Mud float vs cement board and waterproofing

10 years ago

We are trying to decide between two tile contractors with similar pricing (for our new build). Both claim their way of doing things is best. One mud floats the entire shower after pan and cement board are installed. The other installs their own shower pan and cement board (says other contractors tend to screw it up) and then uses a Schluter waterproofing method. We have an issue the grout cracking between the wall and floor in our current shower and I want to avoid that. This is our forever home and I don't want any issues with water behind the wall, mold/mildew, etc.

Featured Answer

MongoCT

10 years ago

I m a little confused by the description of what each guy is doing.

Whatever they do, make sure the floor membrane itself is sloped to the drain. Iy's a code violation to install the membrane flat on teh subfloor with sloped mud on yop of it.

"One mud floats the entire shower after pan and cement board are installed."

Is this guy floating mud directly on the cement board? Floated walls are typically (at least in my experience) tar paper and then expanded diamond mesh on the walls, with the mesh wrapped through the corners. Then the walls get floated with mud. A tile backing surface like that with mesh wrapped through the corners will not crack on the wall-to-wall corners, so the corners can be grouted.

If you're looking to avoid corner cracks, you'll have better success with a fully floated shower that has mesh wrapped through all corners, versus tiling over a lightweight tile backer board like cement board.

I do like Shluter's Kerdi membrane, as well as other surface-applied membranes. They can be installed over cement board, and even over a floated mud wall.

I think every tiler should want to control the process from studs-to-tile. The tile can only be as good as what it goes over.

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Comments (9)

PRO
Creative Tile Eastern CT
10 years ago
In addition to Mongo's advise. Voice your concern about the grout cracking where the wall meets the floor. The response should be caulk / sealant (100% silicone) is installed at a change in plane. This is a basic detail. If the installer intends on using grout select another installer.
housebuilding126 thanked Creative Tile Eastern CT
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PRO
Creative Tile Eastern CT
9 years ago
100% silicone is not available sanded. Siliconized acrylic caulk is available sanded but is a inferior product. Grout manufacturers make their caulk/sealant colors in 100% silicone as TCNA requires but the majority of installers and DIY'ers are afraid to use it sacrificing quality to ease of use and saving a couple of bucks. Sad.
PRO
Avanti Tile & Stone / Stonetech
9 years ago
Actually, it is. try http://colorriteinc.com/ I think the silicone sanded is ColorSil.
PRO
Creative Tile Eastern CT
9 years ago
Thanks for the link Avanti. I would now like to revise my previous comment to grout manufacturers do not provide sanded 100% silicone. There was a comment before mine that I was responding to as well as a comment after. Both have been deleted. Oh well. I gained knowledge so it was worth it to me:)
PRO
Avanti Tile & Stone / Stonetech
9 years ago
go to the link at the bottom of the page under grout/caulk. If they don't list it, you can give them the manufacturer of the grout and the number on the bag and they will custom mix it for you.
User
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
color matched sanded silicone been around since the tile craftsman.

back in DA day pre interweb I used to make my own. Using Slower flash time silicone and mix it with sanded grout powder.

Not suggested for a first timer. :)
PRO
Valley Tile and Plumbing
5 years ago
Anyone that uses backer board is not a real tile guy. Period.

A mud installation is the only way to go, Ever!.

Anyone who tells you different is selling you products, and a big lie.

Just use common sense. Screws... !!!

Really?Holding a "board"on 2x4s.. no wonder you have cracks! I'd be shocked if a backer board shower with a plastic sheet of anything for a pan... Lasts you for a year!

Where i live you are required to have a permit. #1. There are tests, and inspections prior to tiling... And after.

We use hot tar, or fabric reenforced waterproofing for the pan, benches, and niches...

And everything is set in metal lath reenforced cement!

This is the only way your shower will last forever.