It is really up to you if you want to spend the money on it. It is not an "investment" at this point. You are almost certain to lose money by over-improving your home. eg if you spend 100k on renovations, you might recoup 60k (in today's dollars) when you sell it.

If this is your "forever house" and you aren't going to sell it, that essentially means that you will never see that money again in your lifetime. If you have so much money that a little detail like that doesn't matter, then spend away. That is one of the perks of being well off. If not, you'll have to spend within a budget like the rest of us.

If you haven't already, you should sit down and write out your priorities and goals in life. eg retire at 65, save X dollars for kids, take family vacations, remodel bathroom. Rank them in order of importance and figure out how much each cost. If you can pay for all the item above "remodel" on your list and still have money left over, then feel free to keep your contractor on speed dial. If you ran out of money before you got all the way down the list, then you'll have to put off home improvements until you have the money for them.

For us it was budget.

I would start by getting quotes for everything you want to do. It takes a while, but it is better if you have the quotes broken down by room/project/etc. From there, you an add it all up and play with the numbers to see how much more it would cost to go ahead and do X.

We were limited by our budget but you may not be. I would keep in mind the other poster's comment about sinking too much money into the house even if it is your "forever" home.

Good luck.

I think one way to look at it is to first take stock of what must be done and what you want to be done. Then think about timelines for those things and get a rough idea of how much they cost. Some things naturally flow into the other, and others are clearly separate.

For instance, our project started with a leaky roof. After several years of trying to manage the problem with spot fixes, we learned that the only way to solve the problem once and for all was to get rid of two oddly placed dormers. Since our roof needed reshingling anyway, we decided to change the roof shape to get rid of the bad dormers. And since we were changing the roof shape anyway, we decided to raise a portion of it and bump out a shed dormer for more usable space upstairs. Which meant we had space to add a second bathroom.

But oh no, we weren't finished yet!

As long as we're fixing the roof, we might as well reinforce the underbuilt rafters in the living room portion of the roof, which means removing the ceiling, and then reinsulate. This was not a part of the project that I wanted to do, but it only adds on about $4,000 to the project, which by this point was a small percentage of the budget. It would also make the house more efficient and make it easier to tie the new roof in with the old. Plus, if we were going to do this at some point, why not do it while the house was already ripped up. We knew that after this big project, we wouldn't want to rip up the house again anytime soon.

The only part of our project that is completely separate and could be done later (or be dumped if the budget spirals out of control) is a deck addition. But that deck is something we really want and we also know that we won't be borrowing any more money in the near future for any projects, so it was sort of a do it now or don't do it.

This is our "forever" house too, and we probably are overimproving a bit because we are not adding any real square footage. But we made the decisions based on what we want our house to be and what we felt comfortable borrowing.

Oh and in case you want to follow that trail all the way back to the beginning of our project, here's what "fixing a leaky roof" looked like yesterday:

LOL Bill. I am by no means wealthy but we do have about $150,000 cash that we *can* spend if we want. I didn't mean it that way though.

I guess where I really struggle is this like "Its only $5,000 to do this, should you stretch your budget for it?"

I am leaning right now towards doing the kitchen and bathroom plus a cheap playroom remodel (carpet, windows, sheet rock, light fixture). That cost is about $4,000 and if we ever extend or raise another level, its *only* $4,000. As opposed to sinking another $100,000 in.

I think I also need to get an architect and contractor on board.

Thank you all for your insight. And wi-sailorgirl, I totally hear you.

You also need to factor in living with multiple disruptions in your life, vs just one; as well as possible extra cost involved at a later date.

My house has been upgraded piecemeal over the last 10 years, as I could afford it. Along with the disruptions, it made some projects more costly and difficult to do after the fact rather than during the initial remodel. I didn't have the extra money to remodel the kitchen when I had the family room added, so now that I can afford to have the kitchen remodeled, I am paying extra to open a load bearing wall between the kitchen and family room. Doing that as part of the addition work would have been cheaper, but would have left me short of cabinet space.

Good luck with your decision.

IMO it isn't how far to go with the remodeling. It's what will you have for your time, money and inconvenience at the end of it all? What could you sell it for, this half-old, half-new structure? Does it even look good on the exterior?

When you start re-doing more than 50% of a house, it better be something historic, IMO. Otherwise, you are better off moving or doing a teardown.

One problem with adding on is that often the sizes of the untouched rooms begin to be inadequate for the new, bigger home, to say nothing of appearing 'dated'.

If you are enlarging a *playroom* and talking about second levels, I sort of doubt that this is your 'forever' home. That must be miles down the pike -- it's that house down there that's all on one level. LOL

I am sooo happy we did not follow our original plan to remodel the 1950's ranch we bought. We are comfort and dollars ahead to have torn down and built ALL N*E*W.

I'm going through this BIG time. Here in Austin home prices are through the roof and our 1959 ranch is in our dream location. In the 5 years we've lived here our home value has skyrocketed and moving holds no appeal to us. It's the neighborhood my wife's family is from and the elementary we always wanted our toddler to go to can be seen over our back fence. PERFECT location and the houses around us are selling for 75% more than we paid.

Sooooooo, what started out as an enclosed porch where our deck was has spiraled into a den addition, new roof structure, bedroom/closet/bath expansion, kitchen remodel, all new floors and all new exterior paint and hardi soffiting. That just feels silly typing it.

It's over-the-top expensive but we can afford it right now. Sort of like having our son, it seems like there's never a "perfect" time to do it so we're just going for it. I'm expecting the worst regarding time, money and general standard of living but I can't think of a better time to do it.

Glad to hear I'm not the only one!!

It was difficult for us too. We started out with a kitchen reno and then decided we should cover the porch, add a mudroom, laundry room and powder room (for pool access). Since our house was so torn up, we went ahead and refinished the hardwood floors and stained them darker. Since we wanted to do that, we had to change out the stair balusters since they matched the old flooring.

When they started digging for the edition, they discovered fill dirt much further out from the foundation (10 feet) than was expected. So, we went ahead and did a full unfinished basement there which stretched our budget even more unexpectedly. The addition also let us double the amount of an upstairs closet and improve attic access, which was not planned for initially. When they were up in the attic, they discovered the amount of insulation over the bonus room was shorted by the original builder and the bath room vents were improperly done. So, we fixed that too.

We are borrowing the amount and hope to roll the majority into a new fixed mortgage. It is our forever house and the idea of getting it all done and not having to mess with anything forseeably major for the next 10 years, was a huge draw for us. Hopefully the appraisal will come out reasonably in our favor. You never know.

Scope decisions are tough. I would just keep in mind that there may well be unexpected expenses like we encountered and had to decide upon. Hope this helps some in your decision making.

Good luck to you!

" Hopefully the appraisal will come out reasonably in our favor."

Not to pick on you, but this is the type of mindset that has the country in a big mess. Houses are not piggy banks - especially "forever houses." An appraisal and Equity are only important is you are looking to sell the place. Otherwise, all you are doing is paying for your lifestyle choices over 30 years - with interest!

bill,

Just to let you know, we are financially prepared if the appraisal doesn't come back ideally. I'd be really happy with 50% return on an appraisal. I am absolutely fine with paying for my lifestyle choice of housing over 20 years, which is what I purposefully planned for when I began this endeavour. I have come to realize, with age, that we are not guaranteed one day on this earth. My DH and I have spent our entire lives going to school, studying hard, going to more school, living frugally, raising a family, working long hours. We saw, like everyone else, our carefully saved retirement plans shrink in value. All our frugality and planning whisked away. There are no guarantees.

Four years ago I had a very serious health problem, and I am blessed to be still on this beautiful earth with my lovely family. Henceforth I decided I would try to stop being so penny pinching and frugal because, who knows how much time we are alloted. So, my decision to undertake this renovation was very calculated. I know what financial burden I am taking on. I don't expect anyone else to pick up the bill, nor do I expect a bailout. DH and I have worked very hard to get where we are and I am very thankful for all that I have been so graciously blessed with.

Neither of us consider our home an investment. (I just thought I should clarify.)

I agree, paying for a nicer house for 30 years seems well worth it to me. Don't see a problem there if you can afford it.

Doonie you don't ever have to justify what you want to do. Only you know your circumstances and what will work for you. I say if this is what you want, then go for it. Just be sure to post pictures along the way and enjoy the whole process. Especially when good ole Mr. Murphy moves out of my place into yours! ;)

" Don't see a problem there if you can afford it."

If you have to pay for lifestyle choices over 30 years, then you honestly can't afford it. Nobody starts off thinking they are getting in over their head - it just happens. Let's say you "roll" your renovation expenses into a 30 year mortgage. That means, you have things like a fridge and dishwasher on a 30 year payment plan. Unfortunately, those things don't last 30 years. When that dishwasher conks out after 10 years, you'll still have 20 years of payments left. Crazy!

Right now, america has a serious borrowing problem. As individuals and a country, we are spending money we don't have. Somehow that has become the new normal. However, it takes a crushing toll on people and relationships. Debt and money issues are now the #1 reason marriages fall apart. If you want to doom a young couple, tell them to borrow a bunch of money to finance their lifestyle.

Borrowing money isn't unwise if you can afford to pay it back in a timely manner and still save money. What's "new" about 30 year home loans? Loans, credit cards, etc. are only as irresponsible as the people who use them. If you can't afford to pay back a loan, don't take out a loan. My wife and I have stellar credit because we have borrowed money through the years and have ALWAYS paid it back promptly.

To imply that anyone who borrows money is "crazy" and that it will be the end of our marriages (without knowing any of our personal circumstances) in this context is a bit much, thanks.

Absolutely right - knowing what you can afford and having a plan to pay it back (while continuing to save for when appliances die and other things come up) is the key.

Bill, if you can pay cash for a new house or a huge remodeling project, goody for you. But this post was about how decide which projects to tackle when. It's not like the original poster was rolling a European vacation and a Porche into a 30-year mortgage.

"It's not like the original poster was rolling a European vacation and a Porche into a 30-year mortgage."

An item doesn't have to be a porche to be unaffordable to someone. People are out there putting lunch on their credit cards and paying for it over 10 years. If someone doesn't have the money to pay for granite counters, a bigger dining room, a fancy master bath etc well.... then they can't afford that yet.

The OP asked how to decide how much to renovate. The answer is "as much as you can afford" not "as much as someone will lend you" or "as much as makes you happy." They went on to post about their playroom, so I think it is safe to assume they aren't about to retire. For a young couple, the single worst thing they can can do for their marriage and for their kids is to borrow a bunch of money to buy stuff they can't afford.

Well saw50st8, there you go. Bill says you can't afford it, you're crazy and he thinks you're too young and that you're about to ruin your marriage.

I say you should do what's right for your family and keep us all posted. My remodel starts a week from today so I'm right with you. Good luck!

I agree with you Bill that you don't buy what you can't afford. It's why the only cards I have are bank cards because I know that when I buy something it's coming out of my account immediately. That works for me. But I also have a 30 yr mortgage and in the past have had car loans. (My car is paid off right now.) Neither of which I could afford to pay cash for. Many folks do overextend themselves when they shouldn't.

But I'm making the assumption after reading what was written that the OP can afford to make the changes she wants. She says she's saved and scrimped all these years and because of life's circumstances she wants to have a beautiful home and kitchen NOW. I say go for it. She was asking which projects to tackle.

As to how she pays for it, it is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS! Let me repeat that. It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS HOW SHE PAYS FOR IT! I think you are way out of line here co-opting her thread with your pontification.

I haven't checked this page in a bit but wow LOL.

Actually, I do have cash to pay for the renovation. Bill, if people only bought what they could afford right now (in full), then I could never have afforded the house to begin with. I was able to afford a 20% down payment, the monthly mortgage and other expenses for it.

What we've actually decided to do at the moment is to renovate the kitchen, leave the bathroom a powder room (redo it cuz its gross) and redo the small covered porch. If we ever decide the extend, the porch remodel is about $3-4,000 (including windows) so its not a major investment. We think we will leave it though and then do a full basement renovation later (we need to move a lot of plumbing to the cieling which is about $20k on its own) instead of extending. We'll add the master bathroom off our bedroom where we have our large closet/dressing area.

It feels settled which is good.

"Bill, if people only bought what they could afford right now (in full), then I could never have afforded the house to begin with. "

There is a big difference between financing something that appreciates in value (a house) vs something that either loses a lot of money up front or depreciates in value over time. On is a wise use of the credit while the other is a road to disaster. You apparently already have the financial wisdom to know the difference, but a whole lot of people in this country don't.

Best of luck on your reno.

I agree with that Bill.

Bill makes very good points but I can nod my head in approval because I've been there!

Where I'm confused is with the OP's cost estimates. "I am leaning right now towards doing the kitchen and bathroom plus a cheap playroom remodel (carpet, windows, sheet rock, light fixture). That cost is about $4,000."
Unless one is doing all the work themselves I don't see how in the world one can do all that work for $4000. Am I misreading the statement?

I would suggest you don't over-extend yourself and if the design allows, do a small portion first and see what actual costs are.
We've done 2 major remodels and even tho my detail-oriented DH worked on all the costs & expenses (and we did a lot of the work) we still ended up nearly 50% over what we estimated. That $80K remodel ended up costing $150K due to unexpected problems!
Take into consideration the condition of your HVAC, roof, plumbing, upgrade of electrical and/or gas, and since you have a basement consider any possible drainage issues. Excavators are expensive.

It's also those 'little' things that will eat up your cash dollars. Don't forget new furniture, window treatments & paint! :~)

Oops........my percentages are off! The second remodel was 50%.

I meant the cheap playroom remodel is $4,000, as opposed to expanding. I wish everything would be LOL.