What are the dimensions of your room? Can you extend the wall with the fridge on it out a bit? Could you possibly put the range in between the windows? Hard to tell what your options might be without a floorplan type of layout with dimensions.

I like the design with the stove on the bi-level island. I have mine on my peninsula with a raised bar like you show. I haven't found it to be a safety issue in the least! I love standing at the stove and looking into the dining area (instead of a wall). Before this reno we had our stove on the peninsula without a raised bar or seating and it also overlooked the kitchen table area. I adore this set up. I've lived with this set up for over 20 years. And I also broke another rule that some GW'ers shudder about . . . I don't have an exhaust fan . . . and I never, ever have any problems with odors or grime. Must be the way I cook?

Anyway, your design shows plenty of prep space to the right of the sink, easy access to the refrigerator and to the sink so that family/friends can get a drink or wash up, etc without having to interrupt the cook. I like it . . . I think it's workable.

judydel - thanks for the input & pic. The only thing I am debating on the island is whether or not we'd get better use out of having one large counter area vs putting the range there. I'm not really worried about the range being in an island as long as I have enough room on either side.

I attached a couple of more pics. The first one is our entire living area so you can see how it will fit in with the rest of the house. The second has dimensions.

I really don't want to extend the wall the fridge is on any further (I'm already extending from it is currently), because I think it will make the entryway more hall like, and also eat into the living area more than I want. The stove could fit between the windows, but if we want to keep the sink in front of the windows they will be right next to each other - maybe I could get 18" between them but that would be the most. We don't want the sink on the island and I don't want to put it up against a wall.

{{!gwi}}

{{!gwi}}

Anybody?

Well, it's really up to you. In your first set of pictures, there's a hood over the cooktop on the island. Is this going to be something that will work for you? Will it block space and light?

If so, maybe the cooktop on the perimeter would work better. Honestly, I'm not loving your window placement (sorry). Can you move them, at all? If you put in one window, starting on the left half of the window, closest to the fridge, with your sink under it, that might work better. Then you could take out the window on the other side and put the range in that area. This would give you a nice work triangle, with the island left for prep and seating.

I would also put the pantry on the other end (like option 2 w/ perimeter cooktop) and slide the fridge down to the end of the counter space.

Where are you putting the microwave? In the island, or maybe next to the fridge?

Here's a rough idea :)

{{!gwi}}

I think we can deal with an island hood. As far as the windows,that's where they are now and and we don't want to move the location. Right now, the one on the right actually extends down about 6" lower than counter height, so I'm removing that one and putting it in the garage (never replaced that one when I replaced the rest of the house). The new one will match the height of the current one near the sink, although I've toyed with the idea of doing a counter height window. Actually I thought about making that entire wall windows but my wife is holding me back ;) Actually, the porch on the otherside of that wall has 3 brick arches and the windows are centered in 2 of them (the front door is centered in the other).

I was thinking of putting the MW in the area next to the frige.

Well, it sounds like you've decided on a plan. Good luck with your kitchen :)

Hi jdew, I remember you and your kitchen!

Anyhoo, IIRC, your island is generously sized so putting the range there works IMO. You could scoot it down towards the fridge as long as you leave yourself with sufficient landing space. I have 16" to the left of my island cooktop, which is also prime landing space for items from fridge, pantry and wall oven. I hate it, it's not enough for me. We lack the room to enlarge our island (only 16" on either side of the cooktop) so I'm moving our cooktop to the perimeter when we redo our kitchen. But that's me and you don't seem to have as much going on at that end of the kitchen as I do. Just walk it through in your mind and make sure you aren't cheating yourself on space.

As for your second plan with the range on the same wall as the fridge ... I can't tell dimensions but it seems tight with all of your kitchen action happening in one area and lots of empty counter in other areas. If this is more than a one-cook kitchen, there could be lots of bumping going on. Also, your sink is a long way off, which would mean lots of walking: fridge to sink and then back to range to cook a meal. More than 1 cook - increased chances of tripping over each other. Adding a prep sink in the island could reduce this.

Didn't you also have a plan that had the range between the windows? And maybe the sink in the island? It's been awhile so I could be remembering incorrectly.

I also seem to recall someone asking you how you would use your island if it lacked range or sink. Lots of real estate without a designated purpose or something to that effect. But I don't remember your answer.

Lisa_a - Yes - it was probably last winter when I posted about this the first time. I actually tried to find that thread but wasn't successful.

The only reason I was considering moving it towards the fridge was so that it would be spaced away a little more from the sink so that if there are people standing at each at the same time there is no chance to bump butts. The spacing between the back counter & the island will be around 40-42" so I thought that would help with any congestion. I'm hoping since there is a pretty big expanse of counter right in front of the window to the left of the fridge, that can act as a landing area for it. Plus moving the range over a bit creates a larger (30") wide area to the right of the range for slicing & dicing or what ever.

If I put the range on the wall next to the fridge, there would only be about 18" between them. I agree that seems tight, but there would be a bunch of space on the counter left of the range but with the range in the corner, I agree it kind of creates a congested area and seems to pose a challenge as far as where to place the pantry.

I think there was a version with range between the windows but I think we've talked ourselves out of putting the main sink in the island. I know some people like them there but I'm not "feeling it". I like having the sink by the windows with the DW next to it & having the storage for the dishes & glasses right there too.

If the island was with out a sink or stove I think it would be used to prep, make sandwiches, etc. & I'm sure it would act as a second table as well. But our dining room table is not far away if we need that much space. With the range in the island I can see us using the larger space on one side of the island for "minor" food prep, any large scale food prep I guess will occur on the counter behind the island.

I like the range in the island. That plan makes more sense and feels more balanced. My SIL has a cooktop in her island, with seating on the other side, and it works out very well.

I'm with red_eared_slider - I prefer your plan with the range in the island. I also don't think that keeping it centered in the island is a big deal. Your sink and range don't appear to be butt to butt in your drawings.

However, moving it towards the fridge does give you the advantage of having 30" of prep space to one side. Do you ever have more than two people at the range? If so, that means one would be working with less counter space. Would that be a problem for the way you cook and live? Would there be jockeying for the side of the range with more counter space? That's what would happen in our house. Not that I could ever place a range off center. That would drive my engineer hubby crazy. LOL

Do you have kids? How old are they?

This is typically what happens with these plans:
Bi-level island range: the kids will do homework on the dining room table and you will end up eating dinner on the island because they will not have cleared the table fast enough during the crunch hours of the evening. If you want to eat on the table, you will have to really train the kids/adults to clear and set the table ASAP as the dinner is ready. The island being two levels makes it nearly impossible for the kids to do homework on it. My next door neighbor had a bi-level island with range. They remodeled, and dropped the bi-level to single level and kept the range on the island. The kids can now do some homework on the island. I think bi-level with a range is a better plan for adult type of entertaining.

We know another family that has a kitchen table and a single level island with range. The kids never sit on the island. Mostly because they can see the TV from the table but not from the island. They also do not eat as a family much. The kids get fed separately on the kitchen table while watching TV and adults eat later...

flat island: the kids will do homework on the island and they can leave their work spread out, eat dinner on the table and go back to finishing their work on the island. I have this type of arrangement and this works quite well for my kids at this stage of life (11 and 8). I think they will continue to do their work on the island until they are well into high school. Even if I am prepping, there is enough room for the kids to work on the island and spread their paper. I find that it is nice for them to be near me so I can help them with their work. It lets me keep in touch with what is happening with their work and we "talk" as they are working. (my island is 8 ft x 40 inches)

I also have a kitchen desk with computer on it and the kids often work there. But the space is not as luxurious, and the kids want to be on the island facing mom rather than on the desk facing the wall.

Hope this give you different perspectives about diffenret arrangements. I think you have to visualize how your days will flow in the room, not just how your cooking will flow in the room that you are creating. There is no one right answer. You have to create the lifestyle that suits you.

Good luck. Your kitchen will look beautiful.

Actually we have 2 boys - 4 & 7. That's a great point about the use of the island. We had debated about going 1 level or 2 but I think you have conviced us to go with a single level.

On the plan with the range on the island I show an 18" pantry next to the fridge. What do you think of having an 18" pantry there (or maybe even a 24"), and on the opposite end have a tall shallow (12") pantry rather than the separate lowers & uppers I show. I was thinking that would free up a little floor space on that end and would give some nice storage as well. We have plenty of base cabinets so I don't think we'd miss them in that area.

Normally, I don't like ranges in islands and I'm not thrilled with this one either. But, if it's b/w the two, then I prefer the first one, with one caveat...you really need at least 24" b/w the range and the edge of each counter...sides and back. So, I would not move the range any closer than 24" from the island edge on either side.

I would also consider not placing a seat directly behind the range...not just for safety reasons (although that is one reason), but also b/c I know i wouldn't want anyone sitting there if I were boiling water, browning meat, or frying/stir-frying. The steam and/or grease will be "in the face" of anyone sitting there...even someone sitting at a raised counter. IF you get really, really good venting, then it might be OK. But, I wouldn't want children sitting there regardless. Instead, consider placing a cabinet directly behind the range for extra storage with seating on either side.

Also realize that island venting is more expensive than wall venting. One reason is b/c the rangehood has to be finished on all sides. The other reasons have to do with size and power.

Since an island (or peninsula) is subject to more and stronger air currents/movement, it becomes even more important that the hood be at least 6" wider than the range and 27" deep...this extra width & depth make it more likely the capture area will be large enough to catch the smoke/grease/odors/steam/etc. that begin to drift and spread immediately. The extra 3" on each side, front, and back helps capture that drifting/spreading smoke/steam/etc.

Your rangehood should also have more powerful cfms to capture the smoke/steam/odors/etc...especially if you mount it higher than manufacturer recommendations...which you may have to b/c of the raised counter (otherwise the rangehood will be in the face of someone sitting behind or near it).

Also know that a raised counter offers issues of its own...be sure you have sufficient surface area to allow papers (including newspapers) to be on that surface w/o being in danger of flames (if gas) or even extreme heat near the papers. Additionally, be sure the counter surface is deep enough to accommodate a 12" plate plus drinking glass w/o having to worry about the plate or glass falling off the surface if you move or nudge it. If you provide a 24" buffer b/w the range and the edge of the counter, you should have plenty of room as well as a safe eating/congregating area.

Thanks all for your input.

I've already looked into ceiling mounted hoods and I think we'll be able to make something work with out getting too expensive. I think we'll definately go with a single level now that we've thought about the input you've given us.

Still debating on the 18" / 30" on each side or 24" each side. If I didn't have a big expanse of counter behind the island (next to the fridge) I think I would definately want to keep the 24" on both sides but with it there I think giving up a few inches on the fridge side to get more on the other side might make sense too. In our current layout there is no counter on one side of the range and the range is only about 12" between the range & a countertop corner.

jdew, if you said, I missed it: what type of fridge do you have? Is it a French door, side-by-side or single door model? I'm not going by your drawings because the depiction may be limited by your software. Here's why I ask.

We used to have a side-by-side and now have a French door fridge. Although we have ample counter to the left of our fridge, it is much more convenient to set fridge items on the island in front of the fridge - a straight path from fridge to counter - not on the counter next to the fridge, which would mean maneuvering around an open door.

If, however, we had a single door fridge with a right hand swing, this would not be an issue. It would be a straight path from open fridge to the counter next to the fridge.

So if you haven't already, add in your fridge style (and whether that will change anytime soon) and its door swing as you determine how much island counter you need to the fridge side of your range. You may realize that you don't mind working around an open fridge door, if need be, for what you gain with the island configuration but it's best to figure this out now and not in hindsight. (There's never a time machine around when you need one. LOL)

Lisa - its a side by side, but when this one dies it'll probably be a french door style.

Next week I've got a structural engineer coming out to look at wall between the family room & little hall on the left side of the kitchen. I'm 90% sure its not load bearing but want to verify that. If its not, then the post I am showing to the left of the island will not need to be there. That, and the use of a 12" deep pantry I show to the left of the sink in one of th pics will let me extend the island about 6" in that direction. So I may be able to keep my 2' on the fridge side & still get 30" on the other.