I also remember Bill Hillman's huge, glorious Dr. Huey. But then, Bill sprayed like a demon -- so it may well have remained disease-free for him.

Last year, I received a Dr. Huey instead of Lady Hllingdon. Needless to say, I was highly annoyed.

In my early rose years, I assumed Dr. Huey must be some sort of old European garden rose that a lot of people happened to have because of it being a pass-along-plant....interesting hypothesis, that....Even knowing the truth now, I still think he's a handsome fellow, bloom-wise at least, and what a striking combination of colors.

floridarose, my mother once gave me Dr. Huey instead of the Cecile Brunner cutting she thought she had rooted. It was a surprise when he bloomed.

He was in his full glory this weekend

But what I am realizing is that maybe he was that wonderful roae I wanted to stop to see what it was last year when I was on a back road with no way to stop....

It has so happened that I have stopped my car and got out to admire what proved to be the lowly R. indica major understock.

I do think Dr Huey is a handsome rose... are there places where he doesn't defoliate from BS? (I doubt SC would be one of those places...!)

Thanks for the photos,

Virginia

I noticed st Patrick left me a gift when I dug him up.....

Huey, "the gift that keeps on giving"...

Canina is not much better over here in Europe...

In reality, none of them are any better. Rugosa has been used for standard trunks, particularly from Dutch sources, and they invade every square inch of garden territory. Odorata outlives scions regularly and is one of the most often "discovered" "found" roses all over California where roses survive "on their own". Old plants of Ragged Robin (Gloire des Rosomanes) have often been found where they very likely provided roots for other types. Multiflora has escaped from under roses or outlived them when the scions have died. If they weren't such vigorous "survivors" they wouldn't be such successful root stocks. Kim

My experience with Chinas (mainly Indica Major) is that they are quite well behaved. They can outlive their scions but they don't seem to sucker a lot or spread. I only get problems with roses imported from northern Europe not the locally grafted ones. I just remembered to try to remove those canina suckers left by my shovel pruned Golden Gate last year and switch off the darn drip nozzle that is watering the suckers so they grow nice and spritely... They do seem to be growing nicely, thank you very much..

Btw Kim have you ever heard of Bengal Crimson having been used as a rootstock at any time somewhere in the warmer world? We were having this discussion about one with Marianesse in another thread and I was wondering how it found itself in a garden on a small island in the gulf of Athens.

I've grown a good number of roses on multiflora roots with nary a sucker. I'm sure I've left some decent sized root pieces in the ground while shovel pruning, too. Dr. Huey will attempt a coup even when the scion is thriving or come back from the grave a year after the plant has been dug up.

I follow Michael's Advice. I have a Dr. Huey and I let it grow out and bloom, but then I cut it back.

No Nik, I haven't, but that means nothing. There are photos in old ARS annuals of all sorts of interesting things, such as this field of Druschki on Mme Plantier used as root stock at the Glen St. Mary Nurseries in Florida, from January 1922. I found out through a post on the Rose Hybridizers Association last fall Banksiae is used for standard stocks in China, today. Why not?

Years ago, up in Aptos, CA, I was shown suckers of Bride's Dream escaping from under early Austin roses imported from Hortico in the early years of their selling them. Hortico swore they NEVER budded anything on Bride's Dream, yet here were many stems of Bride's Dream escaping from around the shanks of several Austins recently purchased from them. Go figure.

There is no telling what people have done, or will do. Perhaps some enterprising nurseryman decided to try Bengal Crimson? And, again, why not? If it grew well, rooted easily and accepted the scions attempted, what's not to like? Just because we've not encountered confirmation someone did it commercially doesn't mean it wasn't done. It could be completely possible someone took the Bengal Crimson to that island because they liked it and wanted to grow it there. Or, perhaps it could even be seed grown? It is highly likely the many variations of "Slater's Crimson China" found all over the US resulted from its seed being distributed instead of actual plants. Maybe someone (or some animal?) brought the seed there and the discovered plant resulted? Stranger things have happened. Kim

I am amazed at my little Ragged Robin cuttings from Jeri. About 2 months later they are in little pots and already trying to bloom. Pink Clouds grew so quickly in the ground I can make lots of rootstock starts out of it too. IXL is looking happy too.

Kim, just wildly speculating here but Banksiae rootstocks might just be the answer for roses in calcareous soils. We may never know unless you guys try it out. They are roses that never seem to display iron chlorosis in calcareous soils in my limited experience. Some chinas (like R. indica major) don't mind lime too much either. I would also bet that R. sempervirens doesn't dislike lime soils given where it grows (Med maquis) though I have no clue if it would make a good roostock.

That's the direction I want to explore, Nik. I have Banksiae seedlings I want to grow to generate the guage and length of cuttings for stocks. I know those should be RMV free. Budding them should be identical to what's required for Fortuniana. That would definitely eliminate several issues involved with needed material. If it works for standards in China; if Fortuniana actually is a hybrid Banksiae and with as marvelously it grows all over California, why would I need anything else?

Good to know Kim! That's my second pet peave (besides the lack of new 'Teas' and 'Chinas' for warm climates which I moan about in another thread). Tolerance to alkalinity and lime be it from the plant itself or the rootstock.

I'll have to give your method a try, Michael. I have a DH coming up from the dead stump of my climber, Dublin Bay, that I have let grow because the spot really has become too shady now to support any other rose. DH doesn't seem to mind it and continues to grow and bloom each year. I actually would like him to get a bit bushier than he is. I'll try the whack and let grow back method and see if that works! At least it will take care of the awkward covered in black spot stage.

Years ago, long before I discovered gardening, I would wait impatiently for Dr. Huey to bloom here in the older neighborhoods of Kansas City. When I got into roses and started researching (I'm a reference librarian, it's what I do LOL) I was excited to think I would finally be able to find out what this magnificent rose (at its best) was. When I finally figured out it was the Dr. Huey people here on Gardenweb talk about so negatively I was a bit embarrassed to admit how lovely I thought he was. Now I've learned alot, and all my roses are own root but I still love Huey when he is in bloom and am still tempted to rescue him when I see him on an abandoned lot. Maybe a big group of abandoned Dr. Huey in the back yard where only I get to enjoy him?

Zi.

Years ago when I first started cleaning up my parents very over grown yard, I was allowed to remove some of the vines that were allowing vermin in the attic. One was a magnificent rose that pretty well covered a corner of the house alone with a second vine. I did battle with the beast, looking like I was fighting a wild cat finally getting it down to a 6 foot twisted trunk and then I started digging out the roots. That thing was the size of my calf. I wrestled in to a large hole and then we watered and hoped for the best.

Mom was so disappointed when it did not survive the move. Turns out the very same rose was growing on the other side of the walk from under Don Juan......

But I know what you mean, it can really be a show stopper when in bloom

Well, it's downright ugly when you're expecting the beautiful blooms of L. Hillingdon, Cl., or like Cat, Cecile Brunner. And not only that, I paid shipping on the darn thing.

With all the Hueys out there, has anyone seen color variations and mutations? Imagine a striped Huey!

I have recently discovered Huey coming from under my fragrant cloud. I don't know that it is mutation, however a couple of the blooms are more of a fuscia color (left 2- hard to see) while the others are deep red. I also had some bs there as well. I am going to try to grow some as stock... that is my plan for now at least. Huey has absolutely beautiful blooms!

I agree--in bloom, Dr. Huey is quite attractive. Here he is growing in the middle of a bed of iris--the nearest rose from which it could have sprung is several feet away .

Dr. Huey

If I'd listened to Michael years ago, I might have let the Dr. Huey in another spot in my garden grow. In bloom, it always provoked compliments from passer-bys.

Could not believe how it could blackspot post blooming, however! Never seen anything like it!

Kate

I have Dr. Huey which I wanted to shovel prune but don't have the heart to. It was originally grafted with J.F. Kennedy as a tree rose. It was a surprise when the next season Dr. Huey came out. It is the most vigorous rose in my garden and mostly healthy. I am still deciding its fate..lol.

If it is disease-resistant in your conditions, and you have room for it, I would keep it. It WAS considered to be a fine rose in its day, and it became rootstock by sheer accident. Here it is, looking quite handsome, in a Sierra Foothills cemetery, earlier this spring.

They are pretty blooms. If I lived in the country, rather than on a little city lot, I'd be tempted to just let one eat a tree or two on the woodland border.

I do get mildew in early fall but that is about it. I guess I will leave it for now. The once blooming aspect is a downer for me.

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