I'm worried I did something wrong, because some appeared to be green in flesh wrapping the the inner roots, but I had cut them as they felt dried and brown on the exterior. I hope I'm not removing too much healthy root from the plant

More pics

It should survive, phals really aren't that hard to grow. I'm actually not surprised at the amount of roots. It's not an uncommon mistake to overwater a sphagnum potted orchid, which I'm guessing is what happened. Potting in bark and sphag is a pretty good idea. Usually they like lots of circulation at the roots so I would usually use like 1/2 bark, 1/4 perlite and or charcoal and 1/4 sphag. But, it depends on your watering routine and they aren't that picky. You should water only once the plant is mostly dry to avoid rotting the roots. Good luck and happy growing :)

You'll probably lose the flowers. One never knows. But a bright, warm spot should get the plant making new roots.

Good going!

Jane

Thanks guys for the feedback. Could anyone share how to identify healthy orchid roots?

I intentionally repot into this terracotta pot with holes to encourage air movement, as well, it's easier for me to poke my finger into the pot to test if the mix has completely dried out or not.

Bernard, I'm known for telling long detailed stories, so hang on, and I will talk a bit about potting orchids.

Once upon a long, long time ago, I worked for a large orchid nursery. We had this dear lady named Viney who was our chief #1 orchid repotting person. Viney would sit on a padded stool at the end of one of our seedling greenhouses surrounded by thousands of little orchid plants. She had two jars filled with a strong disinfectant solution, about a dozen shears, stacks of pots and a large pile of potting mix.

The head grower would tell Viney that we needed a block of plants moved from, say 4 to 6 inch pots. They would bring her a bunch of plants in trays, and Viney would sit there with her radio playing soft music while she pulled the plants out of the 4" pots, pulled the old bark mix off the roots, selected a set of shears out of jar #1, sheared off enough roots so the plant would fit nicely into a 6"pot, return the shears to jar #2, pot the plant into the new pot and put it in a tray. When she had several trays filled, someone would move the pots to their new home an a bench somewhere, and bring more plants. When Viney ran out of pots or mix, she or someone would replenish her supply...

Viney would patiently explain to any customers who asked about what she was doing, exactly what was going on. In short, she loved what she was doing, and she had been doing it for nearly twenty years when I first met her.

I used to delight in taking her by the hands in front of customers and explain that those two hands had probably held and repotted more orchids than they all would see in their lifetimes. Viney would smile, and reach for another plant.....

The point of all this......Orchids are NOT the dainty delicate fragile little plants some want to make them out to be, so long a you give them proper treatment after you abuse them a bit by repotting them.

Orchid roots do not grow into plastic pots, and can be removed easily, but they do grow into clay pots, and when you remove a plant from a clay pot, you have to get a bit brutal with it.

Broken roots are not a major problem. A few dead roots in a pot are not a major problem.

It is always best to repot orchids just before the new root growth starts. New roots have a pointey tip that is a light green, and if the bloom is going to be dark colored, the green tip of the new root will probably show purple or reddish pigment. (a tip for picking the dark colored flower producers from an unbloomed block of seedlings with light and dark parents.)

If you damage the growing tip of a root, you stop that roots growth right there. If the root is several inches long, it will probably branch, but if it is only an inch or so long, it probably will stop growing and eventually die.

That's why Viney would shear off the roots several inches from the plant. Repotting was surely going to damage any growing tips, so shear them off and let them branch into the new potting mix.

Orchid roots have a tough woody stem that runs through the center of them. The material that grows around this stem is green inside with a silvery covering. This material is much like a sponge in that it absorbs moisture from the air, or droplets that fall on it from rain. When the root is moist, the silvery coating turns green, so a dry root looks silvery, and a wet root looks dark green.

If you break a root, you probably won't break the tough inner stem, and if you do not cut the dangling end off the root, and pot it, it will probably branch at the break, and the plant will continue to draw nutrients from the broken end through the central stem.

Old roots sometimes develop a sunken or wrinkly look, but are not necessarily dead. If you cut the end off one of these roots and find green tissue inside, it is still alive and functional.

If you find a root with the central stem surrounded with a gray husk, and no green tissue inside, its dead.....cut if off at the plant, or back to live tissue.

Always pot orchids using moist potting mix. Newly potted plants should be placed on the bench and NOT watered for a week or so....You can mist them, but no drenching watering until the roots have had time to dry and the potting wounds have had time to heal.

If you can time repotting to occur just before the plant starts putting out new roots, the new roots will emerge into fresh new mix and very quickly grow into the new mix establishing the plant in its new pot with a minimum of shock.

With that said, I will take a deep breath, wipe my brow, and head off to bed. I hope it helps.

Bill

Bill, you're like an encyclopedia that I wouldn't stop reading over and over again, and marvel over the fact how resilient and fascinating these plants are.

Thank you so much for sharing your story about Viney, and explaining the root structure and behaviors of orchids.

I've been very patient with the growth process for my current plant. I have only watered it twice, once with some light misting last weekend, and some 2 ice cubes on top of the mix for slow inducing moisture into the moss.

I'm extremely tempted to pry open the mix to see how the roots are doing, but I'm going to leave it be.

1 spike with the dying flowers have all dropped completely, and it's beginning to dry up. Should I process to cut it? Or it might seem like the plant is already doing that to conserve energy to grow more roots?

- Bernard

I enjoyed your story about Viney, and you give some great information! I just finished repotting an orchid, and wasn't sure if I was too rough with it. It's good to know that they aren't as delicate as we tend to think.

Bernard, Get away from that plant.....Don't you dare touch that potting mix....☺☺☺!!!

I would never suggest leaving an old spike on a plant that is stressed. Cut it off a half inch or so from where it emerges from the plant. Clean cut, sterile blade. There are ways to cut Phal. spikes to encourage them to produce more blooms, but that is a lesson for another day and a healthy plant.

I would also forget you ever heard of "ice cube orchids".....☺ Cold anything is not good for orchids in general, and Phal's especially. Get a squirt bottle (windex, or whatever.....well, maybe not an insecticide sprayer...) that has a fine mist setting on it; room temp. tap water is all you need. A good spritz or three maybe two times a day during the middle of the day on bright days, and nothing if the day is cloudy, dreary, and cool. The leaves will pick that moisture up. The plant may look a bit droopy after a while, but you are encouraging it to get a bit thirsty, and produce new roots to go out and find water. A week or so without a big drink of water hurts a lot less than root rotted roots.

Thanks for the kind words.

Bill

Bill, thanks again for all your wise words!

I'm cutting off the spike, laying off ice and sticking to misting my plant from now.

When you said mist, do you mean mist the whole plant in general or spritz the mix? I didn't know leaves will encourage the plant to pick up moisture too.

Bernard

I think Viney would approve... It has been repotted for 2 months. Lots of roots with translucent tips and 5 new p. bulbs...

Thanks Bill! I'm following your directions.

I'm noticing one of the lower leaves turning yellow and another splitting on the tip, I guess the plant is adapting to re-potting change, so I shouldn't be too worried right?

Guys, I'm really frustrated. I believe my plant is rooting in the base and dying. The leaves are turning yellow one by one. I already peeled off 2 yellowing leaves? Should I continue?

DON'T pull yellowing leaves off. They continue to nourish the plant until they fall off. The plant looks dry ... try to keep it on the warm side and somewhat humid, and maybe it will spark some root growth. If there's roots, there's a chance, no matter how many leaves drop. It's probably just ditching what it can't support, and will grow more when the root system is healthier.

I snagged a near-death phal from someone who was throwing it out. The roots were almost entirely gone, and it dropped most of its leaves while it recovered. The first new leaves that grew in were small and pitiful, but as the root system established and got stronger, the next leaves were bigger and perfect.

Dannie, I'm going to lay off pulling the leaves. And gonna mist daily for now. Should I cut the 2 main spikes to give the plant strength to focus on growing it's roots and leaves?

What kind of light are you giving the plant? Despite the above advice, I would not mist. Until the plant begins growth, give it good light, warmth and time.

The leaf drop is normal as long as the crown is intact. Everything takes time.

Jane

@Bill, good to know how common rot is in newly potted plants. I got fed up with plastic and struggling plants, put all my orchids into clay as you've advised in other threads, and I also do the same thing and hose down all orchids almost every day. They've done better and some have fully recovered after a year of this particular attention.

Bernard, if your plant is recovering, cut the spikes. Its energy is being diverted from plant growth.
What Bill said about misting...

So, I cut both spikes. It seemed to prolong the plant's lifespan for alittle more, but it continues on a hellbent to heaven's door.

Not all the leaves are turning yellow. Really don't know what to do here to save it.

I've been giving it more light, occasional mist.

Ah, sigh. Are there any good roots left? Is the crown okay, still?

It looks pretty bad. I think I underwatered my plant. It's bone dry, or it looks like rot, I'm not sure. I tried touching the roots; they are all crispy? Should I just dunk it in water? Not sure what my next step is.

Probably a lost cause. Time to buy a new plant. Think about why the plant did not pick up. Perhaps the office had a better environment? Who knows.

I wrote over on the ice cube thread how orchid society members have difficulty growing them here....and not just beginner orchid society members. Two who have received awards from the AOC have given up trying to grow them.

You have probably given details of your home environment above. Temps, humidity, light and so on. Maybe some of the real orchid growers in the frozen north might be able to give a diagnosis.

We've all gone through this. Unfortunate part of gaining experience. I hate losing plants, but, sometimes just gotta remember, you've done the best you could with what information you have......
It happens.
:[

Well, thanks guys for all your input. So far this is plant count #4 that has died under my care, The first 2 were a couple of seasonal primroses, then a tillandsia, now a phal orchid. I think I'll stick to nurturing my succulents for now.

Arthur - I believe the office definitely provided a much more controlled environment in terms of cool temperature and lighting; since the lights are constantly turned on. So far, I'm ruling out that it's either underwatering or rot at the base of the crown that evaded my eye and probably spread through to all the roots. Or even perhaps the plant tried to hold the bloom for too long it exhausts all its energy to hold the spike up. I mean the flowers have bloomed for 4 months, which I believe it a very pro-longed period of time for a phal.

Azt - I know, I tend to beat myself up for my mistakes, but we all learn from it and become better growers.

Bernard, I'm sorry you lost the orchid. Don't be kicking yourself around over this. If any orchid grower tells you he has never lost his/her fair share of plants, they have probably been growing only a few weeks. We all have.

Your primroses, and tillandisia's do not require the same culture as orchids, so loosing them probably has nothing to do with why your orchid perished.

I am really surprised that your orchid started out looking so well if it had been growing for so long in a room where the lights stayed on for 24 hours a day seven days a week. Are you sure they did not go off for some time during the night?

Plants are not like people, they do not hang on to things (blooms). When the bloom's lifetime is over, it drops off the plant. Four months is not a long time for blooms to stay on a Phal. I just picked the last four off one of mine that started blooming in January.

I know sometimes you think you get conflicting advise form people on this forum, about orchid culture, but understand there are no hard fast "chiseled in stone" rules for growing orchids. We are basically offering advise, and we have probably all "broken" every rule we suggest many times (I have). Sometimes we get away with it, and sometimes we don't.

I suggest if you really want to learn how to grow orchids, go out and purchase another one and give it the old "college try". If you can find a commercial greenhouse that actually grows orchids it would be helpful for you to actually see how they handle the plants. If not, try to find one in a "big box store" that is fresh.....not one that has been on their shelf more than a week, and try again.

There's a bunch of us here ready to help when and if you ask for it, we would really like to see you succeed at this.

Bill

Bill, thanks so much for your guidance.

The plant originally was a in plastic container clustered with several other plants altogether in a perennial vase stuffed with moss over the top (about 5-6 inches) covering the roots. It was watered with ice once a week to maintain moisture. When the plant was removed, it was among one of the healthiest ones, the others were already prone to rotting and were well on their way. The plants was placed in our office's lobby - with lights on through out the days, and only dim lights in the weekends.

I had 2 spikes, I allowed one to naturally wither away, but it the spike never recovered and turned brown. The other followed shortly after, then the leaves followed suit one by one.

I'm guessing the office has a constant temperature of cool and dry air - within 60-70 and when I brought it home, I repot into a new medium/trim roots/and the temperature fluctuates a fair bit over the past few weeks, as we started having warmer weather that perhaps stressed the plant; causing it to not adapt in time.

I will most probably give it another shot down the road, and I'm really blessed to have all the help offered here.

- B

Bernad, Do a bit of research on line about orchid culture. I would suggest starting with a search for American Orchid Society Culture Sheets. There is a wealth of good information there for someone who is trying to get a handle on growing orchids. Dig around on the Garden Web orchid section, buried down in some of these threads is lots of good information. You have to dig a bit to find it, but its there. Knowing where your orchids originally came from really helps you to duplicate the growing conditions they need. I wished a thousand times when I first started growing orchids for something like GW where I could go and ask questions. Do a little home work, and find another orchid and have fun.

Bill

Hi Bernard,

I saw your pictures of the orchid, from healthy looking to dying! I hope you don't give up on them. I started out not long ago, 1st of April 2013 to be exact, just a mini phal and I told myself. "I am going to keep this orchid alive" and I did, as today, it's blooming beautifully for me the second time. If I can load the picture, I will show you. I also had 1 full size orchid (big) I bought from Costco. After the blooming, it seemed to go so dry, I repotted a couple of times and still drooping leave and roots. I just about chuck it out but I did 1 more think trying to save it and told myself. I'm going to do this, if it live, it lives, it it die, it dies. I have not much to lose" So, I cut off all the dead roots, which left not much, looked just like or less than the one you posted. Then I soaked it root solution for couple of hours. Then I put it in the clay pot with bark in the bottom, then mix bark and sm to secure the plant tightly but not too tight. I watered it in next few days as I regularly do when the medium started to dry. I had no understanding of restrain water them after repot to heal and encourage them to roots. Surprisingly, a couple of month later, it give me spike and as today, the flowers are big and beautiful since Feb. 15. as healthy as ever. So, keep on trying and you will get your reward one of this day. I do hope I can show you the pictures. Since GardenWeb changed to Houzz, I have problem using the site..

Tanie

Would someone show me how to upload photo to include with the post? I clicked on the camera icon (photo) , it says "upload photo" but nothing happened....

Thank you,

Tanie

After clicking on the Photo icon (camera) did you put a .jpg file name in by the "File name" and hit "Open"?

tj

Hi TJ, I'll try again this time. Yesterday when I clicked on photo icon, nothing happened.

Oh I did it! It wasn't at photo icon but at Houzz Photo. Thank you TJ and here it is, my almost chucked out orchid is in bloom!

Tanie