Tile experts...I need your help :(

9 years ago

So, we hired a tile contractor. He has 17 years of experience and came highly recommended. We have been beginning to regret our decision since he has started the showers, as some of his techniques are not following "best practice" that I have seen on the TCNA website. As I research techniques more, I am getting really concerned about the work that has already been done. We had 12x24" porcelain tiles installed on ditramat over Advantech subfloor. The tile contractor used TEC Full Flex modified thin set to apply the ditra mat and then 1-2 days later used the TEC Full Flex modified thin set to apply the tiles tot he ditramat. The next day he grouted. From what I am reading this is completely bad practice. That things should have been cured more slowly, that unmodified thin set should have been used over the ditra. What do I do!?!? We have already had three rooms and thousands of dollars of materials installed. I feel like major panic is setting in. Please help.

Featured Answer

User

9 years ago

last modified: 9 years ago

His installation methodology should have been verified during the interview phase by the GC. And if the GC had concerns about it, he should have broached the subject of following the manufacturer's requirements in the contract, or just not hired him. Then closely supervise the initial phases of work. Not get it half done and contemplate a tearout situation.

17 years of doing it wrong just means that it's harder than ever to teach an old dog new tricks. If he refuses to read the manufacturer's instructions on the website, or to watch the YouTube videos, then your best bet is to arrange a conference call consult from the manufacturer's rep by phone or in person with you and the GC being party to the call.

If none of that makes any dent in his installation methods, then your GC has to either accept the incorrect work and warrant it himself, or fire him and hire someone else to redo it on his dime. It was up to the GC to verify that the work met the TCNA standard and followed all of the manufacturer's requirements.

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Comments (7)

housebuilding126
Original Author
9 years ago
While I agree with all of this, is this common practice everywhere? I trust the GC we have hired and he is reputable in our area and highly recommended. I just got off the phone with him and he says there is nothing wrong with the way it was installed. He stands with the contractor. What am I supposed to do as a homeowner? They made a comment about me thinking I know their job better than they do because of the internet while they have 17 years of experience and no failed tile jobs....what is a homeowner to do? This will affect way more than the tile. All the cabinets and custom woodwork will need to be ripped out too. This will delay our project by another 2 months at least. What will happen if we don't rip it out? At this point, it is not about the principle of doing it right or wrong, it is about what will happen long term? Is this catastrophic?
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User
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Talk to the Schluter rep. NOW. They are very helpful. They will tell you that the use of their product cannot be warrantied when it is not installed to their specs. If your GC refuses to hire subs that work to industry standards, then you either walk away, if he is the landowner and holding the mortgage, or fire him, if you own the property. Or you accept crappy work that may fail sooner rather than later.

This is a bigger issue for your job site than just the tile.
housebuilding126
Original Author
9 years ago
Any tile experts have an opinion on this? When it is your own home and your family is depending on this or you will be scrambling to find a place to live in the dead of winter, it is just not that easy to just walk away.
User
9 years ago
What does your contract say about installing to manufacturer and industry standards? If your GC and tile sub are in violation of the contract, and refuse to rectify, then the only recourse is to cease their employment.

Combined with the other issues that the build has had, the "come to Jesus meeting" should have occurred long before now. It is obvious that the GC is an ongoing issue. Your money pays for excellent work just as well as substandard work. Find someone who will give you excellent work. Accepting sub standard work should not even be an option. You will only get worse and worse. It never gets better.
geoffrey_b
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
It's done. It hasn't failed. You're not going to make him rip out what's done. If you don't pay - he will either file a lien or sue you.
PRO
Avanti Tile & Stone / Stonetech
9 years ago
Interesting, but in Europe, Schluter is more forgiving of modified mortars than here. Why? I dunno. Modified mortars require air to cure....unmodifieds hydrate with water and cure more rapidly. Modifieds, when placed between two non-permeable products (Tile and Ditra) take far longer to set up and cure than unmodifieds as air can only enter thru the grout joints. A tile installed thusly may still appear "fresh" near the center if removed even several weeks later.

The Long and Short of it is that, if the material was installed with good coverage, it should hold up just fine...just much longer to fully cure, and there is the issue of the warranty, of course..............