Your job is supposed to take two days. It is supposed to.

But he is doing 17 other jobs that are supposed to take two days. He must keep all of you in suspended animation so that you do not go elsewhere.

So, he tells you his truck broke down, and he is really at another house. He needs to special order another part, and he is really at another house. The roads are too icy for his truck, and he is really at another house. The building inspector wants another layer of blah blah blah, and he is really at another house. The architect's drawings are mis-measured, but he is really at another house. His project manager took his family to Disney, but he is really at another house. The blank you picked won't work with your blank, but he is really at another house. You need to ok the blank before he can finish, but he is really at another house. Then it's your turn, and he shows up at your house, and tells every one else, his truck broke down.

Oh not that I'm bitter or anything...

Based on my experiences in waaay too many waiting rooms over the last year, I can only assume that they're taking lessons on appointment scheduling from doctors.

Yikes! I'm guessing you had a bad experience?

We've only done a few things, but our GC (a friend) has always been done when he said he would, showed up when he said he would...and was even a guy short, on one occasion. My husband ended up helping (not what he had in mind) and the GC said...don't worry, I won't charge you for my time, for teaching you the finer points about construction! LOL

Warmfridge- I hope things improve, soon! My grandmother had a bad experience with a painter that took days, to finish a project that was supposed to take a couple of hours. When he came to get paid...I told him we had to go to the bank and we'd be right back. I took grandma to lunch, then the store and we got back about two hours later. I agreed with him, it sure is frustrating when someone doesn't come back, when they said they would :)

As a lead man/foreman/head carpenter, I'm usually in the middle. Between my employer and the homeowner. A mediator/psychoanalyst; I have to inform the homeowner that "2 month job" means that it was budgeted for two months of crew time. NOT 2 calendar months. I am typically blunt and dismissive ;-) We really don't control weather, delivery schedules, or how quickly the necessary subcontractors will fit us in.

Casey

Has your wall / cabinet already been ripped out to insulate the pipes? That is the only complicated part. Insulating the pipes takes about 2 seconds! My plumbers had to insulate the pipes in the ceiling and above the crawl space to pass inspection. They got the pipe insulation, walked in and were out in 5 minutes.

mntnrdredux took the words right out of my mouth. That's exactly what's going on.

Corrie- LOL :)

.I told him we had to go to the bank and we'd be right back. I took grandma to lunch, then the store and we got back about two hours later. I agreed with him, it sure is frustrating when someone doesn't come back, when they said they would :)
=========================================================

Study at the feet of the master....

....my hero :-)

this post makes me hart my contractor even more! SHE is awesome and never late/slow - kinda too fast at things sometimes!
Go chick contractors!

sm, I'm not opposed to blunt. But when I'm bluntly told ''We're starting on Monday,'' or ''We'll be done by Thursday afternoon,'' I like to think I'm not being lied to.

Nat, the plumber has been great. He came when he was supposed to and did the part of the job he was responsible for. The contractor can't seem to get his own carpenters, drywallers, etc. organized.

This is killing me. The room they're working in contains the laundry, my tools, my physical therapy equipment, and a myriad of other things. Until they finish, I can't do laundry, my PT, or anything else around the house.

LOL, I agree Corrie22. LL you are my hero!

sombreuil, I don't quite understand dismissive - a joke perhaps? But I think most on this site would prefer blunt to the BS promises.

My kitchen has been finished for a few months. I'm still bitter.

I love the bank story. I would just worry about them messing with my house while they wait. Think I will try it anyway the next time it is appropriate ;)

I have found that now that the bulk of our project is done and the bulk has been paid for, that I get no response from the gc. Dh thinks he has written off the last $1700+, but I think that would be pretty stupid of him because what needs doing would cost less than that and to leave someone pissed off is bad business. Why leave that as the last impression?

I am disappointed in how I have to be the gc between my husband and the gc. I need to keep on them to get stuff done. I thought it was their job to supervise and make sure things were done right. I figured they would be like a concierge, however, I have to make lists, and keep trying to bring them back in and to inform them when the subs needed to correct something or finish something. They gave me no warning that they may come on the one time in past few weeks that they actually did come, briefly, and I have not seen them since. I guess if this is how it ends, then we have enough to pay a handyman to come finish the punch list. I don't know when I should revert to that and how long to give them.

Our counter guy is doing the same thing. He was here about 6 weeks ago to install all our counters and had to re-do 2 pieces on our island flanking our stove. They are simple rectangles with no seams, cutouts or anything fancy. In his case, we never gave him a dime and were ready to pay him the day he came to install, until we had the issue. He said he'd be back shortly to finish. At first, since we were tight on cash and since our stove is not functioning yet, I did not chase him to finish because it gave us more time to pay. Now, it is just ridiculous. I'd like to know how long he will go without contacting us in any way and how long he will wait to be paid. We are not ducking him in the least and are willing to pay as soon as our counters are in. It was all supposed to be done in one shot.

My BIL (a GC) has this Gary Larson Far Side Cartoon hanging in his shop. On one side, a GC; on the other, a man on a deserted island with the following subtitle: Men for whom time has no meaning.

He must have been having some work done when that inspiration came to him.

Hah! I knew it! Rjr, you've confirmed my theory.

A friend whom we love dearly was our carpenter for the kitchen remodel, and it was truly astounding how difficult it seemed to be for him to manage his time. I'd hear him on the phone promising to be somewhere in 15 minutes - somewhere across a large city and 25 miles away. Amazing. He's gifted at his trade, and always has far more interested clients than time, but I always worry how he makes any money at all.

Would love to have a copy of that cartoon, rjr! Dug up this one for laughs, too:
{{!gwi}}

Mtnrdredux - your post was so accurate that I had to read it aloud to my husband.
Corrie22 - you are awesome.
:o)

"...the gene that allows humans to comprehend clocks, calendars, and other measures of time?"

Or maybe the problem is the owners who think that everything goes according to plan, even when no one knows what is inside the walls?

brickeyee, it's not the understandable glitches and delays with the work itself that are so irritating. Anybody who doesn't get that some unknown (and unpredictable) factor is bound to throw a wrench into the pristine original plans has no business embarking on a remodel.

No -- it's when the contractor cheerfully says "I'll be there Monday morning at 9:30!", and you risk your boss' fearsome wrath to take off the morning and miss a staff meeting to be there, and the contractor never shows or answers your calls until the following Wednesday. At which time they reach you in the middle of a seminar and seem perplexed why you a) aren't able to chat endlessly about pipe sizing, and b) can't just run home and meet them right then.

Honestly, maybe it's different for others here who are SAHMs, work at home, etc, but for those of us who have to balance a busy office workweek with contractors' schedules, it's intolerable to get so many excuses and broken appointments.
I always wonder: how do they think I make the money I'm paying them, anyways? And do they think my job is more secure every time I sit around home tapping my foot waiting (AGAIN) for them to show?

In my experience, many contractors, even the well-meaning ones, really have no clue about the workweek for 'regular' folks.

Grrraaarrrrrrhhh. OK, this thread has now got me growly. Despite being mostly DIY, waiting on even the few contractors we did hire was the utter worst part of the kitchen redo ... by FAR.

Sorry, Brickeyee, if our collective ire misfires on the innocent!

Without boring you with details, I can tell you what you describe is not the case here. I do in fact appreciate the complexities of renovation and the vagaries, as well as reliance on competence and timeliness of others ... inspectors, subs, suppliers, etc etc

The industry has a bad wrap, and I will go out on a limb to say much of it is deserved. Moreover, unlike other industries, the stakes are very high and very emotional. That is why you see such anger and vitriol.

When GC's improperly estimate timelines, or outright misrepresent them, it impacts the day to day life of a family, often the most intimate and personal parts of their lives. Where and how they make and eat meals, do laundry, and or sleep. Every day a family's life is disrupted takes an emotional toll, especially days flying by on a calendar with no progress made.

When GC's underestimate a job significantly, some times people do not have the funds to finish. or even if they do it puts them in a bind they had not planned for, or ends up being an uneconomic investment they would otherwise not have chosen. Serious issues, for what is most people's single largest expense and "investment" , their home.

Yes, homeowners as a group and I am sure specific homeowners can, like any group of customers, be quite a handful, too. They can be unreasonable and cause delays themselves. But the widespread dissatisfaction with the home improvement industry can't all be random or misguided.

"...means that it was budgeted for two months of crew time. NOT 2 calendar months. ..."

Then they better get their act together and learn how to communicate properly. If I pulled that kind of stunt, I'd get a warning and the next time...out the door (assuming I got a second chance)!

When you schedule a job, yes, you need to determine how many man-hours (or weeks or months) are needed...but then you do something called "resource scheduling" and "resource balancing"...you plan it out to see what (task) needs to be done when, what (material/tool) is needed when, and who is needed when......on ALL your jobs, not just the one. THEN you tell the homeowner how long it will take...ideally in calendar time as well as crew time! Something like this... "Overall, the job will take two calendar months. However, that does not mean it is two months worth of effort. Factored into that time is waiting for subs, waiting for materials, , and work on other projects. I estimate actual labor to be four work weeks. Realize also that if anything unexpected occurs the schedule may be delayed but I have done everything I can to reduce delays, including a thorough review of the Project and the site. However, when the walls are opened up, there may be some surprises. In that event, I will discuss with you the issue and we will arrive at a solution that will be acceptable to you in both time and money.

Additionally, I will give you at least 48 hours notice when my crew or I will be at the house. I will also give you 24 hours notice if plans change. In case of true emergencies, I will call you immediately to let you know and we will arrive at a mutually agreeable rescheduled time/date."

This way, everyone knows going in what's expected.

Oh and if they complain about those "other jobs", explain to them about how you sometimes have to wait for subs, materials, etc. and you cannot afford to have your crew sitting around idle. By having multiple projects, it allows you to only charge clients for the actual work (time/labor) and materials for their project, not down time as well. (If they insist they be the only job, well, then they have to pay for the 40 hours per week for the entire crew...that's how it works in other industries!)

(You might also have to remind them of the saying, "Fast, Cheap, Quality...pick two, you cannot have all three.")

BTW...If you trust your GC and his crew and your GC is bonded, you might consider installing a lock-box on your door (like real estate agents do) with a key to allow them in/out of your house as needed.

Amen. However, I think you are preaching to the choir.

As you say, it's about communication. Of course he needs other jobs ... You want a solvent contractor!

Just don't lie to everyone and juggle us like extramarital lovers.

If you belong to Angie's list, be sure to give them an "F" when the job is done and warn others not to use them. The one bright spot in this dismal economy is the large numbers of contractors who have gone bankrupt. The more, the merrier.

Dianalo- We left him sitting outside the house, waiting to get paid. All he did was paint a very small dormer above the porch roof. If my grandma had had a ladder, I might have done it myself!

Anyway, I probably wouldn't have done that normally, but he shouldn't have played games like that, with my grandmother. She was far too nice a person :)

Lav - I think your solution was brilliant. You gave him a taste of his own medicine. I wish I could somehow do something like that in our situation.... I am just so tired of being left hanging and our project not being wrapped up. The past month has seen almost no progress with only getting attention when they need to repair work they already did. In fact, our punch list is a list of things that need to be fixed that were not done right. I am even annoyed that I have to point out to the gc how the work was not done properly and then nag him to get the subs to fix it. He should have noticed the mistakes and been on them without my even knowing. He is being paid to coordinate and be a "fixer". Grrrrr....

MTn - you said it perfectly. I understand we are not their one and only but don't insult my intelligence with not calling back, being vague and not actually finishing things. I'd think word of mouth and referrals would be important. Guess not. In my line of work, they are everything.

Circus - if one is a SAHM mom, has a flexible schedule, or God-forbid, works from home, your time is treated as if it were unlimited and not of any value. We gave our gc a key and would often leave the back or side door open if we expected someone to the house and I had to go out. Often, no one would come. Then, I'd get a call on a day they were not expected and they'd say they could run right over. I'd be at work at my office and our house would be locked. The gc was on another site, so I'd be expected to drop my work and run or feel like we wasted a chance to get a functioning kitchen or whatnot.... I had to be involved way more than I expected (and I had expected to be in on a lot) and it cut into time that I could be working and therefore, earning. They also assumed I'd do all the cleanup at the end of the day and would leave coffee cups, sawdust, debris of all kinds and packaging from materials left strewn around. I don't think our job went as well as it should have.

At first I was going to let this slide off, but then people started applauding.....

L-L wrote:

"Anyway, I probably wouldn't have done that normally, but he shouldn't have played games like that, with my grandmother. She was far too nice a person."

Well, she may be nice, but as my grandmother often said, "Pretty is as pretty does." And that isn't pretty, that is petty.

I don't understand props being offered here for choosing to do that.

You all seem to get that the unforseen may happen on your job, but the unforseen is happening on everybody else's job, too. Along with dithering, change orders and supplier lapses, etc. It all snowballs. And if you're willing to applaud tit for tat behaviour then the next time you're standing there fuming because a promised, but now delayed worker, is AWOL then just chalk it up to some other client indulging their self-importance by playing "pay you back games" with your worker.

Nobody needs to remind me of their desperate dramas with contractors, believe me, I've been there and (waited, and waited and waited) and finally (!) done that. (Major reno outside DC area during the height of the housing boom; 'nuff said.) While I often gnashed my teeth and I fired a few contractors and tradesmen, I never played games.

That would be really bad karma, in my view.

L

There's always somebody leaping in with an argument that a HO should just "let it go" or "rise above it."

Bull****.

HOs are way too nice to bad contractors. What LL did was nothing. She should've just forgotten to go to the bank, and paid him some other time of her own choosing.

Are they too nice? I would wager homeowners are probably too nice in the exact same ratio they are completely unreasonable. Many (not all) homeowners make plans in the perfect world of their imaginations while Contractors are left to adapt them to the real world. Over the years I have read some absolutely horrific stories about Contractors on here for which there is no rationalization. I have also read enough of the completely irrational expectations of some members to take all things with a grain of salt. Some posters have been so bat**it crazy I am sure all the decent contractors ran not walked away from their job.