smaller cabinets and line them up just right. And not having a back makes them lighter to carry (and of course cheaper), plus it often buys an extra couple of inches of depth.

I can't imagine that a microwave that close to the range would ever pass code. The GC *SHOULD* know that. I can't imagine that it would do you any good at that height either. It doesn't look like an OTR microwave, why didn't he install it in a base cabinet so you could reach it?

Instead of getting yourself upset, make a list of everything that needs to be corrected and give him a copy as soon as he comes over. When I had my family room addition done years ago, I had a list of everything I saw that needed to be fixed taped to the wall that was the first thing the contractor saw when he walked in the house.

I've been a member of Angie's List for a couple of years. After a plumber broke my new bathroom sink, I went on the list and found a plumber in my area who many people had raved about. I hired him to fix the problem and his men did an excellent job. I will use the list again for my kitchen remodel.

poorowner: No, the contractor placed it like that.

My DH is chief cook and bottle washer. The main reason we had the wall removed between the dining room and the kitchen is to make it more accessible to me. I will have some room to navigate in it now.

We are going to see if we can find someone soon. That is why I joined Angie's List.

morgne: I told him that we wanted an open "Cabinet" with a shelf. And, that I wanted it installed higher than the others. I even sent him a picture showing what I meant. He interpreted that to mean I wanted a shelf above the MW. By the time he installed the cabinets and I saw a picture of what he had done, it was too late to correct it.

I don't think the shelf is strong enough to hold the MW.

lee676: I think the operative word is "cheaper".

katsmah: "We have a list a mile long for the contractor to take care of."

This list keeps getting longer. A good idea to post the list to a wall. Think I will paste "little reminders" on the areas that need fixing. I just wonder if he can read...lol Not nice, but don't feel in a nice mood right now.

Thank you for your comments about Angie's List.

Thanks to everyone who has offered support and advice. You have been more help than you will ever realize!

I've been a member of Angie's List for several years (I too joined right after I had to fire my first horrible contractor for my whole house remodel in MN). The List can be great but I think how well it works depends on which part of the country you live in and the overall general work ethic of your region.

For ex, when I was a member of the Twin Cities chapter, everyone I hired was fabulous and it really helped me weed out the ones I shouldn't hire based on all the reviews. Now that I'm a member of the Tri-State Area (NY/NJ/CT) chapter, it doesn't seem to be as useful. Not as many businesses are on board and the ones that are there only have 1 or 2 or no reviews. Also, it doesn't seem to eliminate the typical NJ "no call/no show/I-don't-care-about-your-project" factor. They don't seem to care if you found them on Angie's List or a trampled flyer in the grocery store - they're still going to blow you off. Whereas in MN, I felt like most contractors on the List wanted to protect their Angie's List reputation, so if you mentioned the List, they went the extra mile.

Yes, I still love Angie's List and I think it's worth the annual fee, but just realize the different chapters do vary in quality. YMMV.

Holy Cr@p! I didn't even notice the MW was above a stove! Geez, Louise! That ain't right!!!

In your 2nd picture of the MW above, you can see the bolt(screw) hole where a long machine screw is supposed to be inserted from above to hold the weight of the MW. There should another just like it on the left side.

BTW: what's the make and model of this MW?

jenswrens: Ah, I see! Thanks for your insight about the AL.
I'm going to be very careful in regard to selecting a contractor. I noticed a lot in my area were not rated yet.
The ones that had A ratings were based on just 2 or 3 reports.

Since we will be using the list a lot as we do the remodel, I think it will be worth the membership.

I do too. Even after my remodel was done, I used the List for lots of other things too - like finding a lawn service, a dentist, a locksmith, etc. It sure beats the yellow pages!

I'm just seeing this for the first time, and just wanted to chime in and say that I'm so glad you're getting advice and support here from all these knowledgeable folks. It can be hard to stick up for ourselves when we're not sure we know as much as the GC so I'm glad you're here asking.

You may get to the point where you feel like you just can't ask to have one more thing fixed because you've asked about so many... but please hang in there and insist on having this job done right. You deserve to have it done right! And the time you spend on this now will be well worth it later.

Oh, and when you have the BTCOOTGC (beat the crap out of the GC) party, I'll be there!

weedmeister: The MW is a Fridgidaire FMV152KS. We purchased it back in November of 2009. It was in the garage along with our new range and dishwasher.

chicagoans: Thank you for your uplifting comments.
Looks like I may have to rent the convention center to hold all the party goers ..lol Should be a beat up..uhhh,bang up party..lol

My darling...I'm kinda handy. Handy enough to do a better job that whats being done now (I just repaired a plaster wall socket that originally looked like yours but is now perfect...and I'm talking real plaster and horsehair). It wasn't hard. Hanging a microwave isn't hard.

Here's my frank advice....don't have him back. You'll only lose more money down the pike. Any contractor who installs a microwave at that height, in that manner is my dear, not a good contractor, and as a human being, not a good christian....unless he's fighting against your faith and trying to do away with you, because a pan with something hot in it in that microwave could kill you. He's taking advantage of you and your DH and should be fired, then hung on a stake for it.

I just bought a ten bedroom house....(victorian) and I have more blankets than god :OP I'll bring them with me. Anyone have color preferences???? I sense this is gonna be a long beating.

Jewel....I'm only a little disabled and I see people try to take advantage. It's angering, so angering it makes me red in the face. You have a harder situation by far and so I'm even redder...almost as red as my hair on a fresh dye job day. (That's RED). Please, don't allow him to fix anything. Don't use the microwave and bring in anyone else to fix it! He's gonna kill you sweetie and that would make me mad! HE does not want that (ask all of the contractors who took advantage of us when DS was in hospital....I get even!).

argghhhh i'm angry for you. I'm packing blankies as we speak!

This is an OTR microwave. According to the installation instructions, there should be 3 screws holding it from above that go through the shelf. It is hard to see if they are there from these pictures.

I notice that there is a trim piece on the front/bottom of the shelf that is keeping the MW from fitting flat to the bottom of the shelf. This trim piece needs to be removed.

It's a bit hard to read, but it seems like the minimum distance from the top of the stove to the bottom of the MW is around 14-16". This seems kinda low to me.

I don't know if this helps, but I just checked some of my base cabinets. They are not attached to the wall either. They're held in place by gravity and the countertop which I suppose IS firmly attached to the wall by adhesive.

OMG, I'm so sorry you are having to deal with this, Jewel! I've nothing to add to the great advice you've received but I will add my two cents about Angie's List.

I've been a member for a couple of years and I love it. However, I don't rely on AL alone. I also check with BBB and my state's contractor's board - and you should, too. Get a full picture to see if there are any red flags that might not be apparent from an A rating on AL.

For instance, I needed to find someone to do mold remediation work for us (one reason why the kitchen project hasn't even begun). Pickings were slim, unfortunately, with most companies only having 1 or 2 reports. One company had an A based on one report so I added it to my short list. Then I checked our state's contractor's board and learned that the principals of the business have changed with regularity over the last few years. Many of the names were the same but they had shuffled positions and applied for and received a new contractor's license each time. Sometimes the company name stayed the same, sometimes not. BBB didn't have a rating for the company because there wasn't enough history upon which to base a rating. Gee, ya think? There were big red flags all over this company's background and I never would have found them if I hadn't looked beyond Angie's List.

Bottom line is don't rely on one source to help you choose a contractor.

I wish you well!

igloochic: OH BOY...go get 'em! Red....lol I'm looking forward to the party! If all of you can get him on the ground, I will run over him a few times with my wheelchair..lol
Believe me, this guy has done his last job for us! I talked to an electrician last night, and he is going to come and take a look at the outlet and probably move it so that it will be inside of the cabinet next to the shelf.
DH is on the phone talking to the contractor now. He is telling him about the issues we are having.
Contractor is coming here on Saturday around 9 a.m. I think if we can move the outlet, and remove the shelf, the MW can be installed correctly.

weedmeister: Thanks for looking up that info. "I notice that there is a trim piece on the front/bottom of the shelf that is keeping the MW from fitting flat to the bottom of the shelf. This trim piece needs to be removed. " I think the trim piece you mentioned is a one piece trim that was nailed to the front edge of the shelf for decoration purposes.

I don't think I could make it through all of this without all of you!

Yea! Things are looking a little better. Still not perfect but improved to the point we can live with it.
Sure will not recommend the contractor. Didn't even apologize or thank us for the business. But, hey, I'm not picky...lol Just glad to see things looking a little better.

At least I have some more positive pictures to show you. Still a long way to go. Wonder if I will live long enough to see it completed...rofl I'm joking of course. It would make me madder than a wet hen if DH gets to enjoy it all by himself..lol
The MW is still slightly off, but not bad. The problem was our wall. He showed DH how badly the wall was crooked. By moving it up that seemed to help.

Really, what do you think. Is there still hope for it???

The first and second pics are views from our living room.
There is also a pic of the base cab with a back...yippeee
The outlet was done by a qualified person. Used Angie's List to find him. Probably will use him for other electrical work.

Jewel-1, it seems to look a little more level, but at least you got it to a much better height. It's your call whether it is good enough or not
(check with a bubble and if the bubble is within the lines it's probably safe enough) or check if a marble sphere doesn't roll out of your microwave, you are good.

In my opinion nothing is perfectly level, perfectly flat, everything is relative. But you (or your GC) has gotta do the best.

poorowner: DH said he used a level with a bubble, and it is right in the middle of the bubble. It is level, but still tilts to the front slightly. Told DH what you said about using a marble to see if it would roll out. He said to tell you that he has already lost all his marbles...lol Think I have too.
Thanks for all your support and very helpful advice.

That is fine I think then.. I only suggested marbles because it is hard to put the head inside the MW to see the bubble sometimes :)
it could be your other cabinets giving the illusion the MW is out of level.
I am glad you have it sorted out. The outlet looks much better also.

poorowner: Think it is probably DH's photo taking..lol
Not a lot of room to take the pics, so he has to almost stand on his head to take some of them. The kitchen is not only small but it also narrow. DH also used a level to make sure cabs were level.

It is soooo hard to get good honest work done these days. People like that should be turned into the BBB. I would never even think that backless cabinets were an option...never occurred to me. Glad you are on to someone else.

vampiressrn: You have said a mouthful about finding good and honest workers. The only reason we didn't report him to BBB is because he did come back and fixed his "over sights".
I hope to have better luck from now on. Joined Angie's List and had success with finding a good electrician.
And, I agree about backless cabinets. Never heard of them before they showed up with our new ones.

"There are times I feel like screaming,yelling and crying all at the same time..in other words. throw a tantrum.

....

For those of you who believe in prayers, please offer a prayer for us."

well, I sure don't blame you! I get the same way when someone tries to cheat me or pull one over on me! I'll be praying for a safe remodel - and an honest gc for you.

igloo - I'll take a purple one. lilac? otherwise, I'm not picky... lol!

on the mw still angled forward - what's the problem with putting something behind it to level out the wall?

I'd put the leveler both directions... front to back also and check that bubble. I still don't think it's safe if it's angling forward.
I've gotta buy me one of those. I used to play with my dad's - don't know what happened to it tho. I'm gonna follow my gc around with it - since he's also my bf he'll probably hit me on the head with it - lol!

I'm glad you got someone else in there to work on your list! get the stuff done correctly. If he doesn't seem to want to do it correctly, can him too!

is that socket now in the c*abinet next to the mw? I couldn't tell by the pic.

be sure to post any other things that come up and you need a 2nd PLUS opinion on. we'll give you lots of them!

desertsteph: "on the mw still angled forward - what's the problem with putting something behind it to level out the wall?"
I don't know. DH asked about putting shims in, but for some reason that wouldn't work.
DH has tested the level or it from all angles. He said the bottom was straight and it is straight across the front, but I'm sure it isn't from the depth side of it. Going to have DH check it again tomorrow. If it needs correcting, you can bet it won't be the same contractor we call.

The outlet was moved just to the right of the old one. It is now in the cabinet to the right. There's a pic of it above showing the old outlet and the new one.

"be sure to post any other things that come up and you need a 2nd PLUS opinion on. we'll give you lots of them!"

I hate to keep bothering everyone with the mess that is going on right now. The advice I've received has been so very helpful!

Hopefully, the rest of the remodel will go smoother..

I'm sure learning a lot from this project. Maybe, I can be of help to someone else in the near future

That trim on the front of the shelf is still pushing down on the front of the MW. You either need to remove the trim or move the mounting plate down on the wall by the same amount.

weedmeister: DH said it is the way it was made. Anyway, that is the way it looked out of the box. Too late to return to store because it had been stored in our garage for several months.
The trim is on the shelf,and if it was removed it would shorten the depth of the shelf.
Right now my DH is fed up with the MW and would like to just leave it alone. So, my hands are tied as far as moving it again.... (

When one attaches a MW bracket under a cabinet, or shelf with an added lip, one must add corresponding blocking/packing between the bracket and attachment surface so it sits level and firm. If the MW is too far out of level, the turntable might have trouble, and the door will swing open readily.
Casey

sombreuil_mongrel: Thanks Casey. DH says that it is level across top and bottom. It is just slightly tilted. I will pass your info on to DH so that he can see if he has trouble with turntable or door. The shelf has trim that is in one piece,but has been routed on the bottom edge to give it a decorative look.The trim is the same size as the shelf.