Are you on a slab? Probably not since mostly Floridians like me are slab people.(sounds ominous). I have a totally out of left field idea. What if, can the corner. What I mean, create a DEAD space that your sink could go into. Increase your 9" to 18" or whatever it would be, then dead corner sink space, and then you combine 10 and 11 into one large drawer space. Access can be from the dining side if plumbing work needed to be done.

Too crazy? I've come up with too crazy plenty of times but I keep trying. One day I'm going to hit on a brilliant idea.

Thanks everyone! My GC has been really great thus far so I do not think he is lazy--or trying to get out of it. Whatever I want he says he can make it happen. He has spent time researching other issues for me-- so I don't think he is lazy. He said that the problem was some sort of white pipe that does venting for the drain. Does that make sense? The problem is not the actual copper plumbing. The plumber already installed that.

My other thought was to replace #10 (corner) cabinet with a 24" base that opens from the dining room and instead of #11 (18"base) put in a 30" drawer base. I could put the sink in the 24" cabinet, so I would have more drawer space--- which is lacking in this design. I know it is not great--but I am thinking it is that or scrap the sink.

Thanks Rhome- I do not really want to scrap the sink, but it is becoming problematic.

Remodelfa- We are not on a slab, full basement underneath. I like your idea-- I just not sure if I will be happy with the sink in that corner or not.

Any other thoughts? Thanks

The white pipe you're talking about is the drain vent. It should be moveable. What, exactly, is the problem with moving it? That it physically cannot move anywhere because of an obstruction? If he's telling you that the the vent has to go through a wall, he is incorrect.

For my prep sink in the island, my plumber put a vent called a Studor vent meant for island sinks. Its a one-way vent that allows plumbing to go in the middle of the room if you want it. Instead of snaking up a wall and out the roof, it's a short little vent that sticks up through the floor and cab bottom next to the water supply lines that feed the faucet. It doesn't snake through base cabs to get to the wall. If you do some Googling, you'll find it. There's another way to do it without using the Studor vent, but I can't remember what it's called. Loop vent maybe?

Can you talk to the plumber about this instead of the GC? Is the GC's info coming from the plumber or just from his own guessing? It doesn't sound right. I'm sure your GC is great, but either you're not getting the whole story or someone isn't fully informed about island/peninsula plumbing techniques.

Don't give up your sink in the proper location! Hundreds of thousands of people have island prep sinks. It certainly can be done! Keep your chin up and keep asking questions.

Thanks Breezy! Yes that is what I am talking about-- he did say that it needed to run through the cabinets and snake through the roof. I guess after he said that moving the prep sink would not work, my heart sank, so I was not fully listening to what he said about that vent. And no, he did not consult with the plumber--I just asked him when it was just me, him and DH around. I will ask and do some research about this loop/studor vent. Although if my above idea about putting the sink in the 24" cabinet and having a 30" drawer base is possible, then DH might not be crazy about this idea since he is REALLY concerned about drawer space. Current layout only the following base cabinets: 1-18, 1-15, 1-12 and then whatever the sink is NOT in so:
- 18" if sink is in lazy susan
- 30" if sink is in 24" base
- lazy susan if sink is in 18" base.
Thoughts?

Thanks again Breezy!

I'm a bit scattered this morning and trying to do my entry for the Horton Brasses hardware contest so I'm not getting the other storage scenarios you're talking about without seeing a drawing. Sorry.

But your vent absolutely does NOT, NOT have to go through the roof. Unless part of what you didn't hear in your disappointment-deafness (LOL) explained why a Studor vent or loop vent won't work. With a full basement under the kitchen, I cannot imagine why it wouldn't work.

Again, no offense to your GC, but talk to the plumber. Island sinks and peninsula sinks are put in everyday with these types of vents. I feel like I'm being pushy. I just want you to have the sink in the spot where it works best. You can do it!

I have a sink in my island, as do others, and none of us have vent pipes through the roof from them! Mine is a loop, too. I think he is short on knowledge for this type of thing, but there should be a solution for you.

Will you be able to access the sink well if it's in a 24" cab that opens toward the dining area? Do you have a corner counter like that so you could mock it up? I think that could be a good solution if it gets you one major set of drawers. Won't it also enable you to have a wider cabinet next to the stove, instead of tiny #9?

Thanks Breezy & Rhome! I will talk with the plumber and GC about this other venting option.

So I guess my options are as follows:
1. 15 base - 30 range - 12 base - lazy susan corner - prep sink in 18" with a 10" overhang on peninsula
2. 15 base - 30 range - 24 base - 24 base with prep sink (opening towards DR) - 30 base with a 10" overhang on peninsula
3. 15 base - 30 range -21 base - 24 base with prep sink (opening towards DR) - 30 base and 12" overhang on peninsula

I like option 3 I just don't know how well the sink in the corner will work. Thoughts? Unfortunately since the kitchen is demo'd down to the studs I cannot do a good mock up.

Otherwise, option 1 is not bad either.

Thanks!!!

Actually, with the kitchen to the studs, this is an easy time to get boxes and mock it up or to at least tape it out on the floor because you don'have anything else in the way -- so I'd run out to a boxes/moving store or the hardware store for a roll of painters tape and get busy.

It sounds like you are planning one less cabinet than you have drawn. Your description above would put the prep sink in option one in the box labelled 10, not 11. That would really chop up your counter space. We all mentioned 11 and I didn't see that as overhang until just now, but I'm confused because 11 seems larger than 10. Maybe we need to be clear what we are looking at.

Can I suggest considering something on another front? I was thinking you might wind up putting a rolling cart or small table on the side of the range under the window -- something you could move if needed. You would need less clearance there and possibly less often, if you put you smaller cabs (5 and 6) on the ends, one on each end to keep the symmetry or possibly both where 7 is now.

Use 2 tables put together in an L? Tape it out on the floor? That's what I did to decide my prep sink size. ;-)

If I had a corner, I'd do it for you and take a pic. Maybe later I can put it in my drafting software and see how it looks...But right now I'm helping DH find his wallet, which may be in the big rocks at the beach WAAAAY out at his brother's house. 45 minutes each way to maybe find it, and I get to drive since he has no license. Fun. In the meantime, I hope someone helps. If not, at least a rendering by tomorrow.

Hope you find it rhome! You've helped so many people, you deserve some good karma here.

Yes, tables or any other furniture you can move around will work too.

Going back out in the 95+ heat to spread some mulch.

Thanks, Lascatx! I decided to try this before we take off on the treasure hunt. I have no idea if it will help at all. Better to try to mock it up in something you can stand in front of...but here it is with sink in corner 24" cabinet, with 24" cab next to range and 30" drawers on peninsula. Not the best for using the sink, but no too terrible either, I don't think, if you can get the sink scooted as far toward the kitchen (that inner corner of the counter) as possible.

Rhome - you are such a doll! Thanks for the drawing!! I hope your husband finds his wallet soon! I just came back from planting tomato plants in the 90+ degree heat. :(

Lascatx- I am not fond of breaking up the counterspace but the advantages of the way it is drawn out in Rhome's photo are 1) I would have a 24" & 30" drawer base instead of 12" and 18" and 2) a sink in the 90 degree corner may not be ideal, but if the sink was on the end of the peninsula-- would I end up standing in the corner to prep? I think that would be worse.

I know circuspeanut has a similar setup but with a round sink where mine is 15.25x15.5. Maybe I need a smaller sink?

I will think on this... so many pros and cons to consider. Many thanks Rhome!

Remember that if you put drawers on both sides like that, you'll need a spacer somewhere so the drawer fronts and pulls don't collide...Would just push the 30" cabinet toward the fridge a couple of inches, or the peninsula toward the table.

Still not clear on the options, because I thought you were looking at 2 cabinets on the peninsula, beyond the corner cabinet, with the sink in the farthest one out. That would give you one larger work area. If that's not what it was, then you just gain the corner space which can be of limited function and you lose good side space.

Prepping in a corner isn't bad if your workspace and location are good. With the sink in the corner, I would still think you'd be prepping in the corner -- you'd just be in the center of 2 workspaces -- and that could work out

Your first drawing shows an upper cabinet. Would that run over the sink? That will limit the room above the faucet, so keep that in mind.

I have a sink about the same size and put the faucet on the corner so that we could access the sink from either side of the island. You might want to consider that and look at the corners on the breakfast room side. I stood at the corner of mine and I could reach it. I'm tall, but I also have about a 4-1/2 inch setback there because of a tilt out tray in front of that sink.

I'm starting to think the corner might be better, especially if I didn't understand the peninsula correctly.

I still vote for the end of the peninsula. ;). But I've never worked at a corner sink so what do I know?

I'll try to get you a rendering of the sink at the end to compare...But after dinner or tomorrow.

After DH and I ran all over the world looking for his wallet...His office, the auto parts store where he remembers having it last, aaaaalll the way out to his brothers and the hike down to the beach and back up the steep hill, and to his parents' house where he's been working on cabinets, etc., our youngest dd found it...In our bedroom. Of course. Just happy not to be canceling credit cards and replacing his driver's license!

Rhome- sorry to hear about your wild goose chase! But luckily you found it.

Lacatz- My range wall peninsula is made up of 4 cabinets. A 15" to the left of the range (#8) and a 12" to the right of the range (#9) and the peninsula is made up of two cabinets a corner cabinet (#10) and the end of the peninsula cabinet (#11). However, one of the options is that if I would get rid of the corner cabinet I could make #9 a 24" cabinet and put another 24" in the corner (to replace #10)that would open from the dining room for the prep sink. I would also replace #11 with a 30" cabinet. I hope that clears it up. My kitchen is really small. :)

Lacatz - yeah my peninsula is only made up of 2 cabinets including the corner. The peninsula is only 55 inches plus 1.50" overhang. There is no overhang shown in the original drawing. My kitchen is 10'9" wide. So my peninsula area is not very large. I hope that clarifies things. So if my prep sink is at the end in an 18" cabinet. Then to prep I will be standing in the corner to prep. The other option puts the sink in the corner and then I can stand in front of the 30" drawer base to prep. Neither option is ideal, but only so much I can do with a small space.

Thoughts?

Rhome, glad you found it and you know it was safe while you were searching. Ir's always the last place you look, isn't it? ;-)

OK, I looked at it again and see there are two 10s. I wondered how that corner was supposed to work. Duh!

Your space between the range and corner is 24" in either case, right? If you put the sink in the corner, you have two 24" work spaces. If you put the sink over on the peninsula, you still have only 2 feet of workspace between the range and corner, but you will have some use of the counter space going into your corner. The foot that will be behind you on the peninsula is not going to be a lot of help facing the range wall, but it would be a landing space for things going to or from the sink or allow a bit of spread room.

People may differ as to which version they would prefer. I would want at least one 3-4 foot space in my kitchen because I work a bit spread out, but I suspect that you have been working with smaller spaces up until now. For you, having 2 24" spaces might be a real plus. Think about how you have been working and what you would like to have different. Which comes closest to doing that for you?

Meant to say before -- DO NOT get a smaller sink. You could shave a few inches on the corners with a round one, but you still need 15-16 inches to have enough room for pots, colanders, and to wash veggies without a ton of splashing, etc. Yours is like mine and I wouldn't have it any smaller.

Lascatx- Almost. But there are not two-10s, just one. the extra little part you see (that makes it look like 2-10s) is the 12" opening to the L-shaped lazy susan cabinet. So the numbering on the drawing above is accurate.

Also due to the narrowness of my kitchen the peninsula has to be less than 60 inches (ideally around 55). The corner cabinet is 37x37 so if it stays the cabinet to the right of the range can only be 12". If I put the sink is a 24" cabinet that opens from the dining room side (ie backwards) then I can increase the 12" cabinet to 24" because I gained those 12" (37-24 = 12). I could also gain a 30" drawer base instead of an 18" (55-24 = 32). However, the only way the backwards cabinet would be practical is to put a sink in it.

Doest that make sense?

Yeah -- I had all that. I just didn't look at the numbers that closely the first time I saw your drawing to see that you were intending to mark those two boxes as one cabinet. We're saying the same thing differently.

Two feet is not a huge workspace, but I mistated the other side -- that would actually be 30". The total space is the same, but more of it is up front and unobstructed with the sink in the corner. And you are not walled in anywhere -- part of that workspace is your sink to rinse and dump in. Like it or not, the range becomes a landing spot. Some of the realities of a small space. But do mock it up -- if only with painter's tape, measuring tapes on your table or a bathroom counter. You are the one that has to get comfortable that you can work in the space and I don't know what you just tore out that you are comparing it too.

Whatever you do, with a small space like that, I would get a positive reveal on your sink (hope it is undermount) and have a cutting board cut to fit the reveal and a colander that hangs across the open space so that you have options for expanding your work area. You might even consider a narrow basket type colander and a cutting board in two sections so that you can use one and have space for water to flow or the colander. Think modular. IKEA might even have some goodies like that.

The space is all so close that I am not sure it makes much difference, but you may have a preference for working with one L shaped space -- or maybe two more open spaces that you can work between and pivot as needed. That's why you need to mark it out and play with it. When you do, think about how many times you use multiple burners on your cooktop -- that could mean the space isn't available as a landing spot. Then what? Do you still have enough room to work?

Compare work space and cabinet space...and do mock up if you can.

Thank you Rhome for the drawings. Gosh right now it is so difficult. I did email my GC about the Studor/Loop vent and am awaiting to hear back from him.

If anyone has a similar layout I would appreciate your thoughts. I will try to do a mockup tonight.

That counter space looks better with the sink on the end, but I am concerned about how an upper cabinet will impact each layout by making that corner less accessible.

One option I don't think you've considered is to have 24" drawer next to the range, 24" facing the table (could be great for linens, napkins, less used items, perhaps some small appliances like a toaster....), then a narrow cabinet for vertical storage or narrow drawers for utensils and such and then the sink -- kind of a hybrid of you other two ideas.

Lascatx- Would that hybrid you described be better than the lazy susan? I have never had a lazy susan before, but I know that people like them. I am okay with the lazy susan... I just cannot make up my mind about this sink. I am also still waiting to hear back from my GC about the venting question.

You are trading a narrow cabinet and lazy susan for 2 24" cabs...one all drawers. Unless you have specific use for that narrow cabinet beside the stove, I could see a benefit to that arrangement over the lazy susan.

Most counters and corners have uppers over, so I don't think that's going to impact things? As long as it's a standard depth...12-15". Unless I didn't read well enough and am missing your point, Lascatx...Which is entirely possible!

Rhome, I like the ideas you drew above. My thought on changing the the 12 & Corner for 2-24s and to have the prep sink at then end of the peninsula, it would still require a 12" base and a 18" sink base. So I would still have a 12" cabinet just in a different location and I would have two-24s instead of either a 30 and 24 or a 37 and 12. Does that make sense?

I've never had a lazy susan. I don't even have a corner in this kitchen. The benefit as I see it is that it is supposed to give you easier access to that deep corner space that is so often difficult to use effectively. The problem is that it requires a lot of space. In your kitchen, it doesn't leave you with a lot besides it. If it does't hold as much as you need it to or the things it holds don't work well there, well, you have a specialty cabinet taking up half the non-appliance space on that side of the kitchen.

As for upper cabinet issue, the back of the 15 inch sink is likely to sit back from the side of that 24 inch cabinets 16 to 18 inches. The faucet is likely to be centered back from there another 3-4 inches, which is under the upper cabinet. A pull down is a better choice for that size sink than a pull out or other shorter faucet, so that overhead cabinet starts to become restrictive. I'd find it cramped and uncomfortable to be reaching under that upper cabinet to use the sink, If you put the faucet on the corner nearer the end of the peninsula, you break up that section of counter even more and you make it even more difficult for the sink to be used from the table side. It might work for you, but the thought concerns me.

Ughh.. I still have not heard back from the GC about the vent issue and I did not have time to do a mock up (had to go to sears to buy appliances before the sale ended!). I just hate my options. DH keeps saying we should eliminate the prep sink and that if the prep sink is in the 18" cabinet at the end of the peninsula-- that it would look dumb to have the prep sink so close to the main sink. ARGGH!! I just want to tear my hair out!!!

Thanks for letting me vent.

having a prep sink on the same counter as prepping is a HUGE improvement than going across the kitchen to the sink (especially if you are prepping meats).

I have two corners in my current kitchen with lazy susan just under my main prepping area (I have a sink- main sink, lazy susan and range- 90 degree from sink)- almost what you will have only you will have more counter (this skinny cabinet next to your range). I would say that will give you good prepping space- not great, but still sufficient in my opinion). I almost like mine, but it is too tight, but I also have my KA mixer there and an electric kettle and brita pitcher, so much more clutter than you probably will have) and I think that this extra foot will give you what I am missing.

Lazy susan under your prepping- I like it- I have my oils, vinegar, large prepping bowls and some of my frying pans and pots there and it is a very efficient use of corner space as I can get what I need in front of that cabinet when I rotate the tray- and I almost do not need to move that much to access the content). My other corner cabinet is just shelves- more storage, but what a horrible access.

Drawers may give you more storage, but lazy susan does not need you to step back so far as drawers will require to access the content. As other said- mock it and see what do you prefer. I know that for me the drawers at 90 degree of each other would call for constant scratches of drawer faces and "traffic jams" when I want to access items from two different stack of drawers that open at 90 degree of each other...

Efs- Thanks for the insight. So you think that Option 2 of Rhome's drawings (sink at end of peninsula) as opposed to Option 1 (sink in corner of peninsula) is the better way to go? Do you find it difficult to prep in the corner? Or would you rather have the sink in the corner?

Thanks for the input!

I prefer the sink on the end of the peninsula.

In a scenario where one person is cooking and another is prepping, the corner sink wouldn't work well, IMHO. Too crowded.

Since you can access the corner from the seating side of the peninsula, have you considered putting a cabinet door facing that way? That way, you can access the "blind" area without having to deal with a lazy susan. It won't be convenient to access, but you can use it to store weird items that don't get used often (table linens, holiday items, bundt pans, random wedding gifts), or to store overflow bulk food items. I think you'd end up with more storage that way.

Your kitchen is small enough that you could get away without a prep sink, BUT everything that will need to be washed, rinsed or add water, as well as everything that needs to be drained strained or the egg goo washed off your hands while cooking, dough hands if baking -- all of that will be crossing the broadest part of your kitchen floor. Remind DH that a prep sink is something you have for function, not appearances. The real question is whether it makes your work in and use of the kitchen better and easier more than having that 18" as countertop.

Sorry for your frustration, but it's a normal part of going through so many choices. Small spaces have their own set of challenges, but getting it right is that much better too.

I read your original message once more and see you already have the corner lazy susan cabinet. If you put the sink there, and no lazy susan you will loose easy access to this storage space- correct? What will you use the corner cabinet for if you were to put the sink there?

efs- see Rhome's first drawing. There will be two 24" cabinets next to each other (one to the right of the sink and the other abutting it with the sink in it, which would be open from the DR side of the peninsula) and then there would be a 30" cabinet and the end of the peninsula.

I am going back and sticking with my first recommendation that the prep sink be in the 18" cab at the end of the peninsula. There IS a way to vent a sink in a peninsula or island, so that shouldn't be an issue. If you don't like facing the corner, you can prep facing the stove, with the corner offering you extended space to spread out, as well as around the corner toward the sink. I'm quite confidant you'll adapt and make it work fine. The uninterrupted space is always better than splitting it up.

Lascatx is right that you could get along without the prep sink, but as she, I, and others have said, it's about better function. Having that sink in a place so handy to the work area will be SO nice. No dripping across the kitchen, no carrying hot pots of water across the room, and across potential traffic. No prepping food over dirty dishes. I don't usually like prep sinks that are in close proximity to cleanup sinks, but that's when they encourage prep and cleanup tasks happening in the same aisle, or when it crowds the water sources together, leaving a good portion of the work area without access to either...Yours isn't like that.

Thanks Rhome- I agree. I do think that Option 2 is the best option-- I wish my GC would get back to me, b/c I think I am trying to convince myself that both are good options. I really want the prep sink and I think I will get a ton of use out of it. DH's thought is that the kitchen is small, two sinks are not necessary and he hates the idea of cutting a whole into the slab of soapstone. Hopefully I will hear from my GC today!

Two sinks so close to each other doesn't look stupid. I wouldn't put them so close if you had another excellent place to put it. In your case, you don't. I'd much rather my kitchen function well for me than look a certain way.

You will use a prep sink every single day, and you'll love it. The end of the peninsula is still my vote. I've prepped in a corner before with a bit more space than you have and with my sink to my right. It took me a day or two to get used to it, then I really liked it.

Is there any way you can contact your plumber directly instead of going through the GC? Even if the GC gets back to you, you'll still be hearing the info second hand. You'll get clearer answers if you can talk directly to the the plumber. Things get lost in translation. Maybe you could all three (or four with DH) meet to talk?

Thanks Breezy! I am with you. DH is just concerned that we are spending a lot of money for soapstone and I am putting a hole into it for my prep sink--which he does understand. Also does not help that DH does not cook. Also good idea- I will try following up with our plumber. Thanks again!

Well, if the second option refers to the second drawing, I agree. I'm back to putting the sink at the end, but I'd figure the cabinet configuration around that and what your storage needs are. Time to inventory all the things you need to have places for and figure out where they will go and what type of cabinets arrangement will be best.

Personally, I found the 2 drawer stacks appealing and would look at the 24 next to the stove, the 24 turned towards the table and then maybe a 12 divider cabinet (trays, baking sheets, cutting boards, and maybe your wraps in the small drawer above) and then your sink base. Does IKEA have a sink base or vanity cabinet with doors and a drawer below? That might give you one more drawer in that prime work area.

Good question Lascatx- but I am not sure. I will have to do some research on that. Since things have changed so much it is probably not a bad idea to re-inventory where things are going and go from there. I just wish DH was not fighting me so much on having a prep sink. He says he has always disliked the idea (which is true) but he was okay with me

Whichever place you put it, do put one in. Stand your ground, it's not always easy, but I'd give up anything else, anything!, before giving up my prep sink. It's soooo useful, and it's also not that far, geographically, from my main sing, but in terms of function they are like different continents. Really, it's so nice to have prep going in a clear spot convenient to the stove top -- either spot you choose, though if you're right handed, I think you'll work more efficiently with it on your right as you prep). My DH was also not really on board initially and was reluctant to call the GC to make the change order but Buehl's zone drawings convinced him of the benefits, and now ( a year later) he loves having it and has started cooking a lot whereas he didn't have any interest before -- really, the wonderfulness of a well-placed prep sink can't be overstated. Hang in there, it makes a lot of sense in your set up and is worth fighting for.

DH is just concerned that we are spending a lot of money for soapstone and I am putting a hole into it for my prep sink--...Also does not help that DH does not cook.

Remind me to hug my dh for respecting my opinion in designing/setting up my own work area!

The point here is that you are spending a lot of money to have a more functional kitchen and get it 'right.' That sink will help you a lot, and saving that little piece of soapstone doesn't compare. Make a trivet out of it or something, so he feels it's still valuable. ;-)

There goes Rhome, so eloquent as usual. Well-said. Much better than I would have said it. I think it would be a shame to spend all that money on a new kitchen and NOT have the most functional kitchen you can.

Any word from the plumber yet?

Thanks Rhoome & Kris_ma- I am holding my ground on this sink. Its just that I have a TON going on at work right now and that is more stressful than the kitchen remodel-- and that says a lot!! Rhome- give your hubby a hug from me too!! Because I am ready to kill mine! Normally he is really great, but him iwth this sink issue is just driving me crazy. I know in the end he will let me have it--since I am the one that cooks and this remodel is more of my baby than his. But its difficult having someone second guess you.

Breezy- I am with you! I want functional first, pretty second. Not that I think my sink is not pretty but I know I am going to love having it. My old kitchen (I have no kitchen right now) went 12" cabinet, range, blind corner cabinet, 30 sink base 12 cabinet. That was my kitchen! I did all of my prep on that small space between the sink and range and it worked! But it would very odd NOT to have a sink right where I prep.

Hopefully the plumber will call back soon!!

Breezy, Rhome and others- THANK YOU!!!! After thinking about it and looking at Rhome's drawings, I really wanted my prep sink that the end of peninsula rather than in the cabinet against the wall. Thanks to ya'll, you told me talk to my plumber about a loop vent rather than rely on GC. Well I want to say YOU WERE RIGHT! Talked to the plumber, loop vent is the way to go! Granted it is going to cost me around $300 since he has to move it from where I originally told him (my bad) but I think it will be money well spent. THANK AGAIN!!!!!

So glad you posted back. I've been wondering what happened with it. Good for you for asking for what you want. $300 might seem like a lot now, but in a year from now when you're busy whipping up some homemade strawberry shortcake in your new kitchen you'll know it was money well spent.

I'm so happy for you! Can't wait to see the installed sink.

Yay! We get a little numb to numbers in this process, but $300 in the cost of a kitchen remodel is worth it to get something improved that will be so crucial in your use of the kitchen.