doesn't seem anyone wants to take this on

to me , when you talk structure , people mean beds , islands , walkways , and the like

I like to lay out these things first then add plants,,,or at least have some idea where structure will be added later

this might bump

ron

Sounds like you may have enough going on that hiring a landscape consultant or designer could be worthwhile.

The first pic shows quite a dynamic border that comes wider towards the camera in a sweep, enhanced by the lens perhaps. Just ghosting some ideas from other gardens I'd say straight off break up the following-the-fence tendancy by making borders that cut corners and get wider to one end like half a kidney border. That way the fence loses it's dominance. Then you can plant fairly much any shape, size, colour that fits your requirments and climate.

The second pic is much more difficult as it's quite open. I'll let the guys like Dax and Ken field that one as they have open ground.

Define your lawn shape first as if it was water, otherwise your flower beds will look like cutouts and you will lose the flow of good design.

Mike.

How much land do you have? What are those two existing trees?

Do you want winter interest, a privacy screen, a wind break, an edible garden?

When I see a chain link fence, I think vines.

Don't be afraid to put a shade tree in the middle. Lots of people make the mistake of squeezing all their planting into a border. Borders aren't the best place for many kinds of trees...they expand and invade your neighbor's land.

More often than not, borders are shared and both sides benefit by plants reaching over property lines. Cooperation goes a long ways here.

Wider borders and the willingness to give up some lawn goes a long ways too.

Design wise, I'm always hesitant to plunk a tree in the middle of the lawn. It usually can be accommodated into a bed and be in the same place as if it were 'plunked'.

Mike

I have 3/4 acre.

the two trees in the middle are apple trees, the one on the right is really not healthy - thinking of removing it eventually. At the very least, they both need pruning desperately.

Want winter interest and privacy.

Don't want anything more that creates heavy shade, I have many shade trees on the property, this is one of the few sunny areas I have.

I have a few plans drawn up, I was thinking of putting a small tree in the border, like serviceberry. I had one at my old house and it didn't seem to get that large. Also thought of putting in a couple dwarf alberta spruce.

Downy Hawthorn (Crataegus mollis) or "Winter King" have berries that provide winter (or at least late fall) interest. I'd recommend holly, but American Holly and Variegated English holly (my favorite varieties) would be borderline in your zone. Ask people who frequent this forum about an interesting blue dwarf conifer. I also like the idea of growing grape vine or some sort of flowering vine along the fence...but be careful not to pick anything invasive.

yes, choosing a vining element will come down the road... that's definitely in the cards, just trying to get the larger stuff in first. Will look up the others you mentioned, thanks!

A word of caution on the Dwarf Alberta Spruce. It needs full sun to look good, so much so, that the north side's foliage is noticeably thinner than the south's. If you are going to use it keep that fact in mind. You don't want to view it from the north side.

I consider it the most overused, improperly placed, most killed, of almost any conifer I see. Case in point, there are very few large ones in old neighborhoods, even though they do get over 10 ft. tall. A lot of small ones where they can be grown, but not large ones. In a container their lifespan is even shorter, not because they die of old age, but because they dry out or are placed up against a wall where they're shaded and get spider mites.

Mike

oy, well this conifer business ain't easy, especially when you're needing to fulfill certain size requirements.... I'll have to see what type of selection they have at my local nursery.

A little hard to visualize your space,,,what perspective are we looking at in pics ?

This being the conifer forum , you choose the most boring plant to mention

peps will have better choices

ron

I'm starting with background plants - don't need them all to be visually stimulating.

use the 1st photo as your perspective - the line against the fence, from the arborvitae to the shrubs in the foreground. The photo is a little misleading, looks like there's less space than there is, but the total area to plant in is around 60-70ft long.

still not clear,,,yah, you want to plant the fence line,,,but is that your left prop. line , or your back prop.line,,,,is the second pic from your yard , or from your neighbors yard ?

none of this still makes any suggestions for plantings

where is the house

how big is your yard,,,,cause planting D Alberta will be like a speck in a big yard

ron

how about some green giant

see 1st photo: the little blip of yellow to the right is the corner of my house.

2nd photo was taken in MY backyard. All of that is my backyard, I have a large space.

I'll take another photo later if it would help.

I realize I have a large yard, but I am not willing to plant something that gets as large as green giant. 10-15ft is about the height I'm willing to go. If some people want to think that'll look dwarf in comparison to the space, so be it. Just not something I'm going to do...

Can't anyone actually suggest some more interesting conifers? I know lots of people here know way more on this topic then I do. OK
Abies concolor 'Compacta' and

Pinus strobus (Nana Group) are small. Pinus strobus 'Pendula' and

weeping alaska cedar are gorgeous, but might be too big and gimicky.

I'd also recommend the New York State Nursery for small bare root trees.

thank you for the suggestion! I really like the Pinus strobus.

I also found the link below, FINALLY, somewhere I can just get a list of conifers and then do my research from there...

http://www.iselinursery.com/index.php/conifers

One warning. The internet is full of great lists of species your typical local landscaper doesn't know about. You have to watch out for sites in areas other then yours. There is at least one tree you find recommended all over the web that doesn't survive in my area.

Right, I know, I can at least use this as my base then do further research about the species in my area. This at least gets me started...

Hi again, Lauren. I'm one of the people that didn't satisfy your quest in other threads, haha! Anyway, it is perfectly fine for there to be a screen of shrubs, "garden conifers", grasses, or what have you along that space. It looks to me like light is not a problem-it seems like it'd be close to full sun. As such, you've really got the full gamut of commercially-available landscape plants to work with, plus whatever other touches you might put into it. I'd still-as I think I may have told you twice already, lol-lay out, if nowhere else, in my mind, a kind of elevation, depicting desired plant heights and shapes. This will tend to guide your decisions on what should go where. Often, a kind of stepped-down approach is used-tallest stuff in the back, and then progressively shorter moving toward expected viewing angle(s), and maybe larger stuff towards the center of the line, then sloping off-it all depends on what literally just standing there and looking brings to mind. So, so many plants to choose-it would almost be better to go through this process, then start to populate the graph, so to speak, with actual species/cultivars, etc.

+oM

good point, thanks tom - I will consider that approach!

The bed needs some curves. Make it wider where the bad views are as viewed from the back door or patio. That way you can plant more to hide the bad view. Make the bed narrower where you have a good view. Design and plant conifers first and work down from there.

That's the way I look at it.

Mike

"I would cut down both apple trees if one is unhealthy. They won't bloom without at least two of them anyway."

They will bloom, they just won't set fruit without a second tree but that second tree could even be a neighbor's crabapple.

tj

Lauren, you're going at it backwards by choosing individual plants before the shape of the bed they're going in, or how they will relate to what is already there or have chosen for future planting. You're going to have a row of plants with no composition in mind. I can not emphasize that enough. Your cart is ahead of the horse. I've said all I can. I'm done with this thread.

Mike

kinda what I said in the first post reply

but we are not leaving

Well spoken , butterfly , some times me not so much

ron

Don't get overwhelmed and try to do it all at once. Draw up what you want to do, and start slow. You have a big area and doing it all in one season may suck the life out of you! Maybe figure out the shapes you want and start with the areas that have the worst views as Miketann suggested. If you are having the apple trees removed, do that first. Now might be a good time to remove them if it's on your list. Winter is a great time to look at pictures and research different shrubs & trees that will work in your area, not much to do outside! You can figure out what you like and narrow down the choices to the stuff that will work. If any hardscaping needs to be done, do it first :). Patios, walkways, or decks are way easier that way! Good luck and have fun planning and choosing!

Julie

fyi, I DO have the shape of the bed established, the above photos do not show it because those are from a year ago. I prepped the bed this summer and have covered the area with cardboard - average depth of the bed is 8'. I have flexibility in the size of the bed, if I need to make it larger, I will.

thank you, THE END.