Carol: Thank you for the late-season treat. Baronne Edmund de Rothschild is on my wish-list, how's the scent on that one? Thanks.

Parfum de Grasse still looks great !! I like your Holly Bells, fantastic ruffles.

When blooms don't open, the right ratio of calcium & potassium and magnesium helps. Cloudert Soupert is famous for "balling", but I have zero problems with that using 1/4 cup gypsum, 1/8 cup sulfate of potash, plus my high magnesium clay. If you don't have clay for magnesium, horse manure and alfalfa provides magnesium.

Some pics. from my garden, taken today, Sept. 16, Tchaikovsky blooms well in 4 hours of sun:

Dee-lish on Sept. 16, I sniff the bloom at least 10 times a day.

Close-up of Cloudert Soupert, never ball in my high-magnesium clay:

Strike it Rich bloom, over one week old, note that the high-phosphorus chicken manure & horse manure gave dark-red fringes. Pic. taken Sep. 16:

Below is Comte de Chambord on Sept. 16, the horse manure made the blooms deeper pink. Normal color is pale pink in alkaline clay.

Marigolds and alyssum, plus faded Dee-lish blooms on Sept. 16:

Darcy Bussell bloom in less than 3 hours of sun, the leaves belong to "sundrop" perennials. All pics. taken today, Sept. 16:

Baronne has a really nice scent. Can't really describe it. HMF reviewers say the scent is good +, but I really love the scent - it's quite marvelous. So far mine isn't the best bloomer - but it's young, so that may improve.

Yes, I really love Parfum de Grasse - hopefully it will bloom better next year.

I'm really loving my Holly Bells! I can see it all the way across the yard. Can't wait to see what it does next year!!

How often do you apply the gypsum, etc.? All of my Brother Cadfael blooms are like that one - they don't open any further.

CArol

Carol: I put the info. at the bottom of Sam's thread: "September roses". I do that 3 to 4 times a year, right before a rainy week: 1/2 cup chicken manure (8% lime), 1/4 cup gypsum, 1/8 cup sulfate of potash.

Thanks, Straw!

Carol

Carol: Your Parfum de Grasse is very impressive. I love strongly scented orange roses.

Above is Marie Pavie seen from my window-screen. Pic. taken Sept. 10. It's a mature 5-year old bush, roots get more woody, thus DISLIKE GYPSUM. This fall flush is just as good as spring flush, with clean foliage. I put my alkaline clay plus 1/8 cup of sulfate of potash. Since I don't want the bush to get larger, I didn't give it nitrogen (chicken manure), and the health is from the calcium of my alkaline clay plus 1/8 cup of sulfate of potash.

For heavy bloomer like Marie Pavie, or for BS-prone roses, my recipe is 1/2 cup chicken manure & 1/4 cup dolomitic lime (Espoma) & 1/8 cup sulfate of potash mixed with clay, top soil, or horse manure (for magnesium & trace elements). I find that applying such WHILE BLOOMING will take care of the shortage of nutrients AFTER BLOOMING, thus prevent blackspots.

Holy moley!!! So the roots get more woody BECAUSE it's a mature bush??

That's a fabulous bush!!

Carol

Tchaikosky gives a 4.5" bloom ... I dumped clay & horse manure mixed with 1/8 cup sulfate of potash. Pic. Sep. 17.

Above is bottom of Tchaikosky bush with perfect foliage. Next to it, to lower right is Sharifa Asma, which I moved a week ago. Both need partial shade, pic. taken Sep. 17. Above is Kordes Blue girl, which I got for $7 from Menards in June. I moved it twice, but it recuperated nicely. The best scent that rivals Dee-lish, the scent is 10 times better than Poseidon, and just as healthy. Drawback: the bloom doesn't last long as Poseidon, plus demand tons of fertilizer & water to bloom. Upper stem is thornless. Fertilized with 1/2 cup chicken manure & 1/4 cup gypsum & 1/8 cup sulfate of potash mixed with horse manure. For stingy roses like Blue girl, I use gypsum rather than lime.

I love Blue girl's scent so much, that I wish Just Joey would die through my winter, so I can plant a 2nd Blue girl. Just Joey, Sun Downer and Heirloom hybrid teas can't measure up to Blue girl's health and fantastic scent. Pic. taken Sept. 17.

Above the bottom of Poseidon bush, showing its bottom bloom with firmer petals than Bluegirl. Slight floral grassy scent. Pic. taken Sept. 17.

Above is Darcy Bussell, received from Roses Unlimited end of June. Picture taken today, Sept. 17. It's the healthiest among my 12 pots as own-root. It's in less than 3 hours of sun so growth is spindly. I put it in partial shade on purpose since I don't want to water it daily with a dinky pot. When the weather is cooler, I'll plant into my clay.

Above is Old port ... note the blackspot leaf below. It has dark-green foliage, thus don't like the tons of rain we got. I should had topped it with horse manure & lime & chicken manure & sulfate of potash during its last flush. I got busy with my pots-experiments and neglected it. Fertilized with Soluble organic Jobes' NPK 4-3-2 and sulfate of potash, but THAT WASN'T ENOUGH to buffer the acidic rain.

Straw - amazing colors and forms on your roses!!! Pink Peace is ridiculously beautiful!!! Oh my!!! I also love your Old Port and Tchaikosky. Gorgeous!!! You have so much rose knowledge....very impressive!

Carol

Khalid - Thank you!! Yes, it's gorgeous!! I have it as a bareroot growing in half day shade. Next summer it will be out in full sun, then I'll see if it fades. It only has one bloom at a time...but then it's in the shade and a bare root rose.

CArol

Note more petals on Evelyn (from shell lime in horse manure), plus darker color (from trace elements). Pic. taken yesterday, Sept. 22, hot & humid, we turned the air on, More rain to come, I'll test garden lime next on Evelyn (likes it alkaline).

Below shows its glossy foliage on lowest left, top right is Comte de Chambord's lighter leaves. Chicken manure has 10 to 100 times more anti-fungal elements (zinc, copper, arsenic, and boron) than dairy manure.

Radio times on Sept. 22, cluster-blooming is from sulfate of potash.

Straw: Shade on your Evelyn is simply unbelievable. And your Radio Times cluster is most impressive. What a feast for the eyes.... thanks

Khalid: Sulfate of potash doesn't increase the size of stem unless there are trace-elements. Previous years with blood meal & sulfate of potash the stems of Evelyn are so skinny & weak. Once I put horse manure & chicken manure, the new shoot is twice thicker than the old ones.

With Crown Princess Magareta, I can't put horse manure nor chicken manure up that mess. So I water with sulfate of potash and kelp (has all the trace elements), and the stem is twice thicker than last year.

The trace elements for thick stems & deeper colors is worth the 10% salt horse manure.

I am going to put chicken manure on my roses next year!! Your roses look gorgeous - especially Evelyn!!! Wowza!!!

I was surprised to find fragrance in a few of my roses!! The smell literally made me stop in my tracks and go what??!!!! Because of the coolness here, there hasn't been any fragrance. But these ones did.

- Evelyn - I have two flowers and they don't look great - but the fragrance just stunned me!! It's the first time all summer that there has been fragrance there!!!

- Acapella - really strong banana candy smell - so sweet!!

- The McCartney Rose - wow!!

- Dark Desire - fruity with wine undertones. First time this rose has given me fragrance!!

- Just Joey - wonderful fruity fragrance - first time in 4 years it's had a wonderful fragrance!!

Ii was so surprised and delighted!!!

Carol

Carol: I'm happy for your fragrances !! Dee-lish smells like a cross between Evelyn and Damask-scent. It's fruity when soil is alkaline, and old-garden-rose when the soil is acidic. I'm a sucker for "wine and fruity" as in Yves-Piaget's offspring. I'm tempted with Dark Desire, since I put up with Wise Portia and Mary Magdalene awful thistles, just for their scents.

William Shakespeare is NOT fruity, it's more like lilacs-old-rose, very good when the soil is acidic. Below is the link to Coop-poop, the chicken manure I tested this year, very low-odor, didn't stink up my car nor my garage. Alfalfa meal is actually stinkier, so I switched to Standlee zero odor & zero salt alfalfa pellets. Milorganite (sewage sludge) is the worse .. nauseating bad. Chickity-doo-doo reeks, I don't recommend that unless you have a big garden & all windows shut in cold weather.

Very happy with coop-poop, no smell unless you stick your nose up really close, then it's very low odor. Charles' compost (organic chicken manure) is even better, mild like soil & compost. I got a huge bag of coop-poop for $13 from Ace Hardware store .. will go back for a 2nd bag for my perennials & fruit trees.

http://www.coop-poop.com/

I must get Dee-lish!!! It's too bad I passed on it last year. I can't vouch for Dark Desire, because it hasn't come into its own yet. It was new last year. I'm hoping for better things from it next year.

I might just have to settle for whatever chicken manure I can find here.

:)

Carol

Straw, I'm wondering how Darcey Bussell is doing for you 3 years later. Mine always defoliates after the first flush. I'm thinking of moving them to a less conspicuous spot and replacing with Bordeaux, but the spring blooms are magnificent. I wish I could make them happy where they are. Do yours get full sun?

Vaporvac: My Darcey Bussell bloomed well in partial shade, but it died in a wet winter (freezing rain). Roses that defoliates after flowering PREFER DRIER & FAST-DRAINAGE soil. Darcey Bussell as own-root was very vigorous & healthy in a fast-draining pot (fluffy potting soil), but it's wimpy in POOR-DRAINAGE wet clay and died in my wet zone 5a winter.

I'm sorry your died. Mine look like a million bucks for their first flush, but disintegrate afterwards. I do believe that spot has mediocre drainage compared to the rest of my yard, so maybe I will move them yet again where they'll be in full sun. However, their first home had perfect drainage and they also defoliated. However, they had less sun. Ballerina is now in that spot and loves it. Thank you for your insight.