I'm surprised that environmentalists haven't made this illegal yet. Be careful about who you talk to about this.

What your calculations are missing is the rate of snow melt per hour. Also missing is the rate of heat dissipation into the ground underneath and adjacent to the driveway, in other words, how much of the heat will be working on the snow on the surface of the driveway and how much heat will leech away to the ground? Heat doesn't rise, hot air rises, so the heat will move in all directions.

What you need to know is how long does the system need to be on to melt a 1' overnight snowfall, how long does it have to be on for the snowmelt to clear so that you don't get stuck with an ice rink on your drive-way.

Alex it's interesting that you mention the environmental side of it. My guess is that snowblowers are much more polluting / bad for the environment. They're certainly noisier! (It seems like fewer and fewer people actually shovel, unless it's a light snow fall.) Solar heated driveways would be nice. :)

(Apologies to the OP - didn't mean to hijack.)

You're not counting the massive electrical panel upgrade that it would take to try to heat the outdoors with electricity. You'll need around 4 30amp circuits for that. That's more than half of a typical 200 amp panel. You'll need to upgrade the service from the pole to the panel as well as the panel itself. I'd suggest 400 amps, unless you want to melt snow off of the roof and heat with electricity as well. If so, then I'd really love to see a copy of a 10K electrical bill for a residence!

37 watts per square foot times 600 square feet equals 2200 incandescent light bulbs burning. $105 per day for usage. An absolutely ridiculous amount of electrical wastage. Especially since hydrionic would be so much ''cheaper'' in comparison. Nothing will be truly cheap other than hiring the neighborhood kid to shovel it.

The better way is to heat the garage and the driveway with embedded PEX tubing hydronically (hot water). A small furnace in the garage, with two circulators - one for the garage, and one for the drive. Some use a waterheater, I think a furnace would be better.

For the driveway surface, I'd have pavers (that way you can pull them up - if necessary).

You need to remember that the driveway mass has to heat up - this could take quite a while, before it ever melts a flake of snow. Also when the snow melts, where does the water go?

$105 per day for usage.

I think you're calculating the cost of heating the driveway all day long. If the point is to melt snow, wouldn't the OP turn it on for an hour or so, and then turn it off again?

One thing I'd ask: Do you have to do the whole 600 sf driveway? Could you do just one "aisle" so you could get your car out of the driveway in a pinch ... and then hire the neighbor kid to take care of the whole thing at your leisure?

I agree that hiring the neighbor kid is the cheapest option, but that isn't problem-free: The neighbor kid grows up, gets himself a real job, meaning you have to seek out a new kid every couple years. And he's not necessarily willing to get up and do your driveway in time for you to leave at 6:00 am.

@mrspete: " If the point is to melt snow, wouldn't the OP turn it on for an hour or so, and then turn it off again?"

OK - here's a quick lesson in thermodynamics (heat transfer).

Assume the driveway is paved with 3" concrete pavers + 4" sub-base of sand and class 5 limestone. This is approx 40 lbs sq/ft = 40 * 600 = 24,000 lbs.

Now, we need to bring this mass (12 ton) up to temperature (40 degrees?) to melt the snow. Do you think that will heat up in 10 minutes? I think it would be hours.

Many commercial systems operate continuously at a low level, then go full on when there is snow.

Additionally, if you use a manual system, and turn it on after a layer of snow accumulates, the snow in contact with the drive will melt, leaving an air space - that insulates the upper layer of snow - thus taking even more time to melt the snow.

You haven't heard from people who have the system because almost no one who did the cost/benefit study would install such a system. Hydrionic? Sure, you'll have some luxury homes with that. It isn't such a stretch to extend some PEX when you already have a boiler. Electric? The $100 a day goes a long way towards hiring a professional snow removal company.

My recommendation is that you call back to the company giving you the quote and tell them you want several names and phone numbers from past customers. That way you can talk with some people in your area about what the operating costs have been and how happy they have been with their decision.

Yes, nielf, that's what you should be doing. Not relying on faceless advice from folks who may live anywhere from Alaska to Florida.

And as to costs, one significant factor here is the initial 15K outlay.

Interest on that amount, invested even in this paltry market, will bring in maybe $300/year.But even that pathetic amount likely represents 15-20 hours of snow clearing labor with ZERO system maintenance or energy costs!!!

And let me emphasis the phrase "paltry market". Over the lifetime of your heating system, interest rates will likely average higher, meaning much more $$ to manually get those pesky flakes off of the drive.....and maybe some $$ left over for some nice lobster dinners for yourself...or even a snowblower!!

@nlief: "I appreciate all the comments, but unfortunately I have not heard from people who actually have the system. The rest are just theories and speculations."

So what do you need? Why should I care? I gave an intelligent response. Yet you don't reply to my analysis.

All I can think is that you have more money than brains. Well just spend it. I really don't care.

You seem to be a really insensitive person, who doesn't read for comprehension. I hate spending time, responding to people like you.

I think you should do it. Let us know how it works out.

.20 cents per kwh....smh.

geoffrey,

For the record, I think you gave a well thought out reply that will benefit others who might consider using this system -- including those who are researching this topic in the future may come upon this thread. We have hydronic heat under our basement slab. It takes hours to heat up. I would hate to think of the energy cost to heat a driveway in the uninsulated outdoors.

Carol