Hi mumof4_boston,

Your design is remarkably like ours (including the island shape)

In our design we shifted our beverage fridge from the island to the last cabinet before the door to our backyard (located where it looks like you have a sliding door).

We don't have the angled counter end like you. We placed it there so it was accessible from the yard and from the screen porch which is accessed via a slider to the left of where your second island is.

SO, I think either location works well.....just do what makes sense for you.

The only thing we did differently was to place the ovens in the corner of the "L". We didn't want them opening in the mudroom to family room pathway. That's partly because our playroom is off the mudroom hallway and the downstairs bathroom is in the same area of the home. The same corner where the mudroom door is also has a door to our pantry/laundry room which doesn't help either. So we have tall shallow pantries on that wall.

Otherwise, looks good and functional.

Well, you already know how I feel about the refrigerator and cooktop, so I won't repeat it here.

Desk: Unless you really think you will use it as a "desk", I suggest putting in a lower cabinet instead. Perhaps use the top drawer for pens, etc. and either drawers or shelved cabinet for phone books, directories, etc. The counter could have phones charging (unless you put them in a drawer or the upper cabinet). There was a discussion a while ago about "desks" in kitchens--most people were eliminating them.

Some threads w/Message Centers & desks:

Thread: Message center size
Thread: Can I see your message centers?
Thread: Best advice from this forum

Oh no Buehl! I thought you would approve of my changes :)! The refrig. is now out of the main traffic area from mudroom and is closer to the prep/cooking area and the oven is in the middle of the main traffic area (better than the end). I was concerned that the refrig. on the oven wall would look to cramped, but I don't think it does.

I appreciate your ideas on message center. I am going to read all of the threads and think about it.

thanks again for taking the time!!!!

Oh no Buehl! I thought you would approve of my changes :)! The refrig. is now out of the main traffic area from mudroom and is closer to the prep/cooking area and the oven is in the middle of the main traffic area (better than the end). I was concerned that the refrig. on the oven wall would look to cramped, but I don't think it does.

I appreciate your ideas on message center. I am going to read all of the threads and think about it.

thanks again for taking the time!!!!

I would trade the positions of the oven and the fridge, even though that's a traffic way. I prefer my cooking stuff to be together so that I don't have to walk a long way through traffic to put a hot skillet full of seared dinner into the oven. Also, having the fridge there would eliminate the need for a bev fridge, and keep snackers out of the cook zone. I would even consider shortening the island if needed to maintain a wide enough aisle to put the fridge there. But that's my opinion based on my cooking habits; yours may differ.

I second Beuhl's suggestion to ditch the desk for a well planned message center. Our old kitchen had a desk that just collected junk, and eventually got promoted to holding the microwave. Now we have a tall cabinet that we use to hold messages, stow mail, and it also contains a charging center for the phones, camera etc. And the best part is the doors close so the clutter never shows!

I just think the cooktop wall is too crowded and that the cooktop doesn't have enough landing/work space...especially on the left. Additionally, to fit the refrigerator, you had move the cooktop to the right and now it's crowding the sink as well. I guess I just like a more open feel when I'm cooking, but that's me.

The next thing I noticed is the DW. It's to the left of the sink. With the cooktop so close to the sink counter run, you will not be able to open the DW and have someone at the cooktop at the same time. I suggest moving the DW to the other side of the sink (right) and, if there's a trash pullout next to the sink, move it to the left of the sink so it can be shared by both the sink & cooktop.

If you do switch the ovens & refrigerator, you'll gain 5" or so of counterspace (I think your refrigerator is 37" + 3/4" finished panel on the left and on the right) and the oven cabinet is 33" and shouldn't need finished panels. With the limited space, 5" can be significant.

I do like your new island setup, btw...and it leaves plenty of room for the "large" island and a table & chairs, which I know you really wanted.

Just more thoughts!

I am beginning to be convinced. I am going to sleep on it, discuss with my husband and we will see. All of your points make tons of sense. My biggest concern is the fridge (that we open 100s of times a day as oppossed to the ovens which I do not use frequently at all) will be in the main walkway and I think it would get in the way there all the time and be annoying. What do you think?

I really appreciate your comment on the DW. Never thought about that. I liked having the DW close to where I will store the dishes, but I will find a place for them close by (maybe in the islnd in a drawer?). Thanks again!

...the fridge (that we open 100s of times a day as oppossed to the ovens which I do not use frequently at all)...

If you open the refrigerator that often, I'd rather not have it in the cooking area to constantly be interrupted. If it's in the outer aisle, it's out of the way of the prepping and cooking area but still easily accessible if you need something from it. Meanwhile, all the people going back & forth b/w the refrigerator and the rest of the house are staying out from underfoot!

Additionally, putting it in the outer aisle makes it more accessible to the eating areas...island, table, FR (snacking!), and DR.

If you and DH really like the refrigerator where it is, then by all means, leave it there. I just wanted to point out pros & cons of the current layout and moving it.

Well, back to frosting Christmas cookies! Merry Christmas!

HTH!