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feddup

GC threw away product literature, etc.

11 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago

My GC threw away all the literature that comes with the products he installed in remodeling my bathrooms. This is the first time I didn't have user-purchased, contractor-installed terms, and I didn't think much of it til I asked for the warranties, product registration, care instructions, etc., that come with new faucets, sinks, toilets, etc. He just shrugged and said he pitched them. We're at a point where we're ready to punch each other anyway--he is many months past the promised completion date. I wouldn't be surprised if he did this to spite me, but in any case, what do I do? If a product fails, how do I provide proof of purchase or get any care info?

Comments (23)

  • 11 years ago

    All manuals etc. are online these days. Not a big deal for that at all. The receipts ARE technically his, if he purchased, and he can do with them what he wants. Most good local supply houses will have a record of his purchases and can handle assisting you with a warranty claim should that be needed. 99% of all warranty issues are installer error though, so that will not really help you at all if something goes seriously wrong. It will be your documentaton of the issues that will hold up in court should he refuse to warrant his work and you need to take him to court. Best to take a break and make nice. Renovations are ALWAYS over budget and time. That's 100% normal. Don't cut off your nose to spite your face here.

  • 11 years ago

    I think I'm paying quite handsomely. In fact, I chose the contractor whose references commonly said, he's not the cheapest, but he did a good job and stayed within his estimate. But he has never been on site for more than 5 hours in a day, more typically 4 hours. He has told me multiple times he was "on his way" or "be there in a bit," then showed up 3, 4, even 5 hours later. His work weeks are rarely, if ever, 5 days long. When his subs don't show, he shrugs his shoulders and asks what he's supposed to do. All of our future projects will be either all DIY or we will act as our own GCs.

    But back to my question: I think he bought most of the stuff online, at build.com or similar. Can I get records from them? And what about having my name on lists for recalls, etc? I've had dangerous stove and dishwasher faults repaired because they had my name as the owner. Shouldn't he have just given me the info, and can I get build.com and other online suppliers to give me his records?


  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Contractors rarely buy online. They want local supply house contacts that respond quickly and with no fuss to issues. Online places won't swap out a cracked toilet that same day and take care of contacting the manufacturer for a replacement for them. A local plumbing supply will, and they'll also generally arrange for 30 days net, and have account managers that will help them pick the most appropriate cost efftecive and reliable products. Easy replacement parts is another bonus from the supply houses, but the big thing that keeps them coming back is the no callbacks that happen when they pick certain products. And that is why contractors really and truly hate customers internet shopping for crappy chinese products and open box returns etc. They could care less about the cost savings. Saving $40 on a toilet pales in comparison to ruining a half day on a callback for a leaking faucet.

  • 11 years ago

    Something is not right.

    If he bought the fixtures online he will have email receipts. Ask for them before paying the final invoice. For a licensed contractor to buy a toilet online is so odd I would suspect he bought factory seconds or from Craigslist or eBay or as part of another job order.




  • 11 years ago

    "Contractors rarely buy online." I don't know how rare it is, but I know that mine did. He told me. I shouldn't have said "I think" because I know. He bought most things from build.com, where he said he has an account and dedicated rep. I gave him printouts of the exact name, item number, and specs for all my choices. In one case, the tub is sold exclusively online, and I spoke with the rep several times to make my choices.

    He probably has, or at least had, receipts. I don't know if he'll provide them. Our relationship has become contentious because I am fed up (where do you think my name came from?) with his continual delays and excuses, dishonesty, and inconsiderateness. He is fed up with me because I don't accept his excuses and have the temerity to ask that he not track dirt into the part of the house where he isn't working, that he ask me where I want towel bars placed rather than his making choices for me, that I ask him to follow the tile pattern I chose, and so forth.


  • 11 years ago

    "The receipts ARE technically his, if he purchased, and he can do with them what he wants." Did he not sell the items to the homeowner, at a markup, no doubt? Is he/she supposed to call the GC every time a faucet breaks?

    feddup thanked helsharmar
  • 11 years ago

    "The receipts ARE technically his, if he purchased, and he can do with them what he wants."

    I disagree. The receipts belong to the person who ultimately paid for the product. The contractor purchased the products with money supplied by the customer and should provide the customer with copies of the receipts. He didn't buy them with HIS money. I'm pretty sure the contractor did not just "toss them" because he most certainly is keeping track of all expenditures for tax purposes and keeping hard copies of receipts for expenses is pretty much par for the course. He has those receipts. Insist that he give you a copy of each one before paying him. The products belong to you, you paid for them, proof of purchase is normally required for warranty service and repair, you are rightfully entitled to a receipt.

    feddup thanked jellytoast
  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    The Materials purchase transaction is between the contractor and supplier, not the customer. The customer is purchasing an Installed Product which is quite different than purchasing a Craftsman screwdriver. The customer is not entitled to even view any receipts on a fixed price bid. His actual material markup and whether or not he managed to get a sale price on an item are irrelevant to the Agreed upon contract sum. The agreed upon price doesn't change. Yes, the contractor is the warranty point. If your toilet leaks, he repairs or replaces as part of his labor warranty that he includes for supplying the materials.

    If the bid was structured as a time and materials bid, with the cost of the materials plus a standard markup for them plus a labor price, then sure, the receipts should be turned over to the homeowner in order to substantiate the billing claim. If the customer chooses to purchase and supply the materials, then the converse also applies. He has no obligation to show the receipts to the contractor. And the contractor supplies labor only, with no warranty as to the suitability or quality of the products installed.

  • PRO
    11 years ago

    +1 That's why I buy the materials form my supplier and give a warranty on the labor and product.

    I don't usually do T&M but if I do I still prefer to pick out the materials I will be working with and make suggestions on what you may want to buy.You get the receipts and the paperwork and are responsible for any problems after the fact other than my labor.

  • 11 years ago

    Yet another thing for customers to be aware of when they are hiring a contractor and negotiating a contract. Personally, I don't want to call a contractor to replace a valve in a faucet, and since my faucets have lifetime guarantees, that could involve a number of valves through the years. From the previous posts I've read from feddup, he/she is likely to never want to see her contractor again.

  • 11 years ago

    The contract has allowances that include the cost of the
    materials plus his markup, so that seems to mean the receipts should be turned over to me, and I know he will resent my asking him to
    substantiate his bills. And that's not even my main concern, so much as wanting proof of purchase and warranty/care info. I know some of the latter is available online, sometimes for free, sometimes not, but every other contractor I've ever had has just handed me these materials, without my asking, even if they're just installing them. It's the considerate thing to do, no?

    "he/she is likely to never want to see her contractor again"--You got that right.

  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Did you sign a contract and what was it for?Was it for the cost of the complete job and the contractor bought and did the labor and supplied the materials?

  • 11 years ago

    Yes, signed contract, which includes allowances for most materials. He required that I buy light fixtures, which was fine with me. Some items he seemed not to want to be bothered with, probably because they weren't on build.com; he said he just "wouldn't charge [me] for them." The contract includes this clause: "The Work performed by the Contractor...is warranted for repair or replacement only against defects in materials or workmanship for a period of two years. The Contractor shall at its option repair or replace any defective materials as long as the defect is discovered within the warranty period....All warranties of the manufacturers on goods and equipment will be provided to the Owner and the Owner’s sole and exclusive remedy for any defect in such goods or equipment or damages caused by such goods and equipment shall be against the manufacturer." So it seems that he owes me paper.


  • PRO
    11 years ago

    I'm sorry for your experience.

    Receiving the product care and warranty literature for fixtures from the contractor is a reasonable expectation. If they've thrown them away they should download them and print them for you. They should also provide the warranty registration cards. If they've discarded them, they can work with the manufacturer to provide you with replacement copies. If fixtures were purchased under a customer allowance category, you are entitled to copies of invoices as others have noted.

  • PRO
    11 years ago

    I always leave this stuff.

  • PRO
    11 years ago

    I do to.Reading that part of your contract you posted it seams pretty sketchy to me.

  • 11 years ago

    Call the manufacturers.




  • 11 years ago

    If you are ever unable to enforce a manufacturer's warranty, that contract clause can be used to force the contractor to provide that warranty himself so it would be good to notify him in writing that he did not fulfill the terms of the contract in this regard. Then he might see the benefit of contacting the suppliers and get the warranty information for you.

    I still think its fishy that he would throw that information away unless it was accidental. You only have his word that he bought this stuff new online.

    feddup thanked User
  • 11 years ago

    It may have been accidental. He's very disorganized. The rooms he's working in have been a pig sty, so much that repainting is going to be needed where it was supposed to be finished. He can never find anything, whether it's paper documents, something on his iPad, something in his truck....He may be holding out on me because, after biting my tongue for months, I finally suggested he may not get paid any more until he and his subs start showing up when they're supposed to. I think it's unlikely that the stuff he bought isn't new, but comments here suggest that I'm entitled to see his actual invoices and to confirm the amounts he paid. Is that true? Actually, I'm more distrustful of what he's charging for labor, especially his subs. For example, the painter will charge him for coming back. I don't think I should pay for that, since it's the GC's fault the paint got marred. How can I tell whether he's charging me for that?


  • 11 years ago

    Sorry to hear about your upsetting situation. The guy is incompetent. As an engineer, I think it's very necessary to have the installation literature, model numbers, and the receipt (for warranty).

    Most manufacturer's don't have warranty registration - they rely on the sales receipt. For instance many faucet manufacturer's warrant for the life of the product - to the original purchaser. You will need the receipt or facsimile.

    Also, if you ever need replacement parts - it's always nice to know the model number.

    For every fixture that he installed, I would demand the model number (you can get installation / care / warranty info on line - and print it out) and either the receipt or a statement from him that he installed the product, new, and the installation date.


  • 11 years ago

    If you are paying T&M, then his bills should include details on what hours were worked and what materials were purchased, with receipts documenting it. I wouldn't just pay off an invoice with a big number on it.


  • 11 years ago

    I'm not paying by time. He gave me a schedule of values and bills by percentage complete. In some cases, it's easy to tell if something is complete; not in others. Some costs are for items, some for labor. I don't think he is dishonest in terms of how much something cost. His dishonesty is more related to how long things will take and when they will occur. This project was supposed to take about 2.5 months. He volunteered that (I did not request it) and put it in his contract, but only as "approx. date of substantial completion" and "approx. working days." There are no penalties for not meeting these deadlines, although I suppose I could claim he abandoned the project by not showing up when he said he would. He's here for 1 day, not the next, sometimes for 10 minutes, sometimes a total of 4 hours, rarely more. He has never left completely for more than a few days at a time. He's dealing with some personal issues, but these were known (to him, not me) before he started. I was accommodating at first, but this 2-room project now has taken longer than a 2-story, 5-room + roof addition I had done once. Now that things have gotten contentious, he's acting like a child.